If you were to think of an assembly line making something, the user roles would be the various stations on the assembly line. Door installer, Trim Installer,...
2707
Jon Meads
jonmeads
Nov 27, 2006 9:00 pm
Alain, I don't think we are in disagreement. If Jim and Martha have different relationships with the system at different times and and that results in ...
2708
john.kruse43
Nov 28, 2006 3:58 am
I have always found Jared Spool to be interesting and insightful. The company is called User Interface Engineering www.uie.com They offer seminars, more than a...
2709
Adrian Howard
ajh65537
Nov 28, 2006 11:58 am
... That's my understanding of roles. But I was reading Jon as saying something different. My reading of John was that he'd view the 'Nearly Retired Door ...
2710
Adrian Howard
ajh65537
Nov 28, 2006 12:00 pm
... Okay, but are there ever roles that are shared between persona? Adrian...
2711
Desilets, Alain
alain_desilets
Nov 28, 2006 12:29 pm
... roles would be ... Installer, etc. The ... savvy...) , "Nearly ... teach me ... Steward? Where ... It's interesting that you would bring up this assembly...
2712
Bruce Esrig
bruce_esrig
Nov 28, 2006 1:35 pm
Here's an up-to-date URL for the ComputerWorld article about eBay and gradual changes: ...
2713
Jared M. Spool
jmspool
Nov 28, 2006 4:19 pm
... Thanks for the endorsement! That was very kind. Gerard or anyone interested in talking about training: Please feel free to pop me a note or call. Jared ...
2714
Jon Meads
jonmeads
Nov 28, 2006 5:15 pm
The answer lies not in the examples but in the goals with relation to their use of the system. Does a "'Nearly Retired Door Installer" on the assembly line...
2715
Jon Meads
jonmeads
Nov 28, 2006 5:58 pm
Given that persona are fictional exemplary individuals, I find it less confusing to create personas for each role but I can't see any reason why a given...
2716
Miinalainen, Petteri
pmiinalainen
Nov 29, 2006 8:38 am
Yes. It's actually very typical situation, imho. Role is something that a persona takes in business process and therefore as an actor/user of the system under...
2717
Adrian Howard
ajh65537
Nov 29, 2006 1:41 pm
... In general I agree. I'm just poking (in a nice curious way ;-) at the way Jon splits his persona and roles since it seems different from the way I do it. ...
2718
SusRobson@...
susrobson
Nov 29, 2006 2:30 pm
I grew up in a factory town and I can tell you that all assembly line workers have the same goal--meet the quota for the day without going over that quota....
2719
Jared M. Spool
jmspool
Nov 29, 2006 3:01 pm
Personas define the differences that lead to different behaviors. While the personas may share the same goal, the way they behave when achieving that goal can...
2720
Adrian Howard
ajh65537
Nov 29, 2006 3:20 pm
... Fortunately not all factories are like that. I've known many assembly line workers who take a stupid amount of pride in their work. Even before all that...
2721
Adrian Howard
ajh65537
Nov 29, 2006 3:20 pm
On 28 Nov 2006, at 12:07, Desilets, Alain wrote: [snip] ... [snip] I have to admit that I've not really noticed this difference. I question whether would we...
2722
Adrian Howard
ajh65537
Nov 29, 2006 3:32 pm
... Thanks. This makes sense and gels with my understanding of roles/ persona. Cheers, Adrian...
2723
Adrian Howard
ajh65537
Nov 29, 2006 4:27 pm
... This might explain why we have slightly different approaches. I tend to extract roles from persona, rather than create persona for roles. Obviously there...
2724
Desilets, Alain
alain_desilets
Nov 29, 2006 5:36 pm
... Like I said, that's certainly not the case for consumer products. But in the corporate world, I think individual goals are to a large extent defined by the...
2725
Don Brenner
ratmonkeychunk
Nov 29, 2006 7:41 pm
We use a combination of both approaches. For the role of customer we have a rich set of personas that define the different goals and motivations of the...
2726
Jared M. Spool
jmspool
Nov 29, 2006 9:16 pm
... Yes and no. You're not taking into account "gaming effects", such as when an employee follows the rules, as specified, to their own benefit, in spite of...
2727
Jon Kern
jonkernpa
Nov 30, 2006 7:27 am
interesting to capture that level of a persona's behavior. never ran across that before. though gaming the system, or inadvertently making a situation that ...
2728
Desilets, Alain
alain_desilets
Nov 30, 2006 1:46 pm
... I agree absolutely! Like I said when I first wrote on this thread, I think both User Roles and Personaes are needed, and I think that this holds for both...
2729
Jared M. Spool
jmspool
Nov 30, 2006 2:25 pm
Jon, I think I understand what you're asking for. One of the first examples I ran into was 30 years ago, when designing the early word processors. We'd visited...
2730
Jared M. Spool
jmspool
Nov 30, 2006 2:39 pm
... I think statements like "corporate people like roles while consumer products like personas" have more exceptions than factual background, but let's go with...
2731
Desilets, Alain
alain_desilets
Nov 30, 2006 3:50 pm
... That may very well be. I can't claim to have ample evidence of that. It's just a hunch based on personal conversations with a handful of people I know who...
2732
Desilets, Alain
alain_desilets
Nov 30, 2006 3:57 pm
... An example is the time tracking system at my employer's. The employer's goal is to have up to date and accurate information about what the employees are...
2733
Jon Kern
jonkernpa
Nov 30, 2006 7:04 pm
Does anyone have a *favorite* set of tools for C++/C#...? Visual Studio Team System MKS Borland ??? Do you have some tools/suites you have worked with and...
2734
Miinalainen, Petteri
pmiinalainen
Nov 30, 2006 10:28 pm
In my experience the workplace in corporate as well as in public sector isn't that homogenous. Last year I participated in designing system for public sector....
2735
mhpries
Dec 1, 2006 2:39 am
... consumer ... Not just a hunch, but a more subtle difference here that should be considered. When people talk about "corporate" software, it is not always...
