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Re: More on water buffalo as royal animal   Message List  
Reply Message #876 of 1997 |
Re: More on water buffalo as royal animal

--- In austric@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Kekai Manansala"
<p.manansala@s...> wrote:


--- In austric@yahoogroups.com, "Richard Parker"
<richardparker01@y...> wrote:
> >
> > I have heard of the phrase horns of the crescent moon - but it
was > > the specific reference to water buffalo's horns that I felt
might be > > special pleading. > > The pictures you posted were very
persuasive, but they don't seem to > > back up the direct connection
with water buffalo - they could > > represent any kind of cattle
horn.
>
> The pictures in my last post have been identified as buffalo horns
by > specialists and it is rather obvious from the shape, relative
> proportions and notched appearance of the horns that this is the
> correct identification.

Dear Paul,

I have no objection whatsoever to the two Early Harappan artifacts
shown in your pictures representing water buffalo, but what about
the two Sumerian examples? Who are the "specialists" who identified
those non-notched crescent-shaped objects as water-buffalo horns? To
me, that is a star-and-crescent symbol without any connection with
buffalo horns. In fact, I believe, with Parpola, that water-buffalo
was imported into Mesopotamia only starting from the Akkadian period.

Cheers,
Francesco Brighenti







Fri May 13, 2005 9:11 am

frabrig
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Message #876 of 1997 |
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Original posting: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Abhinavagupta/message/3127 ... There is none. However, that does not preclude the possibility that these are...
p.manansala@...
pinatubo.geo Offline Send Email
May 10, 2005
2:57 pm

... "Note that Greek and Roman coins portray elephants, which were not present in Europe" I have a Greek coin from the Seleucid period found in Petra, Jordan, ...
Richard Parker
richardparker01 Offline Send Email
May 10, 2005
5:46 pm

... Never heard of the "horns of the crescent moon." The phrase is quite ancient, for example, it appears in Indian astronomical texts (srnga = "horns"). The...
p.manansala@...
pinatubo.geo Offline Send Email
May 11, 2005
5:18 pm

... I have heard of the phrase horns of the crescent moon - but it was the specific reference to water buffalo's horns that I felt might be special pleading. ...
Richard Parker
richardparker01 Offline Send Email
May 11, 2005
10:08 pm

... The pictures in my last post have been identified as buffalo horns by specialists and it is rather obvious from the shape, relative proportions and notched...
Paul Kekai Manansala
pinatubo.geo Offline Send Email
May 11, 2005
10:12 pm

... was > > the specific reference to water buffalo's horns that I felt might be > > special pleading. > > The pictures you posted were very persuasive, but...
Francesco Brighenti
frabrig Offline Send Email
May 13, 2005
9:11 am

Corrected image from last post. Response to posting: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/austric/message/869 Regards, Paul Kekai Manansala ...
p.manansala@...
pinatubo.geo Offline Send Email
May 11, 2005
5:22 pm

... Yes, I meant mainly the obvious bovines in the Kot Diji and Sankalia artifacts. However, I'd like to show some seals from the private collection of Leroy...
p.manansala@...
pinatubo.geo Offline Send Email
May 13, 2005
2:43 pm

... Well, I'm very convinced by your picture of the Leroy Golf seal (actually you show the seal and its impression), particularly by the fact that the water...
Richard Parker
richardparker01 Offline Send Email
May 13, 2005
7:25 pm

... There is, in fact, plenty of physical evidence of water buffalo at Lagash (modern al-Hiba). Apparently, there was even a tanning industry using buffalo...
Paul Kekai Manansala
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May 13, 2005
7:45 pm

I'd like to note again on the seals referenced in my last message. These are artifacts in private collections described by an antiquities dealer. Regards, Paul...
p.manansala@...
pinatubo.geo Offline Send Email
May 13, 2005
3:26 pm

... The type of African cattle with huge horns are Ankole or Watusi - google images of either Regards Richard...
Richard Parker
richardparker01 Offline Send Email
May 13, 2005
7:25 pm

... Richard are you suggesting that the horns on the "Proto-Harappan" pottery of the Neolithic is that of African cattle? Wouldn't water buffalo be a simpler...
Paul Kekai Manansala
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May 13, 2005
8:51 pm

... No - I'm only acting as devil's advocate - there is an interesting post on early cattle at ... I've just downloaded it for later perusal, but you may find...
Richard Parker
richardparker01 Offline Send Email
May 14, 2005
1:02 pm

... www.coconutstudio.com) and am trying to find out > a bit more about the carabao. Dear Richard, Soon after Paul opened this List I had an interesting...
Francesco Brighenti
frabrig Offline Send Email
May 14, 2005
4:36 pm

I would suggest based on my study of early Spanish records and modern culture that many lowland Filipinos had taboos against killing or eating carabaos. Many...
Paul Kekai Manansala
pinatubo.geo Offline Send Email
May 14, 2005
10:25 pm

... snipped Thanks for the references I have only just begun to research the carabao (my primary interests are more towards Filipino seafood and vegetables,...
Richard Parker
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May 16, 2005
3:26 pm

... <frabrig@y...> ... The oldest archaeological remains of Bus bubalus, which is not native to the Philippines, date back to 900-1200 ACE from the Santa Ana...
Paul Kekai Manansala
pinatubo.geo Offline Send Email
May 16, 2005
4:20 pm

... That should be Bubalus bubalis. Bubalus mindorensis, aka the tamaraw, is native to the Philippines. Btw, the tamaraw is much smaller than the carabao...
Paul Kekai Manansala
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May 16, 2005
4:41 pm
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