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Reply | Forward Message #15504 of 17538 |
Re: [ai-philosophy] Re: Religion

Thanks for the correction!
The full text of Boole's remarkable 1853 book is at
http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/15114
He refers to Spinoza and to a Samuel Clarke; there might be some
others, but the book has no bibliography.

I don't have time to read it now, but I suspect that it has a lot of
"new" ideas. That is, "new" in the sense that
(1) it all seems extremely original and 'fresh' and
(2) I suspect that few recent philosophers have read it.


On Aug 24, 2008, at 5:04 PM, AT Murray wrote:

> --- In ai-philosophy@yahoogroups.com, Marvin Minsky <minsky@...>
> wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Aug 24, 2008, at 10:26 AM, Jim Bromer wrote:
>> [...]
>>
>> This is a beautiful illustration. One asks about the
>> origin of Logic and hears some answers:
>> 1. It came from Boole
>> 2. But Boole learned from Aristotle,
>> 3. Who, in turn, learned, Socrates,
>> 4. Who, in turn, learned from Plato,
>> 5. Who, in turn, learned from God,
>> 6. Which means, "Stop Asking This Question."
>
> The sequence goes more like the following.
>
> 1. It came from Boole
> 2. But Boole learned from Aristotle,
> 3. Who, in turn, learned from Plato,
> 4. Who, in turn, learned, from Socrates,
> 5. Who, in turn, learned from God,
> 6. Which means, "Stop Asking This Question."
>
> Plato was the "channeler" of Socrates.
>
> Mentifex (Mindmaker)
> --
> http://mind.sourceforge.net/aisteps.html
>




Sun Aug 24, 2008 9:41 pm

minskymarvin
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Message #15504 of 17538 |
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I just discovered that I made a very obvious blunder on my theory about Logical Satisfiability last November. It was a, "what was I thinking," kind of error....
Jim Bromer
jimbromer
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Aug 23, 2008
11:04 am

... As far as I can tell, this is a contradiction (given the traditional religious definition of "the Lord" and standard definition of "logic"). It could be...
John J. Gagne
john_j_gagne
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Aug 23, 2008
4:23 pm

Although I am not sure what John was saying, I do appreciate the way he said it. I don't think that repeated personal comments about subjects that do not...
Jim Bromer
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Aug 24, 2008
2:26 pm

... Well, I'll do the best I can... I tend to think that your choice of language above ("The Lord's logic is awesome") implies a reference to the traditional...
John J. Gagne
john_j_gagne
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Aug 24, 2008
3:37 pm

... logic is awesome") implies a reference to the traditional Biblical use of the Holy Trinity (father, son, holy spirit). This choice of language implies a...
Jim Bromer
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Aug 24, 2008
4:58 pm

No, no, no... What I was saying was nothing beyond the logical fact that: If you assume the axiom of supernatalism (*AND*) I reject it then we can expect that...
John J. Gagne
john_j_gagne
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Aug 24, 2008
5:27 pm

... This is a beautiful illustration. One asks about the origin of Logic and hears some answers: 1. It came from Boole 2. But Boole learned from Aristotle, ...
Marvin Minsky
minskymarvin
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Aug 24, 2008
4:30 pm

... You know, normally I would agree with you Marvin. But it seems in Jim's case, he seems to be suggesting that (somehow) "religious explanations" can provide...
John J. Gagne
john_j_gagne
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Aug 24, 2008
6:06 pm

Is there really a need to seek an origin to logic? Observers in a reality which is ordered enough to permit meaningful observation will naturally find there...
Ray Gardener
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Aug 24, 2008
7:55 pm

... What a piece of work is a man! How noble in reason! how infinite in faculty! in form, in moving, how express and admirable! in action how like an angel! in...
John J. Gagne
john_j_gagne
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Aug 24, 2008
8:51 pm

Gods and men... an interesting comparison. Let's say that one did contemplate a different logic system, one that borrowed nothing from ours, and he discovered...
Ray Gardener
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Aug 24, 2008
10:43 pm

... The fault of your essay lies in the work "mere," because "mechanism" means understanding the causes of things. Also, "free will" means to do things for no...
Marvin Minsky
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Aug 25, 2008
12:38 am

... Well I agree that mechanistic explanations are preferable. I might even argue that anything less is not an explanation at all. The problem is, as far as I...
John J. Gagne
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Aug 25, 2008
2:50 pm

... And what is the problem with that? More specifically what is your definition of intelligence? Making a car analogy, I would say that being "more ...
George
fidiasma
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Aug 25, 2008
4:03 pm

... Hi George: Here is how I responded to Fred Martin as to my definition of intelligent system: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/ai-philosophy/message/15453...
John J. Gagne
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Aug 25, 2008
4:14 pm

... I don't see why we have to have an axiom of choise. Computers seem to work ok without one. (If your answer is that computers don't have and cannot have ...
George
fidiasma
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Aug 25, 2008
8:53 pm

... George: Keep in mind that I'm make no claim either way, whether we make choices or don't. My only claim is if we wish to speak of intelligent system then...
John J. Gagne
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Aug 25, 2008
11:42 pm

... <john_j_gagne@...> wrote: Re: Religion ... What other kinds of explanations are there apart from mechanical or make believe explanations? ... Choice means...
jgkjcasey
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Aug 25, 2008
11:57 pm

... "Explanations" provide and imply understanding. Axioms/postulates/assumption are (should be) intuitively understood. While these are not "explanations"...
John J. Gagne
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Aug 26, 2008
12:06 am

... I mean "mere mechanism" in the truly robotic sense, whereby the complete behavior and nature of a thing can be known. I take it as axiomatic that there are...
Ray Gardener
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Aug 26, 2008
3:30 am

I had an interesting thought, given the maximization of meaning, to reinterpret the Lord's Prayer: Our Father, which art in heaven, ... the maximization of...
Ray Gardener
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Aug 31, 2008
5:54 pm

... Ray Gardener suggested that I should inject a bit more humor to keep things interesting. The funny truth is I had no idea when I quoted this that I was...
John J. Gagne
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Aug 31, 2008
2:48 pm

Oh irony, verily... for I asked not to be able to do what the gods do, but merely to understand them. But even that, it seems, requires us mere mortals to...
Ray Gardener
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Aug 31, 2008
8:21 pm

... Brad Pitt: "Let me tell you a secret, something they don't teach you in your temple. The Gods envy us. They envy us because we're mortal, because any...
John J. Gagne
john_j_gagne
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Aug 31, 2008
10:58 pm

... The sequence goes more like the following. 1. It came from Boole 2. But Boole learned from Aristotle, 3. Who, in turn, learned from Plato, 4. Who, in turn,...
AT Murray
mentifex
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Aug 24, 2008
9:04 pm

Thanks for the correction! The full text of Boole's remarkable 1853 book is at http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/15114 He refers to Spinoza and to a Samuel...
Marvin Minsky
minskymarvin
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Aug 24, 2008
9:42 pm

... Sorry I got Plato and Socrates mixed up. Your response comes from your mind not mine. I never said that anyone should Stop Asking This Question. This is...
Jim Bromer
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Aug 25, 2008
1:44 am

Unfortunately, I discovered that I did not make a mistake last November after all. However, I do believe that a solution to the logical satisfiability problem...
Jim Bromer
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Aug 24, 2008
2:09 pm
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