Hi everybody,

I managed to get some really good prints with the R800 by switching to
2880dpi (at-8% ink). However I have noticed that at least the Ilford
Galerie Smooth Pearl paper does not absorb this amount of ink. 1440dpi
printouts seem ok (if a little bit light) but show banding. When
setting QTR to 2880 at -80% ink the black areas seem ok but the light
areas are way too light.

Anybody can confirm this behaviour? Anybody has suggestions?

Thank you,
Ignacio

I just want to announce my presence. I am a prolific lurker but an
appreciative one. I have been using Imageprint as a RIP for a couple
of years but after a change over to OS X.4 I have been unable to get
it running again. I am looking for a less rigid support structure. I
want to print, not work software bugs.
Anyway, I have read wonderful things about the Quadtone RIP and look
forward to printing happily. I am on a 7600 using Archival Epson Inks
(Ultrachromes). I use a variety of papers but mostly Moab Entrada or
Innova Fiba. I am also doing some work with handmade Japanese paper-
dickle edged A1 sheets from Awagami Paper in Japan. I live and work in
Japan.
I use the Mac OS- Nikon 8000 scanner...
I really look forward to learning from everyone here...
Paul Kohl
Oh, web site and images:
http://www2.gol.com/users/pkohl

Hi everybody, I thought I would keep you updated on my efforts to get
consistent b/w results with the R800:

I tried now using Ilford SP and a combination of the EEM_black and the
EEM_warm profile (80/20) which gives me quite neutral tones. Instead of
2880dpi I am printing by 1440 super (1440dpi gives me seriopus
banding). I have furthermore reduced the ink in the shadow areas by -25
(any more reduction seems to provoke -again- banding).

However the prints do not seem to dry. Where they do I have a quite
visible bronzing problem. I guess it is a paper combintaion issue. My
next idea (before changing papers) would be to try using the GLOP, but
I am totally unaware about how to do this. How can I adapt the curves
in order to use the GLOP? Any hint would be appreciated.

Regards,
Ignacio

I  have been using QTR for some time and have a new problem: prints
using my Epson 1280 now show perceptible horizontal bands or stripes
for the first and last 1/4" of each print. Can this be an alignment
problem?
If not, what might it be?

Thank you.

-----Original Message-----
From: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com [mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of adolphamster
Sent: 03 January 2006 17:30
To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Banding in prints

I  have been using QTR for some time and have a new problem: prints
using my Epson 1280 now show perceptible horizontal bands or stripes
for the first and last 1/4" of each print. Can this be an alignment
problem?
If not, what might it be?
------------------------------------------------

Realign or clean your heads or both.

Richard






---
[This E-mail has been scanned for viruses but it is your responsibility
to maintain up to date anti virus software on the device that you are
currently using to read this email. ]

I'm new to this forum having just today installed QTR Rip V2.3.13 on a
PC with an Epson 1280 printer using MIS UT2 Inks. I think I have
everything set up properly but regardless of paper size setting or
scale % each page only prints partially - they get ejected when approx
50% to 70% complete depending on the iamge size and paper size.

I have Printer set to Epson Stylus Photo 1280 with print model QUAD1280-
UT2, paper set to letter and sheet feed set to standard with type =
Matte paper, placement centered and scale set to 100% and my actual
print sixe is 8"x10" as set in image size inside Photoshop when
created. Even if I make the image much smaller than the paper size it
prints it still does not print the enire image. For example if I print
a small 4x4 size image on letter paper it prints abuot 70% of the
image. What am I missing? Any ideas what I can look at? I did try re-
installing QTR

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Richard" <richard@r...> wrote:
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com] On
> Behalf Of adolphamster
> Sent: 03 January 2006 17:30
> To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Banding in prints
>
> I  have been using QTR for some time and have a new problem: prints
> using my Epson 1280 now show perceptible horizontal bands or stripes
> for the first and last 1/4" of each print. Can this be an alignment
> problem?
> If not, what might it be?
> ------------------------------------------------
>
> Realign or clean your heads or both.
>
> Richard

Thank you for your suggestion. But if the problem is either in
alignment or head cleaning, how would that account for the banding
appearing only at the very beginning and end of the prints, not in the
central portion of the print?

I would agree adolphamster, with you that head alignment and nozzle
clogging would not exhibit such banding at the begining and end of
prints.  Since I read your post I noticed this too with my 2200 and MS
GQ inks.  I think it only happens when I don't upsize a file and try
to print from QTR at more than 100%.  I only print less than 100% now
and upsize before I send to QTR- man do I miss Qimage.  No more
banding.  Let us know if that is on the mark.  -p

-----Original Message-----
From: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com [mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Edward Wiseman
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 4:43 PM
To: quadtonerip@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] QTR 2.3.4 WILL NOT PRINT??!

   Hello Group..

 

I just installed      QTR_Setup_2.3.4.EXE over the previous version, and now I set up to print using the GUI, get the image in the window..Hit print and NOTHING happens..HUH??..Am I all of a sudden doing something wrong?....Even tried a re-boot..Nothing..

 

Windows 2K, Epson 1280 with UT-2 Inks..

Any help would be appreciated

 

TIA,

 

Eddie Wiseman

----- Original Message -----

From: Stephen Billard

To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 8:05 PM

Subject: RE: [QuadtoneRIP] QTR 2.3.4 WILL NOT PRINT??!

Do you get any log output? If so, it would be useful to post it. Does the cursor turn into an hourglass after you pres print? Does the image go away?

 

 

-Stephen

 www.sbillard.org/Stephen

-----Original Message-----
From: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com [mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Edward Wiseman
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 4:43 PM
To: quadtonerip@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] QTR 2.3.4 WILL NOT PRINT??!

   Hello Group..

 

I just installed      QTR_Setup_2.3.4.EXE over the previous version, and now I set up to print using the GUI, get the image in the window..Hit print and NOTHING happens..HUH??..Am I all of a sudden doing something wrong?....Even tried a re-boot..Nothing..

 

Windows 2K, Epson 1280 with UT-2 Inks..

Any help would be appreciated

 

TIA,

 

Eddie Wiseman

----- Original Message -----

From: Edward Wiseman

To: quadtonerip@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 7:42 PM

Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] QTR 2.3.4 WILL NOT PRINT??!

   Hello Group..

 

I just installed      QTR_Setup_2.3.4.EXE over the previous version, and now I set up to print using the GUI, get the image in the window..Hit print and NOTHING happens..HUH??..Am I all of a sudden doing something wrong?....Even tried a re-boot..Nothing..

 

Windows 2K, Epson 1280 with UT-2 Inks..

Any help would be appreciated

 

TIA,

 

Eddie Wiseman

I have been experiencing the same problem with the R800 at 1440dpi. It
seems that the problem vanishes most of the times at 1440 Super. No
problem at 2880dpi (shifting the problem to the use of too much ink and
blocking blacks). Funny that the banding occurs always at the top and
at the end of an image. Until now I thought that it was just a R800
profile issue.

Regards
Ignacio

QuadToneRIP version 2.3.5 Release Notes

    QTRgui version 2.3.14.0
    QTR-Create-ICC version 2.3.5.0
    QTR-Create-ICC RGB version 2.3.5.0

This release may be installed directly over older versions.

R800 and R1800 Neutral K7 ink profiles for the Mac fixed.

The new RGB version of QTR-Create-ICC is very similar to the
standard one but the ICC profile is RGB and can be used in Qimage.

Multiple Copies feature fixed.

The QTR-Create-ICC tools now have the capability to average
several measurements.  There is a new target and a reference file
for a 21x4 stepwedge.  The 21 steps are printed out four times and
you should scan/read all of them.

Roy

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "psideburns" <psideburns@y...> wrote:
>
> I would agree adolphamster, with you that head alignment and nozzle
> clogging would not exhibit such banding at the begining and end of
> prints.  Since I read your post I noticed this too with my 2200 and MS
> GQ inks.  I think it only happens when I don't upsize a file and try
> to print from QTR at more than 100%.  I only print less than 100% now
> and upsize before I send to QTR- man do I miss Qimage.  No more
> banding.  Let us know if that is on the mark.  -p
>
I think you hit the nail on the head! And thank you very much. I've
been relying upon either QTR or my Epson print driver to resize my
prints. Following your input, I selected an image resized it to the
desired final size (using Bicubic sampling) in Paint Shop Pro and then
printed at actual size.

Problem gone!!

How about that!

Thank you again.

I've been using the QTR with my 2200 and the Epson UC inks and was wondering how
to
get profiles for the Hahnemuhle Photo rag papers. Do you have to create your own
or are
there available profiles for download? TIA

GRAY_OVERLAP=percent

With this setting is the grey ink applied first, so that all of the black ink is
applied OVER all of
the grey ink,  or are the grey and black dots put down sporadically so they are
"mixed"?
Perhaps this differs by printer.  I'm on a 7800 with K3 if that helps.

Is anyone using this setting, or is it outdated and a holdover from older
inksets?

Thanks.

Josh

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "joshhackney" <joshhackney@g...> wrote:
>
>
>
> GRAY_OVERLAP=percent
>
> With this setting is the grey ink applied first, so that all of the black ink
is applied OVER
all of
> the grey ink,  or are the grey and black dots put down sporadically so they
are "mixed"?
> Perhaps this differs by printer.  I'm on a 7800 with K3 if that helps.
>
> Is anyone using this setting, or is it outdated and a holdover from older
inksets?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Josh
>

There's no way to really tell for sure -- al least there's no way to control it.
But given the weaving that is used I'd guess they are mixed randomly.
I think an overlap in the 10 to 20% range is usually good.

Roy

When will we be able to print borderless with QTR?  As a paying user I
would like to request this option please.  If there is a reason we
can't- let me know.  Also is there a way to not print the gloss
optimizer over the entire page even if we print a 4x6 on 8.5x11"
paper?  Thanks for a great program!  -p

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, Howard Shaw <glassman@b...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Tom
>
> I've switched to 2880dpi profiles & that seems to have fixed it.
>
> Howard

Hi Howard,
what do you intend about switching to 2880dpi profiles? which one did you
use for the 2200?
I have the same problem as you, I tried to print at 2880, the problem disappears
but the prints have a really darker tones, while at 1440 super (without super
the banding
increased) it was identical to my monitor.
Thanks.
Andrea
www.andrearuggeri.it

Andrea

I made my own profiles. The ink limits are much lower than the profiles
done for 1440dpi. For example, a UT-FS set up I have has limits of 55%
for K & 40% for the lighter inks.

If you are unable to make your own profiles I've heard it suggested that
having a large negative value for the Ink Limit Adjustment (say -40)
reduces the amount of ink being laid down. I guess you could also use
the gamma adjustment to do the same thing in the higher zones.

Howard

cortezthekiller80 wrote:
> --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, Howard Shaw <glassman@b...> wrote:
>  >
>  > Thanks Tom
>  >
>  > I've switched to 2880dpi profiles & that seems to have fixed it.
>  >
>  > Howard
>
> Hi Howard,
> what do you intend about switching to 2880dpi profiles? which one did you
> use for the 2200?
> I have the same problem as you, I tried to print at 2880, the problem
> disappears
> but the prints have a really darker tones, while at 1440 super (without
> super the banding
> increased) it was identical to my monitor.
> Thanks.
> Andrea
> www.andrearuggeri.it
>
>

Incidentally, I should add that when I was having this problem with
1440dpi prints it was not a problem with just with qtr. I tried black
only printing with the Epson driver and that also showed terrible
banding even though I could make very nice BO prints when the printer
was new.

My nozzle checks are fine and the head alignment is as good as I can get
it with the tests you can run so I really don't know what the problem is.

I use refillable cartridges from MIS and I have ordered some
replacements in case these are getting a little 'tired'.

regards
Howard

Howard Shaw wrote:
> Andrea
>
> I made my own profiles. The ink limits are much lower than the profiles
> done for 1440dpi. For example, a UT-FS set up I have has limits of 55%
> for K & 40% for the lighter inks.
>
> If you are unable to make your own profiles I've heard it suggested that
> having a large negative value for the Ink Limit Adjustment (say -40)
> reduces the amount of ink being laid down. I guess you could also use
> the gamma adjustment to do the same thing in the higher zones.
>
> Howard
>
> cortezthekiller80 wrote:
>  > --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, Howard Shaw <glassman@b...> wrote:
>  >  >
>  >  > Thanks Tom
>  >  >
>  >  > I've switched to 2880dpi profiles & that seems to have fixed it.
>  >  >
>  >  > Howard
>  >
>  > Hi Howard,
>  > what do you intend about switching to 2880dpi profiles? which one did you
>  > use for the 2200?
>  > I have the same problem as you, I tried to print at 2880, the problem
>  > disappears
>  > but the prints have a really darker tones, while at 1440 super (without
>  > super the banding
>  > increased) it was identical to my monitor.
>  > Thanks.
>  > Andrea
>  > www.andrearuggeri.it
>  >
>  >
>

Roy Harrington wrote:
> QuadToneRIP version 2.3.5 Release Notes
>
>    QTRgui version 2.3.14.0
>    QTR-Create-ICC version 2.3.5.0
>    QTR-Create-ICC RGB version 2.3.5.0
>
> This release may be installed directly over older versions.
>
> R800 and R1800 Neutral K7 ink profiles for the Mac fixed.
>
> The new RGB version of QTR-Create-ICC is very similar to the
> standard one but the ICC profile is RGB and can be used in Qimage.
>
> Multiple Copies feature fixed.
>
> The QTR-Create-ICC tools now have the capability to average
> several measurements.  There is a new target and a reference file
> for a 21x4 stepwedge.  The 21 steps are printed out four times and
> you should scan/read all of them.
>
> Roy

Thank you. Specs look nice Roy.


I have used averaging before and my youngest son is improving
the tool he had written for it. I have followed the discussion
on the Colorsync list and wonder what you put in it. Plain
averaging or averaging and throwing out the most extreme for
every 4 measurements. On 4 measurements that may be a bit drastic.

There's something not correct with Qimage's conversions from a
grayscale file to the Print to File RGB file. That's with CM
off. I have to check that further this weekend.


Ernst

                     --
            Ernst Dinkla


www.pigment-print.com
(         unvollendet         )

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, Howard Shaw <glassman@b...> wrote:
>
> Incidentally, I should add that when I was having this problem with
> 1440dpi prints it was not a problem with just with qtr. I tried black
> only printing with the Epson driver and that also showed terrible
> banding even though I could make very nice BO prints when the printer
> was new.
>
> My nozzle checks are fine and the head alignment is as good as I can get
> it with the tests you can run so I really don't know what the problem is.
>
> I use refillable cartridges from MIS and I have ordered some
> replacements in case these are getting a little 'tired'.
>
> regards
> Howard

Thank you for the answers. Seems like we have different problems with the same
banding. I use MIS Eboni for matte black and UC epson for the other cartidges,
with the
UC profile by quadtone rip installed for my epson 2100 (european version of the
2200).
And I just reanimate my printer, cause for an year the black nozzles have been
clogged.
But now I print  perfectly with BO printing and MIS Eboni at 2880 dpi (like I
did before the
clog), without banding at all. I just have the problem with UC profiles by
quadtone rip
at 1440 dpi. I don't know hot to made my own profiles. And I prefer the b&w from
quadtone rip, more neutral and smooth, so I'd like to figure out the problem.
Thanks!
Andrea
http://www.andrearuggeri.it

Hi

Does anyone know if there are going to be any profiles for the 7800
with photo black ink at some stage? I just downloaded the software but
noticed that all the curves are for matte black.

Thanks
Mark

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "Roy Harrington" <roy@h...> wrote:
>
> --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "joshhackney" <joshhackney@g...>
wrote:
> >
> > GRAY_OVERLAP=percent
> >
> > With this setting is the grey ink applied first, so that all of
the black ink is applied OVER
> all of
> > the grey ink,  or are the grey and black dots put down
sporadically so they are "mixed"?
> > Perhaps this differs by printer.  I'm on a 7800 with K3 if that helps.
> >
> > Is anyone using this setting, or is it outdated and a holdover
from older inksets?
>
> There's no way to really tell for sure -- al least there's no way to
control it.

Actually, there is. The GIMPprint driver will interleave dots until
the dither pattent is full, only then will it start overlapping. There
is no laydown order control, the laydown will be, essentially, random,
sometimes lighter colors will be on top, sometimes darker ones.

If you tell the driver that the inks are different strengths of the
same color, the interleave will be more intelligent, i.e. it will
never overlay light colors when a single layer of a darker one is
availiable.

> But given the weaving that is used I'd guess they are mixed randomly.
> I think an overlap in the 10 to 20% range is usually good.

The better the assignment of densities of the lighter inks relative to
the darkest, the smaller the overlap needs to be for good results.

This may be just something in my computer, but I've lost the "auto
orientation" feature a couple of upgrades back. (Windows XP Pro, QTR
2.3.5). Simply doesn't auto-orient any more.
I can still get the correct orientation of the image by manually
selecting either landscape or portrait, but checking the
auto-orientation option in the menu seems to do nothing.
Anyone else having this problem or know a solution? Thanks!
Brooks

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "psideburns" <psideburns@y...> wrote:
>
> When will we be able to print borderless with QTR?  As a paying user I
> would like to request this option please.  If there is a reason we
> can't- let me know.

The version of the GIMPprint drivers that Roy is using won't support it.

It's not such a good idea, anyway. The Epson pigment inks (especially
the matte black) tend to make a mess of the overspray pads in most
Epson printers.

And it's tricky. Either you need to print exactly to the edge of the
paper (a tiny 1/100 of an inch white border looks distracting on a
dark image) or you need to print slightly past the edges of the paper.
In Epson's drivers, for borderless printing they allow something on
the order of 0.10 inches, to allow for the paper size being a little
off, or the paper not being fed exactly from the right stop of the
printer, or the paper not being perfectly straight and "wandering" a
fraction of an inch while printing.

So, either you'd have to do your print scaling yourself to take this
into consideration (i.e. scale an 8x10 borderless image up to
8.2x10.2, carefully maintaining "printer native" 360 or 720 dots/inch)
or your RIP would need a high quality (expensive, or slow, or both)
scaling algorithm.

The infamous Qimage actually has such an algorithm, and it knows how
much overspray the Epson drivers allocate, so you can actually "hand
tune" the amount of overspray based on how accuratly you can load
paper, and how well the paper you use has been cut. Qimage has a
pretty steep learning curve.

> Also is there a way to not print the gloss
> optimizer over the entire page even if we print a 4x6 on 8.5x11"
> paper?

Yes, don't tell the printer you're using 8.5x11 paper. Tell it you're
printing a piece of paper 0.25 inches bigger than your image (that
leaves the 1/8 inch border for the driver). For your 4x6, say you're
printing on 4.25x6.25 paper, and QTR will print and GLOP only a 4x6
image. Your image will not be centered on the 8.5x11 if you do this,
it will be on the upper right corner of the page.

If you want to know how to do a 4x6 GLOP covered image in the center
of a 8.5x11 sheet, with the glop only covering the 4x6 image, let me
know. It's a long, complicated, and ugly procedure that I won't go
into unless there's interest.

Another way that I end up using quite a bit is to change the
first value of the GLOP channel to 0. (This is on a mac
where you can edit the .quad files easily). You end up with
a small border around the image, but it doesn't try to
print the rest (blank) part of the page.

Only problem I am aware of here is if you have a
large area of 0 value in the image, but that doesn't
happen often. If so you can adjust the output values in
PS to prevent a 0 output value.

Costa

--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "koloshor" <koloshor@y...> wrote:
>
> --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, "psideburns" <psideburns@y...> wrote:
> >
> > When will we be able to print borderless with QTR?  As a paying user I
> > would like to request this option please.  If there is a reason we
> > can't- let me know.
>
> The version of the GIMPprint drivers that Roy is using won't support it.
>
> It's not such a good idea, anyway. The Epson pigment inks (especially
> the matte black) tend to make a mess of the overspray pads in most
> Epson printers.
>
> And it's tricky. Either you need to print exactly to the edge of the
> paper (a tiny 1/100 of an inch white border looks distracting on a
> dark image) or you need to print slightly past the edges of the paper.
> In Epson's drivers, for borderless printing they allow something on
> the order of 0.10 inches, to allow for the paper size being a little
> off, or the paper not being fed exactly from the right stop of the
> printer, or the paper not being perfectly straight and "wandering" a
> fraction of an inch while printing.
>
> So, either you'd have to do your print scaling yourself to take this
> into consideration (i.e. scale an 8x10 borderless image up to
> 8.2x10.2, carefully maintaining "printer native" 360 or 720 dots/inch)
> or your RIP would need a high quality (expensive, or slow, or both)
> scaling algorithm.
>
> The infamous Qimage actually has such an algorithm, and it knows how
> much overspray the Epson drivers allocate, so you can actually "hand
> tune" the amount of overspray based on how accuratly you can load
> paper, and how well the paper you use has been cut. Qimage has a
> pretty steep learning curve.
>
> > Also is there a way to not print the gloss
> > optimizer over the entire page even if we print a 4x6 on 8.5x11"
> > paper?
>
> Yes, don't tell the printer you're using 8.5x11 paper. Tell it you're
> printing a piece of paper 0.25 inches bigger than your image (that
> leaves the 1/8 inch border for the driver). For your 4x6, say you're
> printing on 4.25x6.25 paper, and QTR will print and GLOP only a 4x6
> image. Your image will not be centered on the 8.5x11 if you do this,
> it will be on the upper right corner of the page.
>
> If you want to know how to do a 4x6 GLOP covered image in the center
> of a 8.5x11 sheet, with the glop only covering the 4x6 image, let me
> know. It's a long, complicated, and ugly procedure that I won't go
> into unless there's interest.
>

It was broken. I have fixed it in version 2.3.15 which is on the QTRgui page
now.

-Stephen
  www.sbillard.org/Stephen


> -----Original Message-----
> From: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of lensworkpub
> Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 7:07 AM
> To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Auto orientation problems
>
>
> This may be just something in my computer, but I've lost the
> "auto orientation" feature a couple of upgrades back.
> (Windows XP Pro, QTR 2.3.5). Simply doesn't auto-orient any more.
> I can still get the correct orientation of the image by
> manually selecting either landscape or portrait, but checking
> the auto-orientation option in the menu seems to do nothing.
> Anyone else having this problem or know a solution? Thanks! Brooks
>
>
>