aa-ftt : Messages : 1469-1498 of 2000

#1469

From: "Markus" <shino@...>
Date: Fri Dec 3, 2010 1:37 pm
Subject: EuroPLoP Call for Patterns

shino01051979

The EuroPLoP Call for Patterns is out. I was going to submit my pattern under
the wokring title "Essential examples" there. Just in case anyone else would be
interested in it, here is the link to the CfP:
http://www.hillside.net/europlop/europlop2011/cfp.html

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#1470

From: Gojko Adzic <gojko-yahoolist@...>
Date: Mon Dec 6, 2010 12:10 am
Subject: the secret ninja cucumber scrolls - new version

gojko_lastname

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Hi,

A new version of The Secret Ninja Cucumber Scrolls is now available at
http://cuke4ninja.com. The Secret Ninja Cucumber Scrolls is a free
e-book on Cucumber that David de Florinier and I are writing iteratively.

In this version, we have started working on the explaining effective web
testing and expanded several sections on gherkin. Here is a short
summary of the changes:

- Using hooks to manage cross-cutting concerns
- Debugging from a Java IDE
- How does Cucumber compare to other tools?
- A new chapter on organising web automation for easy maintenance
(Chapter 8, The Three Layers of UI Automation)
- A new chapter on web testing in Ruby with Rails and Sinatra (Chapter
9, Getting Ruby ready to exercise the UI)
- And a lot of minor fixes and tweaks

On another note, I'll be running a seminar on the conclusions from the
research conducted for my upcoming book, Specification by Example, on
February 2nd in London. I collected around 50 case studies of teams that
succeeded with BDD/Agile Acceptance Testing/Specification by example and
I'll present key patterns and conclusions about that. If this sounds
interesting, sign up at http://specificationbyexample.eventbrite.com/

Best regards,

Gojko Adzic

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#1471

From: Elisabeth Hendrickson <esh@...>
Date: Tue Jan 4, 2011 9:55 pm
Subject: Pattern Workshop, February 16 - 18, Pleasanton, CA

elisabethshe...

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Hi all,

As a follow on to the work we did in London last October, I'm hosting a Pattern
Workshop at Agilistry Studio in Pleasanton, CA on February 16 and 17. This event
is open to all AA-FTT community members.  I will be facilitating the workshop.
Participation will be capped at 12 people (including me).

In addition, there will be an additional day set aside on February 18 for anyone
who wants to stay an extra day to work on writing patterns.

As with all our events (so far, anyway) there is no cost to participate. You
will have to cover your own travel costs. Breakfast and lunch will be provided.

Interested? Please see http://agilistry.com/events/aa-ftt/ and fill out the form
to request an invitation to participate.

I hope you can join us!

Thanks!!

Elisabeth
------------------------------------------
Elisabeth Hendrickson
Quality Tree Software, Inc.
AA-FTT Program Assistant Chair and group moderator

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#1472

From: "Rachel" <rachel.davies@...>
Date: Wed Jan 5, 2011 6:05 pm
Subject: ANN: XP2011 Interested to present at Agile conference in Madrid, Spain?

rachelclaire...

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Hoping that some of you aa-ftt folks will be interested in this ..

Reminder. January 7 is the last day for proposing sessions for XP2011 conference
in Madrid Spain on 10-13th May.

XP2011 is the 12th international conference on Agile Software Development and
will be hosted by Universidad Polit�cnica de Madrid in Spain. The conference
brings together both industrial practitioners and researchers in the fields of
information systems and software development, and examines latest theory,
practical applications, and implications of agile methods.

The conference has a strong research bias. We're looking for various session
types:- instructive tutorials, exploratory workshops, innovative demonstrations,
visible posters, industrial experiences, and more. Get the details on session
types at at http://www.xp2011.org/node/6

This conference is a non-commercial conference organised at a university by a
team of volunteers, we hope you understand that this limits the speaker
compensation package we are able to offer. There will be 1 free registration for
each tutorial or workshop that is accepted (hotel and travel costs are not
included). Presenters of other session types will be offered significant
registration discounts.

Please submit details of your session proposals online at
http://www.easychair.org/conferences/?conf=xp2011 by Jan 7.

.. and pass this reminder onto friends and colleagues too :-)

thanks,

Rachel Davies
General chair, XP2011 conference

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#1473

From: "kaia5977" <shellyfld@...>
Date: Wed Jan 5, 2011 8:27 pm
Subject: Shelly's Intro

kaia5977

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Hello everyone,

Thought I'd start the year off right and post an intro to the group as
suggested.  I am a business analyst working on a project for an accident
reporting application.  I've been on this project since July 2010, and this is
my first exposure to Agile.  It has been very exciting and interesting and I
like it very much in comparison to the waterfall projects I have been on in the
past.  On our team, BA's write both the requirements and do the testing.  We're
trying to do much more testing each iteration now, so I'm hoping to learn a lot.

Thanks!

Shelly Floyd

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#1474

From: jennitta andrea <jennitta@...>
Date: Sun Jan 16, 2011 5:56 pm
Subject: summary of ATDD Pattern Workshops

jennitta_andrea

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I just posted a summary of the ATDD Pattern Workshops that were held in London & Berlin in October 2010 (see http://www.managing-expectations.com/?p=1326 �... note: this also has a link to the summary of the Aug retrospective/workshop in Orlando if you haven't seen it yet).�

�

I'm missing a few things (marked in red font) - links to photos of the event, links to other participant blogs of the event.� So if any of the attendees�can provided links, I'll update the summary for completeness.

�

The Agile Testing Days conference organizers were generous enough to lend us their video equipment and edit the videos for posting onto youtube.� There is one video that I need edited (basically just trim part of it off because it is duplicated in another video and youtube won't accept it), so if anyone can edit Quicktime files, please let me know.

�

Hope this helps give a sense of what we did.� I am working on a follow on post to provide a high level view of what we envision future workshops and community collaboration to look like so that we can build a useful/valuable community of practice pattern language.

�

Regards,

Jennitta

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#1475

From: "Markus" <shino@...>
Date: Mon Jan 24, 2011 9:02 pm
Subject: The German Given/When/Then Fallacy

shino01051979

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Last week I visited a client who had a problem with one of their product owners
with the Given/When/Then format of story tests. The "When"-part could be
misinterpreted in another way yielding a similar meaning as an "if", which of
course confused the PO.

I blogged about it on Friday:
http://www.shino.de/2011/01/21/the-german-givenwhenthen-fallacy

Did anyone see something similar?

Best
Markus Gaertner
http://www.shino.de/blog
http://www.it-agile.de
Twitter: @mgaertne

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#1476

From: "Aslak" <aslak.hellesoy@...>
Date: Sun Jan 30, 2011 11:28 pm
Subject: [ANN] CukeUp! BDD/Cucumber conference in London March 24

aslak_hellesoy

Send Email

Skills Matter and I are organising a 1-day conference about Cucumber
and BDD in London on the 24th of March.

If you want to attend or give a talk, please head over to
http://cukes.info/cukeup.html

Cheers,
Aslak (Creator of Cucumber)

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#1477

From: "A" <o627mini@...>
Date: Thu Feb 3, 2011 5:53 pm
Subject: Introduction, and a question

o627mini

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Hi,

I'm Amy and I'm a QA tester who's about to embark on my first Agile project. I'm
currently assisting my team in evaluating functional testing tools.

Has anyone here ever used GUI Ripper?

If so...

(1) what was the environment (Windows? Java? Web?)
(2) what was your experience with the tool?

thanks.

Reply | Messages in this Topic (4)

#1478

From: David Johnson <david.johnson@...>
Date: Fri Feb 4, 2011 5:14 am
Subject: Re: Introduction, and a question

davidjohnson...

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Hi Amy

Never used GUI Ripper, but if you are interested in Agile development and ongoing application testing, have a look at the Pivot tools and techniques demonstrated in the videos at this link http://wipasnapa.com/Pivot_5MinOverView/.

There a 2 videos – a 5 minute overview, which is a cut-down version of the 20 minute version. The 5-min is a bit too quick, so I suggest you just look at the 20 min version.

I can organise a beta version of the Pivot software to anyone interested in trialling the techniques/tools shown in the video.

Kind Regards

David Johnson

This e-mail and any attachments may contain personal information or information that is otherwise confidential or the subject of copyright. Any unauthorised use, disclosure or copying of any part of it is prohibited. West Coast Institute of Training does not warrant that this email or any attachments are free from viruses or defects. Please check any attachments for viruses and defects before opening them. If this e-mail is received in error please delete it and notify us by return e-mail.

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#1479

From: "elisabethshendrickson" <esh@...>
Date: Fri Feb 4, 2011 6:33 pm
Subject: Re: Introduction, and a question

elisabethshe...

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Hi David,

I reviewed the video and I confess that I'm confused. It looks like the videos
show an approach and a toolset for rapid prototyping rather than for test
automation. Did I understand correctly?

Thanks,

Elisabeth

--- In aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com, David Johnson <david.johnson@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Amy
>
> Never used GUI Ripper, but if you are interested in Agile development and
ongoing application testing, have a look at the Pivot tools and techniques
demonstrated in the videos at this link
http://wipasnapa.com/Pivot_5MinOverView/.
>
> There a 2 videos - a 5 minute overview, which is a cut-down version of the 20
minute version. The 5-min is a bit too quick, so I suggest you just look at the
20 min version.
>
> I can organise a beta version of the Pivot software to anyone interested in
trialling the techniques/tools shown in the video.
>
>
> Kind Regards
>
> David Johnson
>
>
> This e-mail and any attachments may contain personal information or
information that is otherwise confidential or the subject of copyright. Any
unauthorised use, disclosure or copying of any part of it is prohibited. West
Coast Institute of Training does not warrant that this email or any attachments
are free from viruses or defects. Please check any attachments for viruses and
defects before opening them. If this e-mail is received in error please delete
it and notify us by return e-mail.
>

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#1480

From: Markus Gaertner <shino@...>
Date: Sat Feb 5, 2011 4:18 pm
Subject: Visual chart of the "ATDD" flow

shino01051979

Send Email

During the past two days I attended a course on visual facilitation. On the
last day we were asked to build our masterpiece. Together with two colleagues I
worked on the "ATDD" flow. For anyone who hasn't seen it on twitter where I
posted it yesterday, here's the shot of the final visual that we created.
(Texts in German). It was a lot of fun.

Best
--
Markus Gaertner
http://blog.shino.de
Twitter: @mgaertne

1 of 1 Photo(s)

atdd.jpg

Reply | Messages in this Topic (3)

#1481

From: "Ted M. Young [@jitterted]" <tedyoung@...>
Date: Sun Feb 6, 2011 7:59 pm
Subject: Re: Visual chart of the "ATDD" flow [1 Attachment]

tedyoung

Send Email

Hi Markus,

Looks nice...any chance you could translate the German to English? I could probably guess, but I'd rather not. :-)

Would also love to hear about the visual facilitation course itself!

;ted

On Sat, Feb 5, 2011 at 8:18 AM, Markus Gaertner <shino@...> wrote:

<*>[Attachment(s) from Markus Gaertner included below]

During the past two days I attended a course on visual facilitation. On the
last day we were asked to build our masterpiece. Together with two colleagues I
worked on the "ATDD" flow. For anyone who hasn't seen it on twitter where I
posted it yesterday, here's the shot of the final visual that we created.
(Texts in German). It was a lot of fun.

Best
--
Markus Gaertner
http://blog.shino.de
Twitter: @mgaertne

<*>Attachment(s) from Markus Gaertner:

<*> 1 of 1 Photo(s) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aa-ftt/attachments/folder/1264303242/item/list
�<*> atdd.jpg

------------------------------------

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#1482

From: David Johnson <david.johnson@...>
Date: Tue Feb 8, 2011 6:51 am
Subject: RE: Re: Introduction, and a question

davidjohnson...

Send Email

Hi Elisabeth

Yes, it is ‘an approach and a toolset for rapid prototyping’ that supports ongoing testing, along the following lines.

1. Early Design : Developing the Object class diagrams, Use case diagrams, early UIs => prototypes : Testing limited to verification specific UI fields

2. After business objects and database have been generated (automatically from Object Class diagrams) : Testing UI against property data declared data types and Business rules.

3. Pre-production : Testing involving use of database (some uploaded from legacy systems or new data).

Data banks developed/modified from step 1 using the UI themselves by toggling ‘data creation’ mode on. Test cases may either be created manually from a model of the GUI. This could possibly be automated or tailored to your needs.

The Pivot approach is pretty new and quite powerful. It may be over-kill for what you want.

David

From: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of elisabethshendrickson
Sent: Saturday, 5 February 2011 2:33 AM
To: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [aa-ftt] Re: Introduction, and a question

Hi David,

I reviewed the video and I confess that I'm confused. It looks like the videos show an approach and a toolset for rapid prototyping rather than for test automation. Did I understand correctly?

Thanks,

Elisabeth

--- In aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com, David Johnson <david.johnson@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Amy
>
> Never used GUI Ripper, but if you are interested in Agile development and ongoing application testing, have a look at the Pivot tools and techniques demonstrated in the videos at this link http://wipasnapa.com/Pivot_5MinOverView/.
>
> There a 2 videos - a 5 minute overview, which is a cut-down version of the 20 minute version. The 5-min is a bit too quick, so I suggest you just look at the 20 min version.
>
> I can organise a beta version of the Pivot software to anyone interested in trialling the techniques/tools shown in the video.
>
>
> Kind Regards
>
> David Johnson
>
>
> This e-mail and any attachments may contain personal information or information that is otherwise confidential or the subject of copyright. Any unauthorised use, disclosure or copying of any part of it is prohibited. West Coast Institute of Training does not warrant that this email or any attachments are free from viruses or defects. Please check any attachments for viruses and defects before opening them. If this e-mail is received in error please delete it and notify us by return e-mail.
>

Reply | Messages in this Topic (4)

#1483

From: Elisabeth Hendrickson <esh@...>
Date: Tue Feb 8, 2011 5:34 pm
Subject: Anyone using Tellurium

elisabethshe...

Send Email

Howdy!

I just spotted a proposal for Agile2011 about Tellurium. See:

http://submit2011.agilealliance.org/node/11050

http://code.google.com/p/aost/

That made me curious: is anyone on this list using Tellurium or associated with the project?

Thanks!

Elisabeth

------------------------------------------

Elisabeth Hendrickson

Quality Tree Software, Inc.

http://www.qualitytree.com

http://www.testobsessed.com

Reply | Messages in this Topic (4)

#1484

From: James Carr <james.r.carr@...>
Date: Tue Feb 8, 2011 5:39 pm
Subject: Re: Anyone using Tellurium

cloud_strife...

Send Email

Good question... I actually have a lunch with a friend of mine that took the dive into bootstrapping his own startup last year that uses�Tellurium extensively. I will ask him about it.

Thanks,

James

On Tue, Feb 8, 2011 at 11:34 AM, Elisabeth Hendrickson <esh@...> wrote:

�

Howdy!

I just spotted a proposal for Agile2011 about Tellurium. See:

�http://submit2011.agilealliance.org/node/11050

http://code.google.com/p/aost/

That made me curious: is anyone on this list using Tellurium or associated with the project?

Thanks!

Elisabeth

------------------------------------------
Elisabeth Hendrickson
Quality Tree Software, Inc.
http://www.qualitytree.com
http://www.testobsessed.com

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#1485

From: Mark Levison <mark@...>
Date: Tue Feb 8, 2011 5:40 pm
Subject: Re: Anyone using Tellurium

marklevison

Send Email

On Tue, Feb 8, 2011 at 12:34 PM, Elisabeth Hendrickson <esh@...> wrote:

�

Howdy!

I just spotted a proposal for Agile2011 about Tellurium. See:

�http://submit2011.agilealliance.org/node/11050

http://code.google.com/p/aost/

That made me curious: is anyone on this list using Tellurium or associated with the project?

Never heard of it before, certainly looks interesting. My only ugh: Yet Another Testing Framework (YATF).

Cheers

Mark�

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#1486

From: Al Snow <jasnow1@...>
Date: Tue Feb 8, 2011 6:31 pm
Subject: RE: Anyone using Tellurium

jasnowj

Send Email

Elisabeth,

I have been monitoring their google group:

for a long time and the lead is Jian Fang. He just moved from Jewelry Channel

(TN) to Barnes & Noble (NY). He is very responsive to post to the e-group.

Al Snow

To: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com
From: esh@...
Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2011 09:34:15 -0800
Subject: [aa-ftt] Anyone using Tellurium

Howdy!

I just spotted a proposal for Agile2011 about Tellurium. See:

http://submit2011.agilealliance.org/node/11050

http://code.google.com/p/aost/

That made me curious: is anyone on this list using Tellurium or associated with the project?

Thanks!

Elisabeth

------------------------------------------

Elisabeth Hendrickson

Quality Tree Software, Inc.

http://www.qualitytree.com

http://www.testobsessed.com

Reply | Messages in this Topic (4)

#1487

From: Shelly <shellyfld@...>
Date: Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:43 am
Subject: Automated Testing Books

kaia5977

Send Email

Does anyone have suggestions for good books or websites regarding implementing automated testing?� Something geared toward less technical QA/BA staff.� I saw this on Amazon, has anyone read it?� I'd like to get some good suggestions before I ask my PM to buy anything.

Also, while I'm thinking about it, if you started off as a QA tester, what technical skills have you found to be useful to learn along the way?� I think the first tool I want to pick up is a scripting language, but I'd love to hear about everyone's experiences.� I don't want to become a developer, but I do want to gain enough technical skills to do more than exploratory testing based solely on instinct about what breaks software.

Thanks!

Shelly

Reply | Messages in this Topic (5)

#1488

From: "Adrian Stokes" <adrian.stokes@...>
Date: Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:03 am
Subject: RE: Automated Testing Books

adystokes

Send Email

A good place to start would be the work of Gojko Adzic. He has written 2 books, Bridging the Communication gap and Specification by Example that explicitly talk about using automation not only for testing but as your living documentation. Visit gojko.net for information and is blog. There are also a few good talks he has done online.

I'm working as a QA for a business intelligence team and they use Fitnesse as their automation tool. I contribute a lot to the content but have started learning the application. It uses a basic language and sounds like the type of thing your looking for. There is also tools like Cucumber (cukes.info) or SpecFlow (.org) depending on your world (.net etc) or commercially there is Thoughtworks 'Twist'. These use a plainer language and are designed for ATDD or BDD practices. More recently SpecLog has emerged that links user stories, scenarios and executable specification together and can link to visual studio TFS too.

Hope that helps. Ady

Ady Stokes
BI QA Analyst
Business Intelligence
BISD
Gateway House, Skipton
UK
Ext: 2452
Direct Dial: 0844 892 2596
www.hml.co.uk

–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––
The ability in financial outsourcing

From: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Shelly
Sent: 10 February 2011 03:44
To: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [aa-ftt] Automated Testing Books

Does anyone have suggestions for good books or websites regarding implementing automated testing? Something geared toward less technical QA/BA staff. I saw this on Amazon, has anyone read it? I'd like to get some good suggestions before I ask my PM to buy anything.

Also, while I'm thinking about it, if you started off as a QA tester, what technical skills have you found to be useful to learn along the way? I think the first tool I want to pick up is a scripting language, but I'd love to hear about everyone's experiences. I don't want to become a developer, but I do want to gain enough technical skills to do more than exploratory testing based solely on instinct about what breaks software.

Thanks!

Shelly

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#1489

From: Matt Heusser <matt.heusser@...>
Date: Thu Feb 10, 2011 1:32 pm
Subject: Re: Automated Testing Books

heusserm

Send Email

>do more than exploratory testing based solely on instinct about what breaks software

Thank you for posting Shelly!

I have a different perspective on testing than the typical person on this list, and that's okay. �We have a wide tent. �

But on this answer I thought maybe you might benefit from my perspective -- or at least, it's the kind of thing where a variety of perspectives might be helpful.

My first thought, after reading that, is that a whole lot is /actually/ going on during your exploratory testing. �It can be done well or poorly. �By using the term "instinct", it tells me you haven't sat down and studied it in serious depth. �(I'm not judging here. �Lots of people are good at what they do but haven't taken the time to try to explain it.)

My first thought is to study exploratory testing in depth - in order to gain skill and understanding -�

a) Study failure modes and effects analysis - where do the bugs come from?

b) Research inattentional blindness, cognitive dissonance, and miscommunications patterns - "... and why do we miss them?"

c) Intentionally experiment with methods in exploratory testing "... and what do I, as a tester, actually /do/ when I test?"

d) Study Quick attacks "... how can I find bugs fast?"

e) Research all-pairs, reverse-engineer-the-directed-graph, decision tables, and other methods of finding bugs fast

----> If you can do a-e, you'll be a much better tester. �You will also be able to /explain/ and /train/ and /mentor/ people on what you do.

That may sound a bit ... agressive�of me, but unless you really study what is actually happening in software testing, attempts to automate it with likely have (A) Inflated expectations, (B) be overly expensive, and (C) under-deliver. �

/*Or*/ attempts at automated testing might not be about testing at all, but end up being about better defining the specification, helping the developers know when they are done, and communication across the entire team - technical and non-technical. �The ATDD literature tends to end up in this "clump."

Nothing's wrong with that, but those are /not/ the benefits I'm looking for when *I* test.

A deep study of testing will also allow you to de-mystify testing to the Hosers(*) who think "automated" testing is a simple, predictable, repeatable process that is begging to be automated. � You'll be able to do more 'smart' automation - automated test setup, build verification, smoke tests, etc.

Finally, after you've studied testing, I'd look into real computer science -- probably C# or Java -- deep enough to have two semesters of computer programming experience. �(That is, "Test Automation" is really (a) studying the actual process of testing then (b) automating /what you can/. �(b) is pure computer science with a few tricks, tidbits, tools and frameworks thrown it.)

Here's a few references I recommend; you can probably get them free from inter-library loan:

Testing Computer Software, 2nd Edition, Kaner

Lessons Learned in Software Testing, Kaner/Bach/Pettichord

Black Box Software Testing, Beizer (ugh. �It's a slog. �And you'll learn five things and throw out fifty. �But it's worth reading.)

Software Testing, a Craftsman's Approach, Jorgensen

How to Decrease the Cost of Software Testing, Heusser/Kulkarni (est. release date, Aug. 2011)

Quality Software Management, Vols I-IV, Gerald M. Weinberg

On Becoming a Technical Leader, Gerald M. Weinberg

For automated /customer facing/ testing, the best references I know of are URLs:

Testing Vs. Checking, Bolton�http://www.developsense.com/blog/2009/08/testing-vs-checking/

What is a test framework - Myself(**) -�http://xndev.blogspot.com/2007/09/whats-test-framework.html

Test Automation Snake Oil, Bach:�www.satisfice.com/articles/test_automation_snake_oil.pdf

What�

After that I'd suggest looking into the differences between developer-facing (TDD) and customer-facing tests - then maybe a specific framework or two. �Selenium if you'd like to drive a browser, Fitness if you can get away with "just" testing the business logic.

I realize some folks here disagree with me; they might disagree with strong language. �That's okay. �You see - the important thing isn't what I say or what someone else says , shelly, it's what /*you do*/ in response. �If we can provide some advice along the way, well, I'd be pleased.

I hope this helps, or was at least harmless.

all my best,

regards,

--
Matthew Heusser,
Personal Blog: http://xndev.blogspot.com/
Test Community Blog: http://softwaretestpro.com/blog/
Twitter: mheusser

(*) - I'm allowed to say that; it is a misprononciation of my own name.

(**) - When I checked it was the #1 google search result for "what is a test framework", so I'm comfortable recommending it.

Reply | Messages in this Topic (5)

#1490

From: Markus Gaertner <shino@...>
Date: Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:58 pm
Subject: Re: Visual chart of the "ATDD" flow

shino01051979

Send Email

Hi Ted,

I could, though the terms used should be similar to the ones that Gojko uses in
his upcoming book.

Reading the painting from the top left, the money on the finish line represent
the /business goals/. The arrow to /Scope/ depicts to /derive the scope from
the business goals/. Next, /identification of core examples/ yields /examples/.
These core examples are /refined/ to yield a /Specification by examples/. By
/automating these literally/, we get an /executable specification/. Through
/frequent execution/, a /living documentation system/ emerges.

On the Visual Facilitation workshop, it was held by the KommunikationsLotsen,
and we learned in some easy steps how to draw different things. Oh, we draw
nearly all day there, so this gave us a lot of practice. Things included were:
- draw lines and circles
- draw simple things
- containers and frames
- persons
- arms and hands
- crafting a masterpiece



Best
Markus Gaertner

On 02/06/2011 08:59 PM, Ted M. Young [@jitterted] wrote:
> Hi Markus,
>
> Looks nice...any chance you could translate the German to English? I could
> probably guess, but I'd rather not. :-)
>
> Would also love to hear about the visual facilitation course itself!
>
> ;ted
>
> On Sat, Feb 5, 2011 at 8:18 AM, Markus Gaertner<shino@...>  wrote:
>
>> During the past two days I attended a course on visual facilitation. On the
>> last day we were asked to build our masterpiece. Together with two
>> colleagues I
>> worked on the "ATDD" flow. For anyone who hasn't seen it on twitter where I
>> posted it yesterday, here's the shot of the final visual that we created.
>> (Texts in German). It was a lot of fun.
>>
>> Best
>> --
>> Markus Gaertner
>> http://blog.shino.de
>> Twitter: @mgaertne
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------
>>
>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>>
>


--
Markus Gaertner
http://blog.shino.de
Twitter: @mgaertne

Reply | Messages in this Topic (3)

#1491

From: Elfriede Dustin <edustin@...>
Date: Sat Feb 12, 2011 2:47 pm
Subject: RE: [SPAM] - Automated Testing Books - Email found in subject

enjoy_testing

Send Email

Hi Shelly,

I am the co-author of the book “Implementing Automated Software Testing” you are inquiring about.

To give you some additional ideas about the content of the book and to help you make a more informed decision, here are a few articles that are summarized from the book

· “The Business Case for Automated Software Testing” http://www.automatedtestinginstitute.com/home/ASTMagazine/2009/AutomatedSoftwareTestingMagazine_May2009.pdf

· “Why Automate,” http://www.informit.com/articles/article.aspx?p=1332758

· “Useful automated test metrics” http://idtus.com/img/UsefulAutomatedTestingMetrics.pdf

· Here are two different podcasts about the book http://www.automatedtestinginstitute.com/home/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1230 and http://www.informit.com/podcasts/episode.aspx?e=90d9ba74-b228-4e43-a3d1-778cb36c1b1f

· …and a bit of trivia – the book won best book of the year 2010, by the Automated Testing Institute, see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaChdom80uU&feature=related

· Here is a summary of our “Automated Software Testing Lifecycle Methodology” based on the predecessor book “Automated Software Testing” if you are interested in processes surrounding automated testing http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8774618466715423597#

And finally, in case you haven’t seen the Table of Content of “Implementing Automated Software Testing,” here it is:

Preface

Chapter 1: What is Automated Software Testing (AST)
1.1 Automated Software Testing Definition
1.2 Automated Software Testing Recipes
1.3 Advances in Automated Software Testing Technologies
1.4 Automating various Software Testing Types
1.5 Providing Automated Software Testing Based Production Support
1.6 Automating Standards Assessments
1.7 Summary

Chapter 2: Why Automate?
2.1 The Challenges of Testing Software Today
2.2 Reducing the Time and Cost of Software Testing
2.3 Impacting Software Quality

2.4 Improvements to Your Software Test Program
2.5 Summary

Chapter 3: The Business Case
3.1 Definition of the Business Case
3.2 Identifying the Business Needs
3.3. Justifying it in Terms of Cost and Benefits
3.4 Risks
3.5 Other Considerations
3.6 Summary

Chapter 4: Why does Automated Software Testing Fail and Pitfalls to Avoid
4.1 Research and Development does not generally focus on automated or manual testing efforts
4.2 Automated Software Testing Myths and Realities
4.4 Lack of Software Development Considerations for Automated Software Testing
4.5 The Forest for the Trees—Not knowing which tool to pick
4.6 Lack of Automation Standards across tool vendors
4.7 Lack of Business Case
4.8 Summary

Chapter 5: Key 1—Know Your Requirements
5.1 Information Gathering and Development
5.2 When Information Is Not Available
5.3 Start Implementing Your Requirements Traceability Matrix (RTM)
5.4 Summary

Chapter 6: Key 2—Develop the Automated Test Strategy
6.1 Overview
6.2 Scope and Automated Test Objectives
6.3 Identify Approach
6.4 Automated Test Management Framework
6.5 Automated Test Environment Management
6.6 Testing Environment / Configuration

Chapter 7: Key 3—Document and Peer-review Test Cases
7.1 Documenting Test Cases
7.2 Requirements Check
7.3 Review Test Cases
7.4 Example Test Cases

Chapter 8: Key 4—Continuously Track Progress—And Adjust Accordingly
8.1 Automated Testing Metrics
8.2 Other Software Testing Metrics
8.3 Summary

Chapter 9: Key 5—Implement Automated Software Testing Processes
9.1 Automated Software Testing Phase 1: Requirements Gathering—Analyze Automated Testing Needs
9.2 Automated Software Testing Phase 2: Manual Test Case Development and Review
9.3 Automated Software Testing Phase 3: Automated Framework and Test Script Development
9.4 Automated Software Testing Phase 4: Automated Test Execution and Results Reporting
9.5 Automated Software Testing Phase 5: Program Review and Assessment

Chapter 10: Key 6—Putting the Right People on the Project—Knowing the Skill Sets Required
10.1 Program Management
10.2 System Engineering
10.3 Software Development
10.4 Configuration Management
10.5 Quality Assurance
10.6 Summary

Appendix A: Process Checklist
Appendix B: Automated Software Testing (AST) applied to various testing types (more)
Appendix C: The Right Tool for the Job
Appendix D: Case Study: An Automated Testing Framework Example

If you need additional info, don’t hesitate to contact me.

Elfriede Dustin

http://www.amazon.com/Elfriede-Dustin/e/B001IO9RTM/ref=ntt_athr_dp_pel_1

From: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Shelly
Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2011 10:44 PM
To: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [SPAM] - [aa-ftt] Automated Testing Books - Email found in subject

Does anyone have suggestions for good books or websites regarding implementing automated testing? Something geared toward less technical QA/BA staff. I saw this on Amazon, has anyone read it? I'd like to get some good suggestions before I ask my PM to buy anything.

Also, while I'm thinking about it, if you started off as a QA tester, what technical skills have you found to be useful to learn along the way? I think the first tool I want to pick up is a scripting language, but I'd love to hear about everyone's experiences. I don't want to become a developer, but I do want to gain enough technical skills to do more than exploratory testing based solely on instinct about what breaks software.

Thanks!

Shelly

Reply | Messages in this Topic (5)

#1492

From: Shelly <shellyfld@...>
Date: Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:19 am
Subject: Re: RE: [SPAM] - Automated Testing Books - Email found in subject

kaia5977

Send Email

I really appreciate the thorough answers. Thank you all! I am completely swamped with work and family so I haven't yet digested all the info, but I will be back with more questions.
Take care,
Shelly

On Feb 12, 2011 8:47 AM, "Elfriede Dustin" <edustin@...> wrote:
> Hi Shelly,
>
> I am the co-author of the book "Implementing Automated Software Testing" you are inquiring about.
>
> To give you some additional ideas about the content of the book and to help you make a more informed decision, here are a few articles that are summarized from the book
>
> * "The Business Case for Automated Software Testing" http://www.automatedtestinginstitute.com/home/ASTMagazine/2009/AutomatedSoftwareTestingMagazine_May2009.pdf
>
> * "Why Automate," http://www.informit.com/articles/article.aspx?p=1332758
>
> * "Useful automated test metrics" http://idtus.com/img/UsefulAutomatedTestingMetrics.pdf
>
> * Here are two different podcasts about the book http://www.automatedtestinginstitute.com/home/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1230 and http://www.informit.com/podcasts/episode.aspx?e=90d9ba74-b228-4e43-a3d1-778cb36c1b1f
>
> * ...and a bit of trivia - the book won best book of the year 2010, by the Automated Testing Institute, see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaChdom80uU&feature=related
>
> * Here is a summary of our "Automated Software Testing Lifecycle Methodology" based on the predecessor book "Automated Software Testing" if you are interested in processes surrounding automated testing http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8774618466715423597#<http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8774618466715423597>
>
> And finally, in case you haven't seen the Table of Content of "Implementing Automated Software Testing," here it is:
>
> Preface
>
> Chapter 1: What is Automated Software Testing (AST)
> 1.1 Automated Software Testing Definition
> 1.2 Automated Software Testing Recipes
> 1.3 Advances in Automated Software Testing Technologies
> 1.4 Automating various Software Testing Types
> 1.5 Providing Automated Software Testing Based Production Support
> 1.6 Automating Standards Assessments
> 1.7 Summary
>
> Chapter 2: Why Automate?
> 2.1 The Challenges of Testing Software Today
> 2.2 Reducing the Time and Cost of Software Testing
> 2.3 Impacting Software Quality
> 2.4 Improvements to Your Software Test Program
> 2.5 Summary
>
> Chapter 3: The Business Case
> 3.1 Definition of the Business Case
> 3.2 Identifying the Business Needs
> 3.3. Justifying it in Terms of Cost and Benefits
> 3.4 Risks
> 3.5 Other Considerations
> 3.6 Summary
>
> Chapter 4: Why does Automated Software Testing Fail and Pitfalls to Avoid
> 4.1 Research and Development does not generally focus on automated or manual testing efforts
> 4.2 Automated Software Testing Myths and Realities
> 4.4 Lack of Software Development Considerations for Automated Software Testing
> 4.5 The Forest for the Trees-Not knowing which tool to pick
> 4.6 Lack of Automation Standards across tool vendors
> 4.7 Lack of Business Case
> 4.8 Summary
>
> Chapter 5: Key 1-Know Your Requirements
> 5.1 Information Gathering and Development
> 5.2 When Information Is Not Available
> 5.3 Start Implementing Your Requirements Traceability Matrix (RTM)
> 5.4 Summary
>
> Chapter 6: Key 2-Develop the Automated Test Strategy
> 6.1 Overview
> 6.2 Scope and Automated Test Objectives
> 6.3 Identify Approach
> 6.4 Automated Test Management Framework
> 6.5 Automated Test Environment Management
> 6.6 Testing Environment / Configuration
>
> Chapter 7: Key 3-Document and Peer-review Test Cases
> 7.1 Documenting Test Cases
> 7.2 Requirements Check
> 7.3 Review Test Cases
> 7.4 Example Test Cases
>
> Chapter 8: Key 4-Continuously Track Progress-And Adjust Accordingly
> 8.1 Automated Testing Metrics
> 8.2 Other Software Testing Metrics
> 8.3 Summary
>
> Chapter 9: Key 5-Implement Automated Software Testing Processes
> 9.1 Automated Software Testing Phase 1: Requirements Gathering-Analyze Automated Testing Needs
> 9.2 Automated Software Testing Phase 2: Manual Test Case Development and Review
> 9.3 Automated Software Testing Phase 3: Automated Framework and Test Script Development
> 9.4 Automated Software Testing Phase 4: Automated Test Execution and Results Reporting
> 9.5 Automated Software Testing Phase 5: Program Review and Assessment
>
> Chapter 10: Key 6-Putting the Right People on the Project-Knowing the Skill Sets Required
> 10.1 Program Management
> 10.2 System Engineering
> 10.3 Software Development
> 10.4 Configuration Management
> 10.5 Quality Assurance
> 10.6 Summary
>
> Appendix A: Process Checklist
> Appendix B: Automated Software Testing (AST) applied to various testing types (more)
> Appendix C: The Right Tool for the Job
> Appendix D: Case Study: An Automated Testing Framework Example
>
> If you need additional info, don't hesitate to contact me.
>
> Elfriede Dustin
> http://www.amazon.com/Elfriede-Dustin/e/B001IO9RTM/ref=ntt_athr_dp_pel_1
>
>
> From: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Shelly
> Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2011 10:44 PM
> To: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [SPAM] - [aa-ftt] Automated Testing Books - Email found in subject
>
>
>
> Does anyone have suggestions for good books or websites regarding implementing automated testing? Something geared toward less technical QA/BA staff. I saw this<http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0321580516/ref=s9_wishf_gw_t?ie=UTF8&coliid=I2VE39NOPEJ8GH&colid=HGY647SEHA03&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=right-3&pf_rd_r=15ACP0SGF2AFNGK1RZSQ&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=481918071&pf_rd_i=507846> on Amazon, has anyone read it? I'd like to get some good suggestions before I ask my PM to buy anything.
>
> Also, while I'm thinking about it, if you started off as a QA tester, what technical skills have you found to be useful to learn along the way? I think the first tool I want to pick up is a scripting language, but I'd love to hear about everyone's experiences. I don't want to become a developer, but I do want to gain enough technical skills to do more than exploratory testing based solely on instinct about what breaks software.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Shelly
>

Reply | Messages in this Topic (5)

#1493

From: Elisabeth Hendrickson <esh@...>
Date: Tue Feb 15, 2011 4:54 pm
Subject: Wiki

elisabethshe...

Send Email

Hi all,

A group of us gathered at Agilistry Studio yesterday for the 3rd annual Open Source Test Automation Tool Love In (OSTATLI). Our focus this time was primarily on tools that support Acceptance Test Driven Development.

As a result of our discussions we ended up with a matrix comparing the tools we discussed. Sue Bartlett very kindly transcribed the matrix and posted it to the AA-FTT wiki. (Hey, did you know we have a Wiki? Huge thanks to Declan Whelan, we do.)

You can find the matrix from OSTATLI here:

http://aaftt.agilealliance.org:8080/display/AAFTT/High+Level+Automated+Test+Framework+Comparison

Hope it's useful for folks.

Thanks,

Elisabeth

------------------------------------------

Elisabeth Hendrickson

Quality Tree Software, Inc.

http://www.qualitytree.com

http://www.testobsessed.com

Reply | Messages in this Topic (12)

#1494

From: Lisa Crispin <lisa.crispin@...>
Date: Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:29 pm
Subject: Re: Wiki

lisa_crispin...

Send Email

Awesome! Thanks (and thanks to Declan for the wiki, also!)

On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 9:54 AM, Elisabeth Hendrickson <esh@...> wrote:

�

Hi all,

A group of us gathered at Agilistry Studio yesterday for the 3rd annual Open Source Test Automation Tool Love In (OSTATLI). Our focus this time was primarily on tools that support Acceptance Test Driven Development.�

As a result of our discussions we ended up with a matrix comparing the tools we discussed. Sue Bartlett very kindly transcribed the matrix and posted it to the AA-FTT wiki. (Hey, did you know we have a Wiki? Huge thanks to Declan Whelan, we do.)�

You can find the matrix from OSTATLI here:

http://aaftt.agilealliance.org:8080/display/AAFTT/High+Level+Automated+Test+Framework+Comparison

Hope it's useful for folks.

Thanks,

Elisabeth

------------------------------------------
Elisabeth Hendrickson
Quality Tree Software, Inc.
http://www.qualitytree.com
http://www.testobsessed.com

--
Lisa Crispin
Co-author with Janet Gregory, _Agile Testing: A Practical Guide for Testers and Agile Teams_ (Addison-Wesley 2009)
Contributor to _Beautiful Testing_ (O'Reilly 2009)
http://lisacrispin.com
@lisacrispin on Twitter

Reply | Messages in this Topic (12)

#1495

From: Eileen Wei <ewei@...>
Date: Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:32 pm
Subject: RE: Wiki

eileen_wly

Send Email

I cannot access the link, is it just me?

-Eileen

From: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Elisabeth Hendrickson
Sent: February-15-11 9:54 AM
To: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [aa-ftt] Wiki

Hi all,

You can find the matrix from OSTATLI here:

http://aaftt.agilealliance.org:8080/display/AAFTT/High+Level+Automated+Test+Framework+Comparison

Hope it's useful for folks.

Thanks,

Elisabeth

------------------------------------------

Elisabeth Hendrickson

Quality Tree Software, Inc.

http://www.qualitytree.com

http://www.testobsessed.com

Reply | Messages in this Topic (12)

#1496

From: Lisa Crispin <lisa.crispin@...>
Date: Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:33 pm
Subject: Re: Wiki

lisa_crispin...

Send Email

Ummm, it worked fine for me, I just clicked on the link in Elisabeth's email.
-- Lisa

On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 10:32 AM, Eileen Wei <ewei@...> wrote:

�

I cannot access the link, is it just me?
-Eileen

�
From: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Elisabeth Hendrickson
Sent: February-15-11 9:54 AM
To: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [aa-ftt] Wiki
�
�
Hi all,
�
A group of us gathered at Agilistry Studio yesterday for the 3rd annual Open Source Test Automation Tool Love In (OSTATLI). Our focus this time was primarily on tools that support Acceptance Test Driven Development.�

�
As a result of our discussions we ended up with a matrix comparing the tools we discussed. Sue Bartlett very kindly transcribed the matrix and posted it to the AA-FTT wiki. (Hey, did you know we have a Wiki? Huge thanks to Declan Whelan, we do.)�

�
You can find the matrix from OSTATLI here:
�
http://aaftt.agilealliance.org:8080/display/AAFTT/High+Level+Automated+Test+Framework+Comparison

�
Hope it's useful for folks.
�
Thanks,
�

Elisabeth
------------------------------------------
Elisabeth Hendrickson

Quality Tree Software, Inc.
http://www.qualitytree.com

http://www.testobsessed.com
�

Reply | Messages in this Topic (12)

#1497

From: Steve Rogalsky <acmsdad@...>
Date: Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:49 pm
Subject: Re: Wiki

steve_rogalsky

Send Email

It worked for me too. Thanks for putting this together.

Steve

On 2011-02-15, at 11:33 AM, Lisa Crispin <lisa.crispin@...> wrote:

Ummm, it worked fine for me, I just clicked on the link in Elisabeth's email.
-- Lisa

On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 10:32 AM, Eileen Wei <ewei@...> wrote:

I cannot access the link, is it just me?
-Eileen

From: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Elisabeth Hendrickson
Sent: February-15-11 9:54 AM
To: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [aa-ftt] Wiki

Hi all,

A group of us gathered at Agilistry Studio yesterday for the 3rd annual Open Source Test Automation Tool Love In (OSTATLI). Our focus this time was primarily on tools that support Acceptance Test Driven Development.

As a result of our discussions we ended up with a matrix comparing the tools we discussed. Sue Bartlett very kindly transcribed the matrix and posted it to the AA-FTT wiki. (Hey, did you know we have a Wiki? Huge thanks to Declan Whelan, we do.)

You can find the matrix from OSTATLI here:

http://aaftt.agilealliance.org:8080/display/AAFTT/High+Level+Automated+Test+Framework+Comparison

Hope it's useful for folks.

Thanks,

Elisabeth
------------------------------------------
Elisabeth Hendrickson

Quality Tree Software, Inc.
http://www.qualitytree.com

http://www.testobsessed.com

--
Lisa Crispin
Co-author with Janet Gregory, _Agile Testing: A Practical Guide for Testers and Agile Teams_ (Addison-Wesley 2009)
Contributor to _Beautiful Testing_ (O'Reilly 2009)
http://lisacrispin.com
@lisacrispin on Twitter

Reply | Messages in this Topic (12)

#1498

From: Aslak Hellesøy <aslak.hellesoy@...>
Date: Tue Feb 15, 2011 7:20 pm
Subject: Re: Wiki

aslak_hellesoy

Send Email

On Feb 15, 2011, at 17:32, Eileen Wei <ewei@...> wrote:

I cannot access the link, is it just me?

Most people behind a firewall won't be able to access web sites running on port 8080 (or other non-standard ports).

Aslak

-Eileen

From: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com [mailto:aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Elisabeth Hendrickson
Sent: February-15-11 9:54 AM
To: aa-ftt@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [aa-ftt] Wiki

Hi all,

A group of us gathered at Agilistry Studio yesterday for the 3rd annual Open Source Test Automation Tool Love In (OSTATLI). Our focus this time was primarily on tools that support Acceptance Test Driven Development.

As a result of our discussions we ended up with a matrix comparing the tools we discussed. Sue Bartlett very kindly transcribed the matrix and posted it to the AA-FTT wiki. (Hey, did you know we have a Wiki? Huge thanks to Declan Whelan, we do.)

You can find the matrix from OSTATLI here:

http://aaftt.agilealliance.org:8080/display/AAFTT/High+Level+Automated+Test+Framework+Comparison

Hope it's useful for folks.

Thanks,

Elisabeth
------------------------------------------

Elisabeth Hendrickson
Quality Tree Software, Inc.

http://www.qualitytree.com

http://www.testobsessed.com

Reply | Messages in this Topic (12)

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