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Avestan and Vedic   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #4523 of 9415 |
Re: Avestan and Vedic

Similarly, Mittani Indo-Aryan language is considered older than Vedic
or Avestan because it has aika instead of eka. Vedic is supposed to
have merged 'ai' to 'e', hence younger. But at the same time Mittani
contains satta for seven that corresponds to sound changes in
prakrits, which is much later than Vedic. But lingusists somehow came
to the conclusion that Mittani Aryan was older than Vedic. They also
base their conclusion based on one or two words and take that one
word as a proof of their assumption while ignoring others.

regards,
Mandar

--- In IndiaArchaeology@yahoogroups.com, "raonath" <raonath@...>
wrote:
>
> --- In IndiaArchaeology@yahoogroups.com, "munnubanerjee"
> <munnubanerjee@> wrote:
> > witzel claims that
> > dialects at peripheries of liguistic family distribution are
usually
> > more innovative then the ones at the center.
>
> There are quite a few IE-ists who claim that the center is
> more innovative than the periphery. You will find such claims
> in the cybalist (on Yahoo groups). I don't know if either one
> has empirical support.
>
> To go back to the question of innovations in Vedic vs Avestan:
> If language A is in all respects more innovative than B, it is
> likely that A evolved from B. In case of sister branches in IE,
> it is always the case that one "preserves" some traits more
> than the other. ["preserves" is in quotation marks because there
> may be changes but starting from a more archaic point.] Thus,
> in Sanskrit word-medial consonsnat clusters are generally
> better preserved, but word-final clusters are drastically
> simplified (compared to Greek and some extent Avestan).
> Iranian (including Avestan) merge *d and *dh (for example),
> but Sanskrit merges *g^ (>z in Avestan) and j from the secod
> palatalization. It is impossible to use these things for
> dating.
>
> Nath Rao
>





Sun Jan 14, 2007 3:30 pm

ayachitman
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Message #4523 of 9415 |
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Avestan and Vedic are obviously twin languages. Notice the similarity from Avesta to Sanskrit in the sample below: tem amavantem yazatem surem damohu seviytem ...
Ram Varmha
varmha
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Jan 8, 2007
6:25 pm

... creatures, I will worship with libations'. ... This is "trick" linguistics, used often to "prove" languages are related. If the sample given above could be...
Paul Kekai Manansala
pinatubo.geo
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Jan 8, 2007
10:51 pm

Attached below is a link to Avestan dictionary. Even those with a nodding acquaintance with Vedic/Sanskrit can find a significant list of word-cognates between...
Ram Varmha
varmha
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Jan 9, 2007
8:26 pm

... nodding acquaintance with Vedic/Sanskrit can find a significant list of word-cognates between Avesta and Vedic/ Sanskrit; some words being exactly the same...
Paul Kekai Manansala
pinatubo.geo
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Jan 9, 2007
11:16 pm

What are the basic grammatical differences between Avesta and Vedic? The best one I could find on the web is the following: ...
Ram Varmha
varmha
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Jan 11, 2007
8:14 pm

... For info on Old Avestan: http://www.utexas.edu/cola/centers/lrc/eieol/aveol-TC-R.html Regards, Paul Kekai Manansala Quests of the Dragon and Bird Clan ...
Paul Kekai Manansala
pinatubo.geo
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Jan 12, 2007
6:32 am

Here is an "old" text on Avesta grammar and comparison with Sanskrit. http://www.avesta.org/kanga/grammar_opf_files/ Ram ... For info on Old Avestan: ...
Ram Varmha
varmha
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Jan 13, 2007
11:39 pm

Not entirely on topic, but in some parts of Rajasthan (limited to what I know of), replacing S with H is prevalent even today! -- jaju...
Ravindra Jaju
ravindrajaju
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Jan 9, 2007
8:26 pm

I have noticed this in assamese also. I dont know if its possible to designate vedic as being older than avestan based on one trait. vedic may prserve some...
munnubanerjee
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Jan 13, 2007
11:43 pm

... There are quite a few IE-ists who claim that the center is more innovative than the periphery. You will find such claims in the cybalist (on Yahoo groups)....
raonath
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Jan 14, 2007
1:56 am

Similarly, Mittani Indo-Aryan language is considered older than Vedic or Avestan because it has aika instead of eka. Vedic is supposed to have merged 'ai' to...
ayachitman
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Jan 15, 2007
5:18 am

... Seems like a pretty standard approach in proving one's point in such (may I call it) speculative science fields. Unlike pure sciences, deviations can be...
Ravindra Jaju
ravindrajaju
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Jan 15, 2007
7:27 pm

... That vowel merger is an the gypsey language behaves in an opposite manner) which is itself based on another dubious theory of reconstructing laryngeals...
mkelkar2003
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Jan 15, 2007
7:27 pm

... My belief based on discussion on the old ANE list is that no Mitanni or Near East specialists believe in 'Mitanni Aryan' anymore. It's mainly...
Paul Kekai Manansala
pinatubo.geo
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Jan 15, 2007
7:31 pm

Minor mittani aryan presence among majority hurrian speaking must have been blown out of proportion by IEists. But that does not mean we have to swing the oher...
munnubanerjee
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Jan 17, 2007
3:47 am

... I don't agree. There never was really any argument for an "Aryan" presence in Mitanni. The linguistic evidence was always very weak, but the conjecture...
Paul Kekai Manansala
pinatubo.geo
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Jan 18, 2007
12:43 am

... The linguistic evidence for Mitanni Indo-Aryan -- i.e., an Old Indo- Aryan language spoken by a section, no matter how small that was, of the population of...
Francesco Brighenti
frabrig
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Jan 19, 2007
6:38 am

... This is not a "conjecture" -- check ... Indeed it is only conjecture. The Mitanni literature itself makes no mention of "Aryans" and as I've stated,...
Paul Kekai Manansala
pinatubo.geo
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Jan 19, 2007
7:31 pm

... I do not know what "widely accepted scholarly paradigm" is being referred to here. Horses were introduced to the near east by Hurrians not the Mittani and...
mkelkar2003
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Jan 21, 2007
12:24 am

... Did I hold that Indo-Aryan speakers living in the Kingdom of Mitanni *introduced* horses in Syria/N. Mesopotamia? I confined myself to saying that "there...
Francesco Brighenti
frabrig
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Jan 22, 2007
1:06 am

... Speaking of Mittani "Indo-Aryans": They have closer connection with Pakistan/India than to a presumed non demonstrable connection with Central Asia. Check...
mkelkar2003
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Jan 23, 2007
5:08 am

... The connection of the Mitanni-IA linguistic element with Central Asia (more exactly, with the BMAC area in the centuries after the decline of that culture...
Francesco Brighenti
frabrig
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Jan 23, 2007
6:40 pm

... That is exactly what I mean. It is a *presumed* relation based on linguistic reconstrcution and a hypothetical group of "Indo-Iranians" that no one can...
mkelkar2003
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Jan 24, 2007
9:55 pm

... "Mitanni Indo-Aryans' expertise as charioteers and horse trainers ... You are holding that Mitanni "Indo-Aryans' expertise as charioteers was no doubt...
mkelkar2003
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Jan 23, 2007
5:09 am

Commenting on some discussion on the time frame of RV and Avesta, Rajesh Kochchar writes http://acorn.nationalinterest.in/?p=2249#comment-94190 While...
JK
tiptronicus
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Jan 24, 2007
10:04 pm
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