Search the web
Sign In
New User? Sign Up
MEG_builders · The MEG builders group
? Already a member? Sign in to Yahoo!

Yahoo! Groups Tips

Did you know...
Message search is now enhanced, find messages faster. Take it for a spin.

Best of Y! Groups

   Check them out and nominate your group.
Having problems with message search? Fill out this form to ensure your group is one of the first to be migrated to the new message search system.

Messages

  Messages Help
Advanced
Results from a new A-Theory   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #1208 of 1374 |
Re: [MEG_builders] Results from a new A-Theory

David,

Nice test report. Will take some time to digest your findings. Keep up the
good work!

Jon

----- Original Message -----
From: "davidj95650" <djenkins@...>
To: <MEG_builders@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, November 03, 2003 10:44 AM
Subject: [MEG_builders] Results from a new A-Theory


> In their rebuttal to the critics of their original paper, "Further
> Considerations on Electromagnetic Potentials in the Quantum Theory",
> Physical Review, August 15, 1961, Aharonov and Bohm state that a
> moving electron will have a back-reaction on to a source of A
> (magnetic vector potential). Unfortunately they did not further
> explain this back-reaction. After posting my message (MEG_builders
> message #1204, Sep 11, 2003) about the convective derivative, how
> the velocity of charge is affected by it's motion through a gradient
> of A, I wanted to observe some change in the magnetic field of an
> output coil which may be caused by such a condition. I built a
> transformer on a nanocrystalline core with small "sense" coils at
> the base of the output coil. Two sense coils are on the outside of
> the leg of the core, two others are in the interior space of the
> core.
>
> See the bitmap image, "ACoreTst1.bmp".
> Go to "Files" then go to the folder "MESSAGE ATTACHMENTS", go
> to the folder "Results from a new A-Theory", and open
> "AcoreTst1.bmp".
>
> The basic core is a Honeywell AMCC-320, cut core (The core has
> been cleanly cut into two halves. Uncut cores can be purchased
> also, and will have lower reluctance because there is no gap from
> the cut). Honeywell cores can be purchased from Eastern Components,
> www.eastern-components.com.
>
> Spaced from the core by 0.02-inch-thick tape, the ferrite sense
> coils are placed at the side and the center of the leg of the main
> core. This was to provide an indication of any differences between
> the outside edge of the output coil and its center. Above the
> sense coils is a sheet of 0.002-inch thick brass which acts as a
> shield to any electrical field between the output coil and the sense
> coils. (Typically the output coil operates at several hundred volts
> peak, and coupling of that voltage into the sense coils could mask
> measurements of the magnetic field.) The ends of this shield layer
> are insulated from one-another to prevent it from becoming a
> shorted turn which of course would kill the transformer action.
>
> There is another layer of 0.02-inch tape over the brass shield
> to reduce the capacitance between it and the output coil. The
> output coil is a bifilar (two wires in parallel) winding of #23
> enamel-coated magnet wire, of 23 bifilar turns per layer, with
> a 0.006-inch layer of teflon tape between the winding layers.
> There are a total of 13 layers for a total of 299 bifilar turns.
> Then end of one bifilar wire is connected to the start of the
> other wire to provide an effective total of 598 turns. At the
> junction of the two wires, a capacitor can be placed to adjust
> the series-resonant frequency so that different operating
> frequencies can be tested (This series resonance is between the
> transformed capacitance of the output coil and the leakage
> inductance of the drive coil).
>
> In the illustration, a permanent magnet is shown. Tests
> were made with and without a stack of Neodymium magnets to note
> any differences.
>
> The outside sense coils are in a region where there is only
> one contribution to the A-field, from the leg of the core. The
> other sense coils are in the interior space of the core where
> there are contributions from the top, bottom, and the leg of
> the core. The magnetic-vector-potentials are additive, in
> accordance with the usual vector addition (direction and
> amplitude are equally important).
>
> See the bitmap image, "AgradCor1.bmp".
> Go to "Files" then go to the folder "MESSAGE ATTACHMENTS", go
> to the folder "Results from a new A-Theory", and open
> "AgradCor1.bmp".
>
> The image illustrates the A-potential vectors as I visualize
> them around the nanocrystalline core. This drawing was to
> illustrate the static A from a permanent magnet, but it also is
> true for the dA/dt when the core is used as a transformer. In the
> case of the dA/dt, there are only three contributions to the A in
> the interior of the core space, A from the magnet is ignored.
>
> I had anticipated that where the A-potential was greatest, there
> would be the greatest B-field reaction from the electrons moving
> in the coil. Instead what I find is that the volume where the
> A-potential is weakest (outside the core leg), has the greatest
> B-field from the output coil. I'm cetain I'm observing the
> B-field, and it is solely from the current in the output coil.
> This was verified by driving the core at low frequencies where the
> drive coil would magnetize the core significantly, but little
> resonant current and only load current would occur in the output
> coil. The jpeg, "AllSigsLowFreq.jpg", illustrates this. This
> image is in the folder "Results from a new A-Theory".
>
> Channel 1 of the oscilloscope is connected to the side-mounted
> sense coil on the outside of the core leg, channel 2 is connected to
> the side-mounted sense coil on the interior side of the core leg,
> channel 3 is the timing clock from the drive-coil logic, and channel
> 4 is connected to the output coil through a 200:1 voltage divider.
> There is a simple R-C filter on the sense coil outputs to linearize
> their response with frequency so that the voltage indications at
> different frequencies will be proportional to the magnetic field,
> and not the frequency. The top trace is the clock for the drive-
> coil controller and its leading-edge indicates the beginning of a
> cycle. Digital logic makes each phase of the drive signal about 49%
> of the period, which provides a square wave to the drive coil.
> Channel 1's trace is just below the square-wave of the driver-
> controller signal, and ranges from about 3.3 divisions above the
> bottom of the screen to about 6.7 divisions. Thus the peak-to-peak
> signal is about 3.4 divisions at 50 mV/division for an amplitude of
> 170 mV. Channel 2's trace ranges from just about 0.3 division above
> the bottom to about 3.9 divisions at 20 mV/division for an amplitude
> of 78 mV. The output voltage ranges from 2.8 divisions to 5.1
> divisions at 200 volts/division for an amplitude of 460 volts. Thus
> the ratio of voltages between the two sense coils is 170/78 which is
> 2.2 to 1. NOTE: the notation at the bottom of the screen says
> 800VP-P and was for a different measurement and is in error for this
> measurement. The load on the output coil was 15k ohms. Also, only
> one wind of the bifilar coil was used, so that resonance of the
> output coil would be at a frequency much higher than the operating
> frequency for this test. I didn't want resonance effects to
> interfere with the transformer action.
>
> The image, "AllSigsHiFreq.jpg", in the folder "Results from a new
> A-Theory", illustrates the output coil operating in series resonance
> with the drive-coil. A 500 pF capacitor and 2.2 mH inductor are in
> series between the end of one bifilar wire and the start of the
> other. The 2.2 mH inductor was placed to allow higher frequency
> effects such as the Lenz pulse to occur more easily (less capacitive
> loading of the core). Note that the channel 1 and 2 sensitivities
> have been changed significantly. Channel 1's signal now ranges from
> 3.5 divisions to 6.5 divisions at 200 mV/division for a total
> amplitude of 600 mV peak-to-peak. Channel 2's signal ranges from 0.8
> divisions to 3.2 divisions for an amplitude of 240 mV. The ratio of
> the two sense coils is 2.5 to 1. The output coil amplitude is now
> 6 divisions at 200 volts/division for a total amplitude of 1,200 volts
> peak-to-peak. As noted on the screen, there is a 60k ohm load
> connected to the output coil.
>
> NOTE: the sense-coil signals are shifted (delayed) about 90
> degrees (1/4 cycle) due to the R-C filters. Without the R-C filters,
> the signals from the sense-coils are in phase with the output voltage,
> as they should be, but then high-frequency artifacts appear stronger
> than they are in reality.
>
> The image "CoreBuildUp.jpg", in the folder "Results from a new A-
> Theory", shows the built-up core. There are two drive coils in place
> to try different resonance frequencies because the leakage inductance
> will change based on the length of the magnetic path from the drive
> coil to the output coil. The output coil being tested is on the
> right-hand side of the image, where the coaxial-cable connections to
> two of the sense coils can be seen. The output coil on the left has
> the connections to each layer brought out so that experiments can be
> performed with different total turns in its circuit.
>
> A note about the drive circuit: it is composed of four MOSFETs in
> a bridge configuration so that the full supply voltage can be applied
> across the drive coil for each phase of the drive. For this test,
> it's only function is to provide a variable-frequency square wave to
> the drive coil to provide large values of dB/dt in the core, and
> consequent large values of dA/dt outside the core. A simplified
> circuit diagram can be seen in the image "TestCir1.bmp", in the
> folder "Results from a new A-Theory".
>
> The ratio of measured B-field inside the output coil is close to
> the 3:1 value of the A strength ratios in my idealization. Why they
> are not precisely 3:1 is probably due to the fact that I have
> approximated the A values, and because A is not blocked by the core
> (or any other physical matter) there are some vectorial subtractions
> occurring due to vectors interfering around the output coil which
> results in less than a 3:1 ratio occurring.
>
> By the way, the addition of the permanent magnet to the core
> did not change the ratio significantly and I have not made precise
> measurements of its impact at this time. The difference in ratio
> may have been 10%, not a lot compared to the basic ratio. The
> images in this report are those with the magnet in place.
>
> Also, there was no significant difference in signal level
> between the sense-coils on the outside of the leg versus
> those at the center.
>
> To help eliminate experimental error, I built an entirely
> different configuration, on an AMCC-1000 uncut core, which is
> dramatically different in size from the AMCC-320. The sense-
> coils are also very different in size. The effect is
> repeatable as the measured ratio between outside and interior
> of the core is 3.2:1 which is close to that reported here.
>
> A symmetrically wound coil will have a reasonably uniform
> magnetic field at points that are symmetrically similar. (The
> field distribution in a rectangular shape is not uniform, although
> at symmetric points around the center of the shape the field will
> be the same.) This experiment indicates to me that the magnetic
> vector potential is real, as theorized by Aharonov and Bohm, and
> that we have not fully exploited it as yet.
>
> David J.
>
> Files:
> ACoreTst1.bmp
> AgradCor1.bmp
> AllSigsLowFreq.jpg
> AllSigsHiFreq.jpg
> CoreBuildUp.jpg
> TestCir1.bmp





Tue Nov 4, 2003 1:26 am

partzman2001
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email

Forward
Message #1208 of 1374 |
Expand Messages Author Sort by Date

In their rebuttal to the critics of their original paper, "Further Considerations on Electromagnetic Potentials in the Quantum Theory", Physical Review, August...
davidj95650
Offline Send Email
Nov 3, 2003
5:27 pm

David, Nice test report. Will take some time to digest your findings. Keep up the good work! Jon ... From: "davidj95650" <djenkins@...> To:...
jonfli
partzman2001
Offline Send Email
Nov 4, 2003
1:29 am

The possible mechanism on how the Meg actually works, I believe, is described in this 1998 patent WO9840960: http://l2.espacenet.com/espacenet/bnsviewer? ...
carbonprobe
Offline Send Email
Nov 6, 2003
1:13 am

David, In the photo of your MEG there are flat pieces of metal in between your magnets to make the stack fit inside the core. This causes fringing B-fields...
carbonprobe
Offline Send Email
Nov 7, 2003
6:35 am

Hi Ken, On a third build-up of this type of test set-up, I measured the leakage flux around the magnet stack and especially near the transformer-laminations...
davidj95650
Offline Send Email
Nov 8, 2003
4:42 pm
Advanced

Copyright © 2009 Yahoo! Inc. All rights reserved.
Privacy Policy - Terms of Service - Guidelines - Help