Mobile, Enterprise and Consumer Software Engineering Jobs With Verticalmove.

Interested in finding a new position close to your home? Perhaps you've
considered
moving into the Web_2.0 or Mobile space because it's more exciting? Verticalmove
is
working with a number of client companies in the Enterprise, Consumer and Mobile
software space. Please visit our jobs page for more information on our current
positions:
verticalmove.com/jobs

Development Positions
http://verticalmove.com/open_positions.php?cat=Development

Web Development Positions
http://verticalmove.com/open_positions.php?cat=Web%20Development

Quality Assurance Positions
http://verticalmove.com/open_positions.php?cat=Quality%20Assurance

Product Management Positions
http://verticalmove.com/open_positions.php?cat=Product%20Mgmt


[Client in Mobile Software]
The leader in mobile wireless email, located in the heart of the penninsula, is
looking to
add extraordinary talent to its already established Engineering group. Our 7
year old client
is partnered with the world's leading handset manufacturers including: Nokia,
Motorola,
Sony Ericsson, Samsung and Siemens and the worlds top service providers
including
Cingular Wireless, Globe Telecom, Hutchison, KDDI Corp., NTT DoCoMo, SingTel,
Sprint
Nextel, Telefonica Moviles, Telkom Indonesia and Yahoo to provide individuals
and fortune
500 companies alike to access email on the mobile device of choice. With offices
across
the globe, this stable growing company continues to revolutionize the future of
hand-held
devices. Their services are offered in over 60 countries and are available
across 2.5 and 3G
networks. Their services are shipping on over 200 mobile device models
supporting every
major device operating system including: BREW, J2ME, Microsoft Windows Mobile,
Palm OS
and Symbian-based phones, and PDAs.

[Client in Web_2.0 Software]
Verticalmove is working with a very exciting, stealth-mode, consumer- facing Web
2.0
client that is backed by some of the most respected individuals in the Silicon
Valley area.
Their recent round of funding was led by the famous Angel Investor who was the
first to
finance Google and helped seed other companies such as Ask.com and Topica to
name a
few. This round of financing was oversubscribed and they turned away potential
investors.
It's additionally backed by a leading Silicon Valley venture firm, First Round
Capital, and
strategic angel investors, including top former or current executives from eBay,
Intuit,
Google, Yahoo, Charles Schwab, Reuters, Adteractive and Weblogic/BEA.

[Client in Enterprise Security]
This company is a global security software company, considered the leader in
email and
data encryption. During the past 10 years, their technology has earned a
reputation for
innovative, standards-based, trusted solutions. Their solutions are used by more
than
80,000 enterprises, businesses, and governments worldwide, including 95 percent
of the
Fortune® 100. Customers depend on these solutions as part of a regulatory and
audit
compliance solution, to protect confidential information, secure customer data,
and
safeguard companies' brands and reputations. This company is profitable, talking
about
going IPO and has only raised three rounds of financing - recently raising over
$30MM in
their latest round, and are nearing $60MM in annual revenues with about 250
employees.

[Client in Social Networking]
Our client, founded in 2003, is the undisputed leader in the massive multiplayer
online
role-playing games (MMORPG), which is a $5.3-billion dollar market. Basically
the
company is a social networking company that provides a virtual world allowing
the youth
market to connect and interact in a real-time, user-created environment. Their
site
receives 100-million page views daily, nearly more than 3-billion monthly. They
have
more than 9-million registered users and the largest community forum on the
Internet
with more than 1-billion posts. This company is nearly profitable and has more
than
$18MM in the bank. Their valuation has grown more than 1200% in the past 9-12
months.
The company is backed by Benchmark Capital (eBay) and Redpoint Ventures
(MySpace).
Their current headcount is 80 with 40 within Engineering.

Verticalmove is working with a very exciting, stealth-mode,
consumer-facing Web 2.0 client that is backed by some of the most
respected individuals in the Silicon Valley area. Their recent round
of funding was led by the famous Angel Investor who was the first to
finance Google and helped seed other companies such as Ask.com and
Topica to name a few. This round of financing was oversubscribed and
they turned away potential investors. It's additionally backed by a
leading Silicon Valley venture firm, First Round Capital, and
strategic angel investors, including top former or current executives
from eBay, Intuit, Google, Yahoo, Charles Schwab, Reuters, Adteractive
and Weblogic/BEA

Their product promises to revolutionize how individuals account,
balance and manage their personal finances, all through a simple and
easy to use, web-based solution that not only is free, but promises to
make and save them money on a monthly basis for doing nothing more
that what they usually do anyway.

They are looking to hire:

>QA Manager that will set up Policy & Procedure, is hands-on and will
build a solid QA team from the ground up. Server & Load testing
experience is a must and automating where possible is always a big plus.

>Java/UI/Ajax Engineer that has deep Javascript, Ajax & DHTML skills.
You should also have experience with GWT, prototype, Dojo, YUI or
similar frameworks. CS Fundamentals are also a must have.

please email jim at verticalmove dotcom for details

Verticalmove is working with a well funded Seattle start up with
offices in San Francisco (next to Montgomery St BART) that is poised
turn the world of "traditional real estate firms" and their
established ways of doing business and generating fees upside down.
They have offices in Seattle, SF, LA, Orange County, San Diego and
soon will be in Chicago, DC & Boston.


They are the industry's first online real estate brokerage and unlike
any other real estate site, you buy and sell MLS-listed homes online.
You can shop for homes and browse prices using our map-driven
home-shopping site and make an offer or list a property. Once you
have started the process one of their agents reviews your submission
and handles all the negotiations and paperwork, giving you a discount
of two-thirds on a standard buyer's agent commission.
"While knowledge and experience are nice; brains & passion are
essential" and this credo applies to all their positions

They are looking to hire:

>Superstar Ajax Engineer who can work their magic to make a web site
do anything. You should be able to build an MVC framework using JSP.

>QA Engineer with strong open source background and someone that can
write automation tests in Java or Javascript. You will perform end to
end testing and this role is skewed towards whitebox.

>Java SW Engineer with experience w/Java/Linux/MySql/Ajax/Apache.
You will work across all layers of the system from the UI to the
Application Logic & the database. You should be able to build an
application from the database schema up to the UI and all the related
components.

>Engineering Lead/Manager for Seattle that has BtoB experience, and
wants to be 100% hands on. You will lead a team of 4 engineers and be
a mentor as well as contributor. Superb communications skills are a
must as is the ability to build and work with highly transactional
systems. Experience with Salesforce, Security related issues are a
big plus as is experience with Mule or Apache ActiveMQ. Seattle only
for this role.

please email jim at verticalmove.com for details

Verticalmove is working with an angel-backed start-up founded by
streaming experts coming from VideoLAN / VLC, Envivio, Real Networks
and Intertrust.

Their product puts a live TV production studio in your browser.
With a simple camera, subscribers can broadcast high quality
television through the Internet to hundreds of viewers on TV,
computer, iPod and cell phone. They offer the first high-end
MPEG-4/H.264 Software as a Service, designed for users who need
simplicity, quality and security, whether they are journalists hosting
a live interactive TV show on their blog, managers using the power of
video to train employees, or professors looking for a simple way to
turn their lectures into video podcasts. They will also market their
solution to enterprise software companies with multiple locations.

Their immediate need is for a Hands-On Web Architect who will use
his/her experience to re-design the back end and front end of the
application. It is currently written in PHP/MySql and they will be
migrating to a J2EE environment so experience with PHP/MySql as well
as the Java/J2EE is required. You will take ownership of the
architecture, design & coding and will build and hire a team to work
with you. Details will be provided upon request.

please email jim at verticalmove.com

Verticalmove is working closely with a profitable and well know
consumer Web 2.0 Company that has been in business since 1999. They
are using the latest in Web 2.0 technologies. $90MM in annual
revenues last year and $28MM in profits. Their site handles over
1-terabyte of data each day. This is a very stable, profitable and
well-known company. They've had 22 consecutive quarters of
year-over-year growth, 107% 5-year revenue compounded annual growth
rate & PROFITABLE since 2003. They still maintain a "start-up"
atmosphere where collaboration and teamwork are highly valued. They
produce "real" "tangible" consumer products that touch people's lives
and they are growing in 2007!

They are looking for talented web engineers and platform engineers
with a combination of the following: Java/J2EE, MVC, Struts, Hibernate
& Spring, Ajax, CSS, XML, Javascript. Knowledge of business logic,
JSP's, Servlets as well as Persistence, JDBC and Sql. They also look
for engineers with a strong CS Fundamentals background. We have
placed 5 engineers in the past 5 weeks and they still have multiple
openings.

>Web Application Engineeers
>Platform Engineers
>Partner Solution Engineer
>Java/ UI/ Ajax Engineer
>Infrastructure Engineer

please email jim at verticalmove dotcom for details

Verticalmove is working with a well funded & profitable start-up that
is funded by the same VC's that brought MySpace & EBay public.
They've been in business since 2003, have nearly 45 employees and are
profitable. They are the leader in the massive multiplayer online
role-playing games (MMORPG) space, which is a $5.3-billion dollar
market. It is a social networking company that provides a virtual
world allowing the youth market to connect and interact in real-time,
user-created environments. Their revenue figures are growing at
approximately 10% a month. They have 6.5M registered users and 4
billion unique monthly page views. This company just has announced
raising another round of financing from leading tier-1 VC's. Their
valuation has gone from the low 8- figure range to 9-figures, from
$10MM to $132MM in 6 months - awesome growth.

They are looking for the following candidates: preference give to
candidates from high volume Web 2.0 companies.

>Web Developers with strong Ajax and php skills. Java a plus.

>PHP Application Engineers who have coded applications for sites with
high-traffic & high volume.

>Flash Developers with Actionscript & PHP experience

>Engineering Manager with strong web skills.

>System Administrator for consumer focused, 24x7 uptime company

Please email jim at verticalmove dotcom for details

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Hi all,

Question regarding different AJAX "web-scraping" techniques.  Basically, I have
a main site
with two parts 1) Search Box , 2) Results Box.  I'm looking for the most
manageable way to
propagate each of those to "partner" sites and have them still function
properly.
Currently, I have a  solution that kinda sorta works, but it involves having
PART 1 statically
on the partner's server itself.  My preference would be to have code that is
then able to
actually retrieve PART 1 from the site and have it fully functional (with all of
it's own
JavaScript glory) and have it correctly work with the local PROXY.PHP file.



Please correct my logic where wrong, but my thoughts are as follows:



<DIV1>
when this div loads, have it retrieve the SEARCH BOX and draw it in with all
code in
tact to control DIV 2 (so that it can be controlled at the server)
</DIV1>


<DIV2>
wholly controlled by DIV1
</DIV2>



Thanks!

Try your posting at http://www.ajaxtoday.com jobs available forums. We
are going to start a jobs posting and responding page asap. pls keep
in touch. thanks.

- Rafiq
http://www.ajaxtoday.com


--- In ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com, "andre_charland" <acharland@...>
wrote:
>
> Full Time Open Positions:
>
>     *  AJaX Software Engineer
> (http://developer.ebusiness-apps.com/company/jobs/softdev.htm)
>     *  Marketing Coordinator
>
(http://developer.ebusiness-apps.com/company/jobs/marketing-coordinator.htm)
>     *  Software QA Engineer
>
(http://developer.ebusiness-apps.com/company/jobs/software-qa-engineer.htm)
>
> Upcoming Positions:
>
>     * Co-op/Intern Marketing Position
>
(http://developer.ebusiness-apps.com/company/jobs/co-op-marketing-employee.htm)
>     * Co-op/Intern Software Developer
>
(http://developer.ebusiness-apps.com/company/jobs/co-op-software-developer.htm)
>
> eBusiness Applications is a high energy, leading edge software
> development firm located in beautiful Vancouver, British Columbia. We
> are deeply committed to operating a profitable company while
> maintaining a team that is excited about the work we do and products
> we build.  Ideal candidates share our enthusiasm for new technologies
> as well as our values and beliefs.  You will be part of an
> entrepreneurial team building and selling the world's best AJAX user
> interface components to some of the largest companies in the world
> including: Bank of America, Cisco, Siemens, NASA, BMW and more.
>
> Focused on work hard play hard belief, eBusiness Applications is
> committed to providing a workplace that supports the lifestyles of the
> staff.  We are situated on the beautiful North Shore, in close
> proximity to recreational opportunities on the local mountains. Staff
> are encouraged to take advantage of accommodating work schedules and
> get out and enjoy the incredible mountain biking, skiing, hiking and
> other outdoor activities available locally.
>
> If interested email resume and cover letter to jobs@...
> and use the job title in the subject line.
>
> For more info: http://developer.ebusiness-apps.com/company/careers.htm
>

Hi All,

BetZip has a great job opportunity for an exceptional web developer - job
listing below.  The company is well-funded and growing rapidly.  Please
apply via YorZ if you are interested.

Best,

Brian

*******
A $1,000 bounty is offered for this position. Earn all or part of this
reward by referring the right candidate or emailing this listing to
candidates or potential referrers.

Respond to this listing at: http://www.yorz.com/posting/282484.htm

We respond to all applicants! Please apply online via YorZ.

Are you a skilled web developer that thrives in a fast-paced environment and
enjoys working with a close-knit team building original and wildly popular
web applications? If so, come talk to us.

BetZip (http://www.betzip.com) is a rapidly growing startup with a unique,
patent-pending approach to online gaming. We recently launched our first
product to acclaim, a ton of traffic, and now growing revenues. We are
strongly backed by blue chip, well-known investors. Our management team has
a history of success in consumer Internet businesses, online games, and
online marketing. We see a huge opportunity ahead and we are building an
exceptional team capable of raising the bar for an online gaming experience!

The web developer works closely with producers, designers, engineers, and
quality assurance to create web pages/sites that are flexible, scalable, and
efficient. We are looking for a presentation layer guru who can architect an
environment to create simple and complex web pages, is able to solve
problems related to back-end integration, and can advise on best practices.
This is a senior level position. We are looking for an exceptional web
developer with proven ability to create world-class web pages and
applications.

If you do not feel that you are exceptional at what you do, please do not
apply.

Requirements and Background:

* 3 to 5 years experience in a consumer facing web development environment
* Presentation layer guru; facility with dynamic web templates and all
necessary languages, including html, dhtml, xhtml, ajax, javascript, css,
etc.
* Ability to turn design mock-ups into fully functioning web pages and
ability to solve problems associated with integrating these pages with
back-end processes and databases
* Strong knowledge of browser/platform issues
* Understanding cookies and web tracking techniques
* Comfortable working with design tools when necessary
* Knowledge of Cold Fusion and/or Java a plus
* A proven track record in delivering front-end components for a complex web
environment
* Expertise with build processes, source control, versioning and bug
tracking tools

We offer a competitive salary commensurate with experience, incentive stock
options, and benefits.

Know someone you'd like to refer? As a token of our appreciation, we're
offering a $1,000 referral bounty payable to anyone that refers a successful
candidate.

No recruiters please.

_______________________
YorZ - The Community for Quality Jobs and Accomplished Professionals

YorZ - http://www.yorz.com
Blog of YorZ - http://yorz.blogs.com

Hi All,

We're looking for an exceptional java engineer (or sr. java engineer)
to join our small team.  We are pursuing an excitng and huge
opportunity to help consumers find the information they need when
shopping online.  Our roadmap is full of interesting UI and back end
technical challenges.  If this sounds interesting to you, please
apply.  Or, refer folks you think may be interested - we're offering a
$1,000 referral award as a token of our appreciation.

Full job listing and application information below...

Thanks!

*****

A $1,000 bounty is offered for this position. Earn all or part of this
reward by referring the right candidate or emailing this listing to
candidates or potential referrers.

Respond to this Listing at: http://www.yorz.com/posting/279847.htm

--------------------
Listing Information
--------------------
We respond to all applicants! Please apply via YorZ.

Are you an exceptional software engineer looking for an ambitious
startup? We're pursuing a huge market opportunity and pioneering a new
approach to connecting consumers with the best products and retailers.
Studies show that more than 90% of consumers research products online
before they buy. PowerReviews will enable consumers to get the
information they need when shopping at retailers of all sizes.

Our founders are experienced entrepreneurs with deep ecommerce and web
experience. They successfully built their last company, Fogdog.com,
into an ecommerce leader before taking it public.

Our business was recently funded by two top-tier venture firms, Menlo
Ventures and Draper Richards.

Our small and talented team is committed to delivering technologically
superior applications that are intuitively usable. We also have a
great time working together.

***
We are looking for 1-2 talented Software Engineers (or Senior Software
Engineers) to join our small engineering team.

If you have outstanding programming skills, business acumen, and the
ability to take creative ideas and transform them into high-quality
software products using Java and JSPs, we want to talk to you. You
will be involved in all phases of the software lifecycle, from
specification to design, coding, and deployment.

Requirements:
* Bachelor's degree in Computer Science or a related technical field
* 2+ years experience with Java and JSP development
* Experience with SQL query writing and performance optimization
* Experience with Hibernate, Tomcat and the Model-View-Controller
design pattern a plus
* Some HTML, Javascript, and CSS knowledge
* Moderate to advanced knowledge of Unix environments, and Unix shell
scripting
* Experience developing with XML / SOAP technologies
* Experience with version control systems such as Subversion or CVS
preferred
* Experience with automated build utilities like ANT and Maven preferred
* Demonstrated skills at designing and developing software for
reusability, performance, and maintainability
* Strong attention to detail, good communications skills, and a
positive attitude
* Ability to be self motivated and deliver projects on time with
minimal supervision
* Must be authorized to work in the U.S.

We offer a competitive salary commensurate with experience, incentive
stock options, and benefits.

Our office is located close to great transportation (next to the
Millbrae BART and Caltrain stations).

Know someone you'd like to refer? As a token of our appreciation,
we're offering a $1,000 referral bounty payable to anyone that refers
a successful candidate that completes 60 days on the job. Please apply
or refer via YorZ.

No recruiters please.

Full Time Open Positions:

     *  AJaX Software Engineer
(http://developer.ebusiness-apps.com/company/jobs/softdev.htm)
     *  Marketing Coordinator
(http://developer.ebusiness-apps.com/company/jobs/marketing-coordinator.htm)
     *  Software QA Engineer
(http://developer.ebusiness-apps.com/company/jobs/software-qa-engineer.htm)

Upcoming Positions:

     * Co-op/Intern Marketing Position
(http://developer.ebusiness-apps.com/company/jobs/co-op-marketing-employee.htm)
     * Co-op/Intern Software Developer
(http://developer.ebusiness-apps.com/company/jobs/co-op-software-developer.htm)

eBusiness Applications is a high energy, leading edge software
development firm located in beautiful Vancouver, British Columbia. We
are deeply committed to operating a profitable company while
maintaining a team that is excited about the work we do and products
we build.  Ideal candidates share our enthusiasm for new technologies
as well as our values and beliefs.  You will be part of an
entrepreneurial team building and selling the world's best AJAX user
interface components to some of the largest companies in the world
including: Bank of America, Cisco, Siemens, NASA, BMW and more.

Focused on work hard play hard belief, eBusiness Applications is
committed to providing a workplace that supports the lifestyles of the
staff.  We are situated on the beautiful North Shore, in close
proximity to recreational opportunities on the local mountains. Staff
are encouraged to take advantage of accommodating work schedules and
get out and enjoy the incredible mountain biking, skiing, hiking and
other outdoor activities available locally.

If interested email resume and cover letter to jobs@...
and use the job title in the subject line.

For more info: http://developer.ebusiness-apps.com/company/careers.htm

AjaxToday.com is a dedicated portal for the international ajax
developers community. The site right now features articles, tutorials,
forums, books, blogs and many more to be added soon. Besides AJAX the
site will feature Javascript, DHTML, CSS, HTML, XML, etc.

It will be a FREE service for the community. Members can write
articles/tutorials, write blogs, post queries in forums. Lot's of new
features are in development and will be added soon.

Visit & support at http://www.ajaxtoday.com

Note: Please feel free to post your valuable comments, ideas, etc to
improve the site through the feedback form in the home page. Thanks.

----- Original Message -----

From: Jonathan Boutelle

To: ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 5:29 PM

Subject: [ajax_and_ria] quantum states of AJAX

I found this article pretty informative
http://ajax.sys-con.com/read/166503.htm

It describes the different layers of AJAX APIs that are available
(from simple wrapping of transportation protocol to full-on widget
libaries that are integrated into IDEs).

This seems relevant to our conversations last month, where David
Mendals (Macromedia/Adobe) talked about "comparing apples to
oranges", and Jep Castelein (from backbase) contrasted "mature AJAX
toolkits" with "custom ajax projects".

The article is by Kevin Hackman, from General Interface/TIBCO. He
basically says that current AJAX toolkits/libraries fall into one of
four groups (described in order of ascending complexity / power / value).
1)Communication libraries
2)User Interface Components
3)Rich Internet Application frameworks
4)RIA Frameworks with robust visual tooling

I'd quibble with (1) (in my experience, low-level libraries like
Prototype also abstract away differences between how different
browsers implement innerHtml, do event handling, position elements on
the screen, and much more). Maybe a better way to say 1 would be
"provide an API wrapping of existing browser functionality". Other
than that it's a nice model.

Recent events at the Apache
http://www.jonathanboutelle.com/mt/archives/2005/12/tooling_comes_t.html
http://www.nabble.com/AJAX-Toolkit-Framework-Proposal-t778101.html
might bring Zimbra/Rico from (3) status to (4) status. (Up till now,
everything in (4) is either proprietary or generates Flash rather
than JavaScript).

----^-------^------^--------^-------^
Jon Boutelle
Principal, Uzanto Consulting
Mountain View, CA

Office Phone:650-564-0000
skype id: jboutelle
www.uzanto.com
www.jonathanboutelle.com
www.themindcanvas.com
----^-------^------^--------^-------^

Apparently haXe can do both SWF & JS, and server-side code:
http://www.jessewarden.com/archives/2005/11/haxe_programmin.html
http://haxe.org/intro

Naturally, I'd take SWF, but Nicholas (the creator) is really down with ECMA
and strict typing, so some of the Java/JavaScript heads might dig it because
it's stricter than JavaScript, AS2, and getting comparable to AS3 from what
I've seen.

Not sure on tooling, though.  The open-source world for that stuff right now
is a maelstrom of activity, hard to keep up with.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jonathan Boutelle" <jon@...>
To: <ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 5:29 PM
Subject: [ajax_and_ria] quantum states of AJAX


I found this article pretty informative
http://ajax.sys-con.com/read/166503.htm

It describes the different layers of AJAX APIs that are available
(from simple wrapping of transportation protocol to full-on widget
libaries that are integrated into IDEs).

This seems relevant to our conversations last month, where David
Mendals (Macromedia/Adobe) talked about "comparing apples to
oranges", and Jep Castelein (from backbase) contrasted "mature AJAX
toolkits" with "custom ajax projects".

The article is by Kevin Hackman, from General Interface/TIBCO. He
basically says that current AJAX toolkits/libraries fall into one of
four groups (described in order of ascending complexity / power / value).
1)Communication libraries
2)User Interface Components
3)Rich Internet Application frameworks
4)RIA Frameworks with robust visual tooling

I'd quibble with (1) (in my experience, low-level libraries like
Prototype also abstract away differences between how different
browsers implement innerHtml, do event handling, position elements on
the screen, and much more). Maybe a better way to say 1 would be
"provide an API wrapping of existing browser functionality". Other
than that it's a nice model.

Recent events at the Apache
http://www.jonathanboutelle.com/mt/archives/2005/12/tooling_comes_t.html
http://www.nabble.com/AJAX-Toolkit-Framework-Proposal-t778101.html
might bring Zimbra/Rico from (3) status to (4) status. (Up till now,
everything in (4) is either proprietary or generates Flash rather
than JavaScript).

----^-------^------^--------^-------^
Jon Boutelle
Principal, Uzanto Consulting
Mountain View, CA

Office Phone:650-564-0000
skype id: jboutelle
www.uzanto.com
www.jonathanboutelle.com
www.themindcanvas.com
----^-------^------^--------^-------^




Yahoo! Groups Links

I found this article pretty informative
http://ajax.sys-con.com/read/166503.htm

It describes the different layers of AJAX APIs that are available
(from simple wrapping of transportation protocol to full-on widget
libaries that are integrated into IDEs).

This seems relevant to our conversations last month, where David
Mendals (Macromedia/Adobe) talked about "comparing apples to
oranges", and Jep Castelein (from backbase) contrasted "mature AJAX
toolkits" with "custom ajax projects".

The article is by Kevin Hackman, from General Interface/TIBCO. He
basically says that current AJAX toolkits/libraries fall into one of
four groups (described in order of ascending complexity / power / value).
1)Communication libraries
2)User Interface Components
3)Rich Internet Application frameworks
4)RIA Frameworks with robust visual tooling

I'd quibble with (1) (in my experience, low-level libraries like
Prototype also abstract away differences between how different
browsers implement innerHtml, do event handling, position elements on
the screen, and much more). Maybe a better way to say 1 would be
"provide an API wrapping of existing browser functionality". Other
than that it's a nice model.

Recent events at the Apache
http://www.jonathanboutelle.com/mt/archives/2005/12/tooling_comes_t.html
http://www.nabble.com/AJAX-Toolkit-Framework-Proposal-t778101.html
might bring Zimbra/Rico from (3) status to (4) status. (Up till now,
everything in (4) is either proprietary or generates Flash rather
than JavaScript).

----^-------^------^--------^-------^
Jon Boutelle
Principal, Uzanto Consulting
Mountain View, CA

Office Phone:650-564-0000
skype id: jboutelle
www.uzanto.com
www.jonathanboutelle.com
www.themindcanvas.com
----^-------^------^--------^-------^

JOB TITLE:  Web Developer

LOCATION:  Mountain View, CA

DESCRIPTION:

We are seeking highly-motivated software engineers for various positions developing web applications.  Look, there are some great big companies out there where you could have a nice easy job.  But if you eschew that mentality and seek an opportunity to get into the driver's seat, then our startup is where you'll want to work.  On our team you will have the opportunity to pioneer a whole new category of Internet applications for the enterprise and innovate with emerging web technologies.  If you believe creating great software requires "getting into the heart and mind of the user," then let us know why you think you're the best candidate for this unique opportunity.

We are a VC-backed stealth-mode startup headquartered in Mountain View, CA.

EXPERIENCE:

* Java Servlet/JSP or equivalent

* Web technologies (HTML, AJAX, DHTML, JavaScript, CSS)

* Persistence layer experience (e.g. Hibernate)

* Relational databases a plus (MySQL, Oracle, SQL Server, PostgreSQL)

QUALIFICATIONS:

* BS or higher in Computer Science

* 3-5 years of software engineering experience

* Outstanding communication and teamwork skills

* Passion for science, technology, and innovation

* High degree of integrity, passion and drive

Send resume and cover letter to jobs@... with subject line "Web Developer".  US work authorization required.

the W3C has launched a couple of new working groups for developing
standard APIs and formats for RIA development.

http://www.w3.org/2006/webapi/
http://www.w3.org/2006/appformats/

"This deliverable should be based on an existing application/UI
format, such as Mozilla's XUL, Microsoft's XAML, Macromedia's MXML or
Laszlo Systems' LZX, provided the owners of the format are willing to
contribute. The format should allow embedded program code. This
format, combined with the deliverables below and existing technologies
including XHTML, CSS, XForms, SVG and SMIL, should provide a strong
basis for rich client application development."

Have you checked out TIBCO's AJAX IDE and Framework?

The IDE is itself an ajax app that runs in the browser.  Yep—a full
AJAX IDE for building AJAX apps.

InfoWorld just gave it the highest rating of all products in its class.

http://www.infoworld.com/Tibco_General_Interface/product_70328.html?
view=0&curNodeId=0

8 minute webcast: http://weblog.infoworld.com/udell/2005/05/25.html

You can download it and try it out from http://developer.tibco.com

--Kevin

Hi Laurent,

Please don't assume I am in such a box.  We are using AJAX at Macromedia
too, and using AJAX and Flash together (see Mike and Christian's work on
our blog aggregator).  At a bunch of recent conferences, my colleague
Kevin Lynch has been actively promoting examples such a Adaptive Path's
measure map that show folks a good example of AJAX and Flash together.
At Macromedia, I am also responsible for Dreamweaver and ColdFusion and
we are very invested in the browser runtime as well as the Flash Player.
We are increasingly focused on breaking down barriers between these 2
worlds.

My point about install rates was not to imply that there is no
innovation in the AJAX world--indeed as Mike notes, the rate of
innovation is tremendous.  What I was referring to was the rate of
innovation (and then distribution) in the " underlying capabilities of
the client-side enabling technology," per Jonathan's note (eg the
Browser vs the Flash Player, not the Flex framework vs the OpenRico or
Tibco or Backbase or whatever AJAX framework.)

Also, I want to stress Mike's comment: the Flash Player does not install
the Yahoo toolbar.  As a developer, you can make the install process
transparent and ensure no offer of a Yahoo toolbar is presented.  There
is such an offer on our website, but no developer needs to point this
this (rare) install mechanism.  We invested very heavily in a very
seamless "express install" mechanism that lets you keep your users on
your site, update the Player and keep going with no additional installs,
pages or distractions.

Your examples of good AJAX sites is instructive...I think that Google
Suggest for example is a perfect example using the framework I suggest
in the previous email of something better done with AJAX than with
Flash, because it is a incremental addition to an exisiting HTML site.
That makes AJAX very appropriate and the impact is very nice. You could
rewrite it in Flex/Flash but with that design, there is no benefit to
doing so.  GoogleMaps is an example of the kind of site that can be
built with AJAX or with Flex/Flash (see maps.yahoo.com).  Yahoo makes
some different design choices and adds a lot more functionality (eg
multi-point routing).  I think the impact of the underlying technology
choice will be greater and greater over time--I expect it will be far
easier to add functionality and improve the Yahoo site because of their
choice.

-David

> -----Original Message-----
> From: ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Laurent Muchacho
> Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2005 8:43 AM
> To: ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RE: [ajax_and_ria] Flash / AJAX decision making
>
> Hi David,
>
> I agree with you on all the good thing Flash can do. I think
> the rate of innovation of AJAX/DHTML application as not being
> frozen on the last 5 year you can simply put your nose out
> there, in a world outside of your enclosed Flash cocoon where
> you seems to think that it's the best for everything.
>
> Many examples of AJAX are built with DHTML and Not Flash e.g.
> Google Map, Google Suggest, http://www.37signals.com/ ,
> http://www.zimbra.com/, http://del.icio.us etc...
>
> This simply because there is no need of flash for most of
> this application and they offer much better experiences then
> downloading a new flash player or upgrading each time you guy
> bring new functionality into the plugin. Yes because we have
> to remember on things here Flash Player is a Plugin and if
> you don't download it and install it you whole user
> experience is reduced to an really ugly icon and you don't
> nothing instead.
>
> I apologise in advance to you and all Flash lover out there,
> but please can you explain to me why when you install Flash
> Player 8 on your machine it will install Yahoo toolbar
> without asking you if you even want to have the yahoo toolbar.
>
> I'm a UI application developer mostly writing DHTML but often
> I will direct Project manager and designer too choose Flash
> over DHTML because I recognise that they are other technology
> out there who are better suited for the application we are building.
> Please don't close your mind on this kind of thing specially
> now when we are living in the new internet boom where the
> vibe is too work together not against each other.
>
> Laurent
>
> Ps: Sometimes you need to think outside the Box you are living in
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of David Mendels
> Sent: 19 November 2005 03:39
> To: ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RE: [ajax_and_ria] Flash / AJAX decision making
>
> Jon,
>
> Good points.
>
> One thing then to note however, as it relates to (1) is the
> rate of innovation and rate of distribution of " underlying
> capabilities of the client-side enabling technology. "
> Indeed, this is one of the key points of different between
> Flash and AJAX/DHTML and again it can lead to comparing
> apples to oranges.
>
> With the Flash Player, we are able to introduce major new
> functionality, synced with new tooling, every 1-2 years (less
> in the case of 8.5) and get 50%+ adoption in less than 6
> months. (Recently our rate of distribution is accelerating
> with over 5M successful installs per day.) Further, with the
> Flash Player less than 1 meg, broadband usage ubiquitous for
> *some* communities and application scenarios, and Flash
> Player's "Express Intstall", the Player can upgrade itself
> with a single click and in less time than some web pages
> might take to load.  Contrast the client side technology for
> AJAX/DHTML, the pace of innovation has been glacial for the
> last 5 years, and when new functionality is introduced it
> takes an incredibly long time for it to be distributed and
> accepted widely, and even then, there is a frequent
> occurrence of incompatibilities between different
> implementations. Relating this to the example you provide
> below, if the Flash Player advanced its text layout engine,
> one could reasonably start to target that for applications
> being deployed soon after the new Flash Player was released
> (eg within 6 months if your target distribution was 50%+).
> However, if Firefox added native access to WebCams, or IE did
> that, you might want
> 2-5 times longer before you could reasonably count on 50+ penetration.
> Further, with broadband + "Express Install" I think the
> equation changes dramatically and many people will start to
> target the capabilities of a new Flash Player as soon as it
> is released--we are for example already starting to see many
> major internet properties (Sony Pictures, Toyota,
> etc.) taking advantage of features that *require* Flash
> Player 8 within
> 3 months of shipping Flash Player 8.  That is new in 2005 and
> is accelerating. I think it is an exciting change and can
> really enable developers to leverage state of the art
> technology much more quickly and create more compelling applications.
>
> -David
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com
> > [mailto:ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jonathan Boutelle
> > Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 5:27 PM
> > To: ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com; ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: RE: [ajax_and_ria] Flash / AJAX decision making
> >
> > David,
> >
> > I agree that this conversation ends up having "apples to oranges"
> > problems.
> >
> > There are at least two dimensions to the decision:
> >
> > 1)The underlying capabilities of the client-side enabling
> technology.
> > In the case of Flash, this is whatever version of the Flash
> plugin is
> > currently at 50%+ adoption. In the case of AJAX, this is
> the DOM, and
> > javascript objects, and html rendering capabilities
> supported by the
> > major browser vendors.
> >
> > 2)The engineering framework used to build software that uses this
> > client-side technology. In the case of Flash, this is FLEX
> 2 and the
> > latest version of the Flash IDE. In the case of AJAX this is the
> > unruly but rapidly improving open-source frameworks (RICO, DOJO,
> > MOCHI, et al), and the more mature but proprietary commercial
> > frameworks (hi Jep!).
> >
> > As application developers, we live in the world of (2). We
> install the
> > IDEs and learn the APIs, and improvements in these make our lives
> > dramatically easier over time. But (1) is where the longer-lasting
> > constraints are. (2) gets rapidly better over time, while (1) has a
> > potentially greater impact on the core nature of the application.
> >
> > For example, FLEX 2 may (hypothetically) bring rapid application
> > development nirvana. But if the Flash plugin is a weak way
> to display
> > or work with text, FLEX 2 won't change that. If browsers
> don't provide
> > a javascript API that gives native access to client microphones and
> > webcams, that's also unlikely to change in the next several years.
> >
> > I'm more interested in (1) than (2), because I think it forms the
> > basis for decisions that will hold up over time.
> > -Jon
> >
> > At 12:20 PM 11/18/2005, David Mendels wrote:
> > >  Hi All,
> > >
> > >Interesting thread.  I am from Macromedia and certainly
> > biased, but I
> > >do think there are strengths for each and I'll try to write some
> > >relatively balanced notes:
> > >
> > >I think the discussion is a bit awkward however because we are
> > >comparing apples and oranges in many cases.  Some people
> discussing
> > >Flash really are talking about the Flash of 1-2 to 5 years ago,
> > >pre-Flex and certainly pre Flash Player 8.5.  As for AJAX, are we
> > >basing the discussion on the "roll your own" case, or on
> some of the
> > >frameworks/tools that are available, or on a specific
> tool/framework
> > >such as Tibco GI or Backbase?  The pros and cons differ greatly
> > >depending on which of these you are comparing to which.
> > >
> > >Trying to parse this out a bit, some high level pros and cons that
> > >aren't dependent on which version, tool or framework you are using:
> > >
> > >Flash is better at handling rich media, audio, video,
> > graphic effects,
> > >transitions, motion graphics, data visualization.  It is
> > also better at
> > >handling binary data streams, two way audio and video. It has much
> > >richer capabilities for local data storage. In general, it
> > excels are
> > >creating an integrated media "experience" that is highly
> branded. It
> > >excels at creating cross-browser applications that runs
> identically
> > >across OS/Browser. In Player 8.5, it has a faster, more
> > robust and more
> > >advanced javascript engine (ECMA-Script) than any browser
> today with
> > >better XML handling (E4X) which consistancy across
> > browsers/platforms.
> > >Flash is better for applications that need to received
> > "pushed" data as
> > >well as offline and occasionally connected use cases.  Flash
> > has higher
> > >quality and richer printing capabilities (though historically
> > >developers have not taken enough advantage of this.)
> > >
> > >Ajax/DHTML is better for adding incremental functionality to an
> > >existing HTML/DHTML page. Eg. If you have a page with a
> search box,
> > >adding "google suggest" style intelligence to that search
> > field.  This
> > >can be done in Flash, but it is easier to add it incrementally to
> > >existing pages/apps with AJAX/DHTML.  I have to say I think
> > that is the
> > >biggest single advantage because it lets people adopt AJAX
> > more gradually.
> > >HTML/DHTML have in some ways richer text layout capabilities
> > than the
> > >Flash Player for flowed text, large blocks of text, text
> with inline
> > >graphics. (Flash Player has stonger support for non system
> > fonts, font
> > >anti-aliasing, text effects, text on a path).
> > >
> > >Neither one inherently loads faster than the other--that
> > depends on the
> > >app and the design. Neither one appears to be generally more
> > performant
> > >than the other--this also is highly dependent on the app and the
> > >design--there are clearly cases where one is much better
> > than the other.
> > >It is important not to ascribe design choices to the underlying
> > >technology.  For example, Google Maps (AJAX) load a bit
> faster than
> > >Yahoo Maps (Flex/Flash).  However Yahoo maps has
> significantly more
> > >functionality in the client.  That was a design choice--as a
> > user, you
> > >can decide which you like better, but it doesn't in and of
> > itself tell
> > >you if AJAX loads faster than Flash.
> > >
> > >As for accessibility, HTML has advantages for simple use cases,
> > >Flash/Flex appears to have the edge for complex applications.
> > >
> > >As for back end integration, Flash/Flex provides many more options:
> > >Remote Object invocation, Messaging, Binary Sockets, etc.
> > >
> > >As for skinning and styling, I think that this has
> historically been
> > >harder in Flash, but with Flex 2.0 it is now easier and more
> > flexbile
> > >than any specific AJAX approach I have seen. Both have good
> > support for
> > >CSS.
> > >
> > >As far as standards support and openness, I think
> > counter-intuitively
> > >Flash now has an equal story with better support for the
> recent ECMA
> > >Script standard, E4X, CSS support, XML/SOAP/WSDL support, and a
> > >published and widely implemented fileformat and much much wider OS
> > >support (including game machines, cell phones, cameras,
> MP3 devices,
> > >etc). AJAX/DHTML of course has better support for HTML
> > itself, but has
> > >to wrestle with different implementations in different
> > >browsers/platforms.
> > >
> > >As for developer productivity and maintainability, the "roll
> > your own"
> > >approach with both Flash and AJAX/DHTML tends to be hard to
> > maintain in
> > >both cases and developer productivity varies greatly with the very
> > >specific experience of the developer.  At the moment, I
> believe the
> > >Flex offers an order of magnitude advantage in developer
> > productivity,
> > >maintainability, extensibility for complex applications.
> > Talking with
> > >developers of large and complex applications (eg. A mortgage loan
> > >application with over 1M lines of code, or a insurance
> company agent
> > >broker application with a 30 person 12-18 month development
> > cycle) the
> > >advantages of Flex and Flash increase dramatically over AJAX/DHTML.
> > >Testing costs are generally also lower because of better
> > cross browser
> > >compatibility. That said, at this point the fair comparison
> > is not Flex
> > >2.0 vs "roll your own" AJAX/DHTML, but with toolkits such as
> > Tibco GI,
> > >Backbase or OpenRico.org.  Each one of those would require
> > some depth
> > >of knowledge to do a fair competitive review and I can't do
> > that, but I
> > >think as this discussion continues it is important to
> > compare apples to
> > >apples. One should compare upfront cost, TCO, tooling,
> > framework, etc
> > >etc etc.
> > >
> > >Regards,
> > >
> > >David
> > >Macromedia
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > ----^-------^------^--------^-------^
> > Jon Boutelle
> > Principal, Uzanto Consulting
> > Mountain View, CA
> >
> > Office Phone:650-564-0000
> > Cell Phone   :510-708-9825
> > skype id: jboutelle
> > www.uzanto.com
> > www.jonathanboutelle.com
> > ----^-------^------^--------^-------^
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> > --------------------~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo!
> > Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page
> > http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/spZplB/TM
> > --------------------------------------------------------------
> > ------~->
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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> Click and help stop AIDS now.
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/VpTY2A/lzNLAA/yQLSAA/spZplB/TM
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> ------~->
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Hi Mike,

Thanks for the details answer.
It's true that it's much easier to update the Flash player then updating the
browser.

Regards

Laurent

-----Original Message-----
From: ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com [mailto:ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Mike Chambers
Sent: 19 November 2005 20:09
To: ajax_and_ria@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [ajax_and_ria] Re: Flash / Browser Install Rates : WAS: Flash /
AJAX decision making

I don't believe that David said there had been no innovation within the
Ajax world (I think it is pretty clear there has been). I think he
pointed out the simple fact that new versions of the Flash player (with
new features) can get out into the public, and reach ubiquity
(approximately 80% in a year) much faster than new versions of browsers
(historical browser and Flash player install trends support this).

In addition, a developer not only has to wait for a new browser to reach
ubiquity, but they have to wait for all other browsers to add that
feature and then wait for those browsers to reach ubiquity.

For example, Flash Player 8.5 (now in public alpha) adds support for
binary sockets. We plan to release that player in the Spring of 2006,
and thus based on historical trends, that player will reach 80%
penetration within a year (i.e. Spring 2007).

Now, if a new feature was added to a browser, it would take much longer
for that feature to be available to most end users. This is because new
browser install rates are lower, and there are multiple browsers (i.e.
Firefox, IE, etc..) that need to implement the functionality.

I think that is just a fact of life. The Flash Player is a much smaller
bit of code than an entire browser, and thus can be more readily updated
by end users. It also offers (in many cases) a much more seamless
install experience, often allowing end users to update their player
inline without having to restart their browser.

Btw, I am a Flash lover, although I am also pretty keen on Ajax... ;)

mike chambers

mesh@...

Laurent Muchacho wrote:
> Hi David,
>
> I agree with you on all the good thing Flash can do. I think the rate of
> innovation of AJAX/DHTML application as not being frozen on the last 5
year
> you can simply put your nose out there, in a world outside of your
enclosed
> Flash cocoon where you seems to think that it's the best for everything.
>





Yahoo! Groups Links

I don't believe that David said there had been no innovation within the
Ajax world (I think it is pretty clear there has been). I think he
pointed out the simple fact that new versions of the Flash player (with
new features) can get out into the public, and reach ubiquity
(approximately 80% in a year) much faster than new versions of browsers
(historical browser and Flash player install trends support this).

In addition, a developer not only has to wait for a new browser to reach
ubiquity, but they have to wait for all other browsers to add that
feature and then wait for those browsers to reach ubiquity.

For example, Flash Player 8.5 (now in public alpha) adds support for
binary sockets. We plan to release that player in the Spring of 2006,
and thus based on historical trends, that player will reach 80%
penetration within a year (i.e. Spring 2007).

Now, if a new feature was added to a browser, it would take much longer
for that feature to be available to most end users. This is because new
browser install rates are lower, and there are multiple browsers (i.e.
Firefox, IE, etc..) that need to implement the functionality.

I think that is just a fact of life. The Flash Player is a much smaller
bit of code than an entire browser, and thus can be more readily updated
by end users. It also offers (in many cases) a much more seamless
install experience, often allowing end users to update their player
inline without having to restart their browser.

Btw, I am a Flash lover, although I am also pretty keen on Ajax... ;)

mike chambers

mesh@...

Laurent Muchacho wrote:
> Hi David,
>
> I agree with you on all the good thing Flash can do. I think the rate of
> innovation of AJAX/DHTML application as not being frozen on the last 5 year
> you can simply put your nose out there, in a world outside of your enclosed
> Flash cocoon where you seems to think that it's the best for everything.
>

fyi

This is incorrect. IF you are using Internet Explorer, AND you go to OUR
website to install Flash (most people don't get the player this way),
then you are given the OPTION to install the Yahoo toolbar.

All other installs do not install or offer to install the toolbar.

mike chambers

mesh@...

Laurent Muchacho wrote:
> Hi David,

> I apologise in advance to you and all Flash lover out there, but please can
> you explain to me why when you install Flash Player 8 on your machine it
> will install Yahoo toolbar without asking you if you even want to have the
> yahoo toolbar.
>