I would trust the process of natural selection to
evolve the eye to it's most practical form.  If we
now see the "visible" spectrum it must be because that was the
most practical and available portion of the spectrum
that living tissue could respond to.

About the color the eye is most sensitive to:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luminosity_function

Which says that in low light -- like under the surface of
the ocean -- the eye's sensitivity shifts toward blue-green.

But I saw another wiki article that agreed that 550nm is the
frequency of best response.

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Eyesensitivity.png

Imagine that there is controversy about this ????

Erik Krause wrote:
> Am 27.09.2010 23:40, schrieb John Riley:
>> Sure, those types of electromagnetic waves have always been around!
>> Radio waves and microwaves are part of the background noise of the
>> universe and emitted by lots of things in addition to being the echo
>> of the Big Bang.
>
> But apparently they neither carried useful information nor where they
> strong enough to feed anything.
>

Am 28.09.2010 19:30, schrieb Ken Warner:
> About the color the eye is most sensitive to:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luminosity_function
>
> Which says that in low light -- like under the surface of
> the ocean -- the eye's sensitivity shifts toward blue-green.

That's true. Yes, low-light sensitivity is something different. You can
see it if your'e out at dawn and have something blue and yellow with you
(a good example is the Langenscheid L:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Langenscheidt ). The yellow gets darker and
darker when light fades but the blue stays relatively bright...

It's the rod cells that are responsible for that. They don't allow the
perception of color but they can sense a single photon (something CCD
and CMOS sensor makers dream of).

> But I saw another wiki article that agreed that 550nm is the
> frequency of best response.
>
> http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Eyesensitivity.png

This is photoptic vision. The cone cells allow perception of colors but
are 100 times less sensitive to light...

--
Erik Krause
http://www.erik-krause.de

Hi all,

I need to do the hugin Exposure tab by command line.

On the Exposure tab I do:
Tick all:
Exposure, Vignetting, Vignetting Center, Camera Response.
Click "Optimise now!".

How can I rebuild this functionality either by command line or by Perl
panotools?

Thanks,
Jan

--
http://www.DIY-streetview.org


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Peter,

Nice project.

Could you give us a comparison? What is the size of the object movie in
MB and what would it be as a simple cylindrical VR. Also, what are the
dimensions in pixels? I'm trying to understand how much more it takes in
resources to make stereo VR vs a standard one.

You weren't happy with the smoothness of the playback and feel the CPU
was the bottleneck. What CPU are you using. i.e. could you have used
something much better and gotten better results or are you at the limit
of technology currently?

I think stereo could be a major feature in the future so I find this
quite interesting.

Scott

On 9/27/2010 7:01 PM, panovrx wrote:
> http://www.mediavr.com/formkiosk.jpg
>
> Here is a stereo panorama kiosk I made recently.

--
Scott Witte

<http://www.scottwitte.com>
<http://www.tourdeforce360.com>
414.345.9660
Member, IVRPA



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Scott Witte <scottw@...> wrote:

> Could you give us a comparison? What is the size of the object movie in
> MB and what would it be as a simple cylindrical VR. Also, what are the
> dimensions in pixels? I'm trying to understand how much more it takes in
> resources to make stereo VR vs a standard one.
>
> You weren't happy with the smoothness of the playback and feel the CPU
> was the bottleneck. What CPU are you using. i.e. could you have used
> something much better and gotten better results or are you at the limit
> of technology currently?
>
There are lots of ways of showing stereo panoramas but I used object movies
because the PC I could use was kind of old and I wanted to used interlaced
frames because that was what the monitor supported. Each object movie (90 frames
1920*1080) was about 20 meg. It was smooth enough but not like butter like we
expect now with regular panos.

Other ways include the glpanorama stereo player
http://www.gali-3d.com/archive/articles/VFX3D_headtracking/Headtracking.php
which is quite fast for interlaced panoramas even on old hardware but it has
interface issues for a kiosk

Then you could use anaglyph panoramas where there are no hardware restrictions.

It is possible to do interlaced Flash panos directly as a user on the Pano2VR
forum has shown but he has not released his scripting and it seemed a little
slow.

Other methods include using hardware OpenGl stereo hardware and shutter glasses
and players like BSContact Stereo (which supports stereo textures in 3d worlds),
or you can use Director and output side by side synced panoramas on a double
width desktop and send the monitor output to two polarized projectors showing on
a silver screen.
Both are fine for stereo panoramas on modern hardware but have various issues
for public kiosks.

Peter M

On Tue 28-Sep-2010 at 13:19 -0600, Jan Martin wrote:
>
>On the Exposure tab I do:
>Tick all:
>Exposure, Vignetting, Vignetting Center, Camera Response.
>Click "Optimise now!".
>
>How can I rebuild this functionality either by command line or by Perl
>panotools?

You can do it with autooptimiser or vig_optimize.

--
Bruno

I'm Kent Morrison, a fairly recent pano geek and a fairly old computer geek.

Just checking in, web group fashion, as I'll not be getting the emails day to
day.

Here's what I've been working on for some months now, every few days I add
another variant of demo using Google Earth plugin.

http://www.steamboat3d.com/index.php/elk-mtn

I've been working with linux for years, for servers, but just now getting into
this facet of linux graphics software, and really having fun.

Also, you'll see a lot of cathedrals and skyscrapers in Google Earth, but my
specialty is barns:

http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/cldetails?mid=a301a6683e3c0a8c6147c588289\
5b2cb&prevstart=0

-------

Hope to get to know some of you, looking forward to learning from this group.

Regards,
ixboat
aka
Kent Morrison

Interesting stuff !

best
AYRTON

On Tue, Sep 28, 2010 at 10:30 PM, kentm <kentmorrison@...> wrote:

> I'm Kent Morrison, a fairly recent pano geek and a fairly old computer
> geek.
>
> Just checking in, web group fashion, as I'll not be getting the emails day
> to day.
>
> Here's what I've been working on for some months now, every few days I add
> another variant of demo using Google Earth plugin.
>
> http://www.steamboat3d.com/index.php/elk-mtn
>
> I've been working with linux for years, for servers, but just now getting
> into this facet of linux graphics software, and really having fun.
>
> Also, you'll see a lot of cathedrals and skyscrapers in Google Earth, but
> my specialty is barns:
>
>
>
http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/cldetails?mid=a301a6683e3c0a8c6147c588289\
5b2cb&prevstart=0
>
> -------
>
> Hope to get to know some of you, looking forward to learning from this
> group.
>
> Regards,
> ixboat
> aka
> Kent Morrison
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> --
>
>
>
>


--

+ 55 21 9982 6313 - RIO
+ 55 11 3717 5131 - SP
http://ayrton360.com
twitter.com/ayrton360


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Announcing SaladoPlayer v0.5

- fixed critical bug
- better buttons and keys movement
- more interface customization
- included many new examples

http://panozona.com/wiki/

Your work is highly appreciated and welcomed since the original PanoSalado2
project seems abounded or paused. If memory management while loaded in another
swf is working too, it will be very nice for those of us who need 100% control
over our flash applications.

John Myrstad

--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "mstandio" <mstandio@...> wrote:
>
> Announcing SaladoPlayer v0.5
>
> - fixed critical bug
> - better buttons and keys movement
> - more interface customization
> - included many new examples
>
> http://panozona.com/wiki/
>

Great!  Thanks for doing this!  The only downside to your hard work and new
versions is that I need to make small tweaks to my HTML/XML each time to keep it
working with the new version :)

I just sold my little Fuji compact last week.  Today I got a ridiculously
good price on an fc-e8.  I just put in a stupid low bid that I knew wouldn't
win the fisheye -- wait for it -- I won it!

Anybody have a cheap LX3 for sale -- I mean CHEAP?

I do a lot of sphericals with 35mm and the best lens so far is my old Zeiss
Distagon 35/2,8 which you can get pretty cheap on ebay.

I shoot 3 rows of 12 +z +n. The horizontal overlap is quite enough because there
is little vignetting. Only with the zenith shot I sometimes get a visible seem
in blue skies which can be a pain to retouch. But I am always to lazy to shoot
more images ;)

I should try to take one of those indoors, the level of detail is amazing and
the DOF could be enough to get everything sharp on normal tripod heights without
stacking.

Cheers
Jürgen



--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Bostjan Burger <si_lander@...> wrote:
>
> Andrew, it is a good resolution of the taken VRP. Does anyone have an
experience
> with Canon EF 17-40 F/4 L USM , which is exactly the half of the price of
16-35
> 2.8 ? I think that F2.8 comparing to F4 doesn't play so much better as this
> lense is for the use of pano head, but I wonder what is the difference with
the
> sharpness?
>
> :) Bostjan
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

What're the NPP measurements for the Zeiss? I'm curious to know how they
compare to the 16-35 (one being a zoom an the other a prime).

Cheers.

Sent from HTC Hero. Please excuse typos.

On Sep 30, 2010 7:40 AM, "jrgen_schrader" <panorama@...> wrote:

I do a lot of sphericals with 35mm and the best lens so far is my old Zeiss
Distagon 35/2,8 which you can get pretty cheap on ebay.

I shoot 3 rows of 12 +z +n. The horizontal overlap is quite enough because
there is little vignetting. Only with the zenith shot I sometimes get a
visible seem in blue skies which can be a pain to retouch. But I am always
to lazy to shoot more images ;)

I should try to take one of those indoors, the level of detail is amazing
and the DOF could be enough to get everything sharp on normal tripod heights
without stacking.

Cheers
Jürgen

--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Bostjan Burger <si_lander@...> wrote: >
> Andrew, it is a goo...


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I use a Samyang 8mm with 4+up+down. What is the best way to get the sharpest DOF
for my 360 spherical panos?

På Thu, 30 Sep 2010 14:19:02 +0200, skrev gregoryv92821
<gregvoisan@...>:

> I use a Samyang 8mm with 4+up+down. What is the best way to get the
> sharpest DOF for my 360 spherical panos?

Use f8, 11 or 16.
The higher-f/smaller aperture the more DOF, but you start losing some
general sharpness due to diffraction.

--
Bjørn K Nilssen - http://bknilssen.no - 3D and panoramas.

--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "gregoryv92821" <gregvoisan@...> wrote:
>
> I use a Samyang 8mm with 4+up+down. What is the best way to get the sharpest
DOF for my 360 spherical panos?
>

Set the lens at  full aperture. Set focus at 1.5m. Shoot some testshots to check
that it is sharp from 0.7 to infinity.

If it is OK just Tape it or just remember to always shoot at 1.5m.
You can now use it at any aperture and you have minimum sharpness from 0.7m

Also do some testshots at F5.6 and F8 and see how much  it improves in sharpness
especially at the edges..

Hans

--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Ken Warner <kwarner000@...> wrote:
>
> I just sold my little Fuji compact last week.  Today I got a ridiculously
> good price on an fc-e8.  I just put in a stupid low bid that I knew wouldn't
> win the fisheye -- wait for it -- I won it!
>
> Anybody have a cheap LX3 for sale -- I mean CHEAP?
>
I didn't realize that it was practical for the FC-E8 to attach to anything other
than the original Nikon Coolpix line!  I own two of those fisheyes myself -- one
I bought at full price, and the other I got as part of a 'combo' CP4500 package
that a guy was selling on eBay years ago.  I have stopped using it for panos,
but it is still a great fisheye lens for making 'full-sky' (cloud) movies at
720p or 1080p.

It can work.  Depends on the lens and the camera attached to.
I had a similar fisheye attachment lens on my Fuji e900.  Wasn't
a great image.  Soft and a fair amount of roll off at the edges.
But I could get a half way reasonable result if I worked at post
processing long enough.

http://pancyl.com/McLeodLake.html

6 + Z + N with a Soligor/IPIX fisheye.

Darren wrote:
>
> --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Ken Warner <kwarner000@...> wrote:
>> I just sold my little Fuji compact last week.  Today I got a ridiculously
>> good price on an fc-e8.  I just put in a stupid low bid that I knew wouldn't
>> win the fisheye -- wait for it -- I won it!
>>
>> Anybody have a cheap LX3 for sale -- I mean CHEAP?
>>
> I didn't realize that it was practical for the FC-E8 to attach to anything
other than the original Nikon Coolpix line!  I own two of those fisheyes myself
-- one I bought at full price, and the other I got as part of a 'combo' CP4500
package that a guy was selling on eBay years ago.  I have stopped using it for
panos, but it is still a great fisheye lens for making 'full-sky' (cloud) movies
at 720p or 1080p.
>
>

What a coincidence...
My Samyang is not sharp at these recommended settings no matter what aperture I
use. Is there something I'm overlooking?
I wish I could upload images.

A Kielcz

Cincinnati, Ohio, U.S.A.

--- On Thu, 9/30/10, Hans <hans@...> wrote:

From: Hans <hans@...>
Subject: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Sharp DOF in 360 spherical pano
To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, September 30, 2010, 8:43 AM







 













--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "gregoryv92821" <gregvoisan@...> wrote:

>

> I use a Samyang 8mm with 4+up+down. What is the best way to get the sharpest
DOF for my 360 spherical panos?

>



Set the lens at  full aperture. Set focus at 1.5m. Shoot some testshots to check
that it is sharp from 0.7 to infinity.



If it is OK just Tape it or just remember to always shoot at 1.5m.

You can now use it at any aperture and you have minimum sharpness from 0.7m



Also do some testshots at F5.6 and F8 and see how much  it improves in sharpness
especially at the edges..



Hans

























[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Actually I did upload my Samyang 8mm pictures for your viewing here.
Thank you!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/aak071946/sets/72157625068649484/

A Kielcz

Cincinnati, Ohio, U.S.A.

--- On Thu, 9/30/10, Hans <hans@...> wrote:

From: Hans <hans@...>
Subject: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Sharp DOF in 360 spherical pano
To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, September 30, 2010, 8:43 AM







 













--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "gregoryv92821" <gregvoisan@...> wrote:

>

> I use a Samyang 8mm with 4+up+down. What is the best way to get the sharpest
DOF for my 360 spherical panos?

>



Set the lens at  full aperture. Set focus at 1.5m. Shoot some testshots to check
that it is sharp from 0.7 to infinity.



If it is OK just Tape it or just remember to always shoot at 1.5m.

You can now use it at any aperture and you have minimum sharpness from 0.7m



Also do some testshots at F5.6 and F8 and see how much  it improves in sharpness
especially at the edges..



Hans

























[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Ken Warner <kwarner000@...> wrote:
>
> It can work.  Depends on the lens and the camera attached to.
> I had a similar fisheye attachment lens on my Fuji e900.  Wasn't
> a great image.  Soft and a fair amount of roll off at the edges.
> But I could get a half way reasonable result if I worked at post
> processing long enough.
>
> http://pancyl.com/McLeodLake.html
>
> 6 + Z + N with a Soligor/IPIX fisheye.
>

Very nice pano! I never did anything except 'circular fisheye' panos with my
FC-E8 (2 or 3 shots total), so I never got the hi-res that you did with your
'6+Z+N' stuff :)

Thanks, doing my best.
You should just try it out and either become satisfied with results, or you
could help to find possible errors and therefore adjust quality of code.

Marek


--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "johnmyrstad" <johnmyrstad@...> wrote:
>
> Your work is highly appreciated and welcomed since the original PanoSalado2
project seems abounded or paused. If memory management while loaded in another
swf is working too, it will be very nice for those of us who need 100% control
over our flash applications.
>
> John Myrstad
>

--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, A Kielcz <roblee007@...> wrote:
>
> Actually I did upload my Samyang 8mm pictures for your viewing here.
> Thank you!
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/aak071946/sets/72157625068649484/

You can not evaluate anything from that size.

You need a full resolution image

Hans




>
> A Kielcz
>
> Cincinnati, Ohio, U.S.A.
>
> --- On Thu, 9/30/10, Hans <hans@...> wrote:
>
> From: Hans <hans@...>
> Subject: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Sharp DOF in 360 spherical pano
> To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Thursday, September 30, 2010, 8:43 AM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "gregoryv92821" <gregvoisan@> wrote:
>
> >
>
> > I use a Samyang 8mm with 4+up+down. What is the best way to get the sharpest
DOF for my 360 spherical panos?
>
> >
>
>
>
> Set the lens at  full aperture. Set focus at 1.5m. Shoot some testshots to
check that it is sharp from 0.7 to infinity.
>
>
>
> If it is OK just Tape it or just remember to always shoot at 1.5m.
>
> You can now use it at any aperture and you have minimum sharpness from 0.7m
>
>
>
> Also do some testshots at F5.6 and F8 and see how much  it improves in
sharpness especially at the edges..
>
>
>
> Hans
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

sorry obout that, everything prior to 1.0 is considered more or less beta, and
it still may change. I think current configuration state is pretty close to its
final form and there may be just some small details left to change. Will heve
this documented on wiki whenever I will find some free time for this.


> Great!  Thanks for doing this!  The only downside to your hard work and new
versions is that I need to make small tweaks to my HTML/XML each time to keep it
working with the new version :)
>


--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Darren" <darethehair@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "mstandio" <mstandio@> wrote:
> >
> > Announcing SaladoPlayer v0.5
> >
> > - fixed critical bug
> > - better buttons and keys movement
> > - more interface customization
> > - included many new examples
> >
> > http://panozona.com/wiki/
> >
>

OK, I uploaded bigger images. Hope you can tell now.
Thank you!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/aak071946/sets/72157625069438228/

A Kielcz

Cincinnati, Ohio, U.S.A.

--- On Thu, 9/30/10, Hans <hans@...> wrote:

From: Hans <hans@...>
Subject: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Sharp DOF in 360 spherical pano
To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, September 30, 2010, 5:36 PM







 













--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, A Kielcz <roblee007@...> wrote:

>

> Actually I did upload my Samyang 8mm pictures for your viewing here.

> Thank you!

>

> http://www.flickr.com/photos/aak071946/sets/72157625068649484/



You can not evaluate anything from that size.



You need a full resolution image



Hans



>

> A Kielcz

>

> Cincinnati, Ohio, U.S.A.

>

> --- On Thu, 9/30/10, Hans <hans@...> wrote:

>

> From: Hans <hans@...>

> Subject: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Sharp DOF in 360 spherical pano

> To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com

> Date: Thursday, September 30, 2010, 8:43 AM

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>  

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "gregoryv92821" <gregvoisan@> wrote:

>

> >

>

> > I use a Samyang 8mm with 4+up+down. What is the best way to get the sharpest
DOF for my 360 spherical panos?

>

> >

>

>

>

> Set the lens at  full aperture. Set focus at 1.5m. Shoot some testshots to
check that it is sharp from 0.7 to infinity.

>

>

>

> If it is OK just Tape it or just remember to always shoot at 1.5m.

>

> You can now use it at any aperture and you have minimum sharpness from 0.7m

>

>

>

> Also do some testshots at F5.6 and F8 and see how much  it improves in
sharpness especially at the edges..

>

>

>

> Hans

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>

























[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Hans" <hans@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "gregoryv92821" <gregvoisan@> wrote:
> >
> > I use a Samyang 8mm with 4+up+down. What is the best way to get the sharpest
DOF for my 360 spherical panos?
> >
>
> Set the lens at  full aperture. Set focus at 1.5m. Shoot some testshots to
check that it is sharp from 0.7 to infinity.
>
The Samyang lens is known to have potential problems with it's focus scale
alignment. You will probably need to do a series of test shots at various focus
settings (possibly the entire range of focus settings) to find one that gets a
sharp infinity setting. Be sure to use it wide open when you do this.

Search the list for a thread about this issue, you should be able to find a
great information source on how to adjust the Samyang and it's variants focus
scale if your comfortable with altering your lens.

good luck,

Robert

Yesterday it was 113F in Los Angeles -- the highest temp ever.
That's 45C for all you foreigners :-)

Roger D. Williams wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 19:28:01 +0900, Hans <hans@...> wrote:
>
>> You should get much sharper than me. The Photokina panos are with the 5D
>> 12mp at 10mm shaved which just gives me 6800x3400. You should get around
>> 11500 pixels at 10mm.
>
> Yes, the pixel dimensions I can get are exactly as you say. But the images
> are not sharp enough to take advantage of this. It does seem that I was
> shooting nowhere near the hyperfocal setting, so I am taking further shots
> and will see if quality improves. The dreadful summer-long heatwave here
> in Japan (71 days of temperatures in the 30s) has continued after the
> briefest of respites and I have not been getting out and about enough to
> really thoroughly test this lens. It was 33C in Tokyo yesterday, with very
> high humidity--unprecedented this far into September.
>
> Roger W.
>

A long time ago when I was first playing with Panotools I tried a bit
with that morph to fit feature. I remeber finding the results a bit
disappointng. If I remember right Panotools created triangles and
stretched them around, with a pretty evident effect.

With all those new image matching and editing tools I wonder if there
aren't newer techniques that would morph images to fit perfectly without
visible cues. Maybe a mild morphing using something like Photoshop's
warp mode that could get rid of that stubborn slight misalignment once
and for all.

You know of anything like this being used?

On Fri, 01 Oct 2010 08:50:52 +0900, Ken Warner <kwarner000@...>
wrote:

> Yesterday it was 113F in Los Angeles -- the highest temp ever.
> That's 45C for all you foreigners :-)

Yes, but in Tokyo it's not the heat, it's the humanity.

Roger W.

--
Business: www.adex-japan.com
Pleasure: www.usefilm.com/member/roger