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Fwd: Re: [tied] Re: That old Ariovistus scenario.   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #64338 of 65390 |
Fwd: Re: [tied] Re: That old Ariovistus scenario.

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, george knysh <gknysh@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> --- On Sun, 7/5/09, tgpedersen <tgpedersen@...> wrote:
>
> Scholar, not scholars. Boosen.
> GK: He cites others.
> Erh, OK.
> (GK) So that whatever changes are noted in the Oder/Warthe and
> other regions in the 1rst c. BCE are changes due to internal
> dynamics (and afterwards with interaction with the Romans), not to
> cultural or other influxes from the east.
>
> The interesting part is that the provenance of these new elements
> are not discussed at all.
>
> GK: Well you picked the source. Find a better one. Surely there
> are archaeological publications which comment on the identity and
> provenance of these inventories at least broadly "local" vs.
> "imports". The ball's in your court here.
>
> I haven't seen any. Do you feel up to the task of discussing the
> provenance of those particular grave goods which should or
> shouldn't be there?
>
> ****GK:Have a look at V. Mordvinceva's "Sarmatian Phalerae" It's a
> publication of the Deutsches Archeologisches Institut, Eurasien-
> Abteilung (around 2001?== particulars available on line. Check
> "Sarmatian phalerae".) I haven't looked at this, but it should give
> a pretty goods idea of one item to expect in a Sarmatian grave. Of
> course, cremation burials can be crossed out immediately. Other
> things to be checked: body position; weapons; ceramics;
> jewellery.*****

Thanks. Just ordered it.
A Snorri qoute to make you happy:

http://omacl.org/Heimskringla/ynglinga.html
'8. ODIN'S LAWGIVING.

Odin established the same law in his land that had been in force
in Asaland. Thus he established by law that all dead men should
be burned, and their belongings laid with them upon the pile, and
the ashes be cast into the sea or buried in the earth. Thus,
said he, every one will come to Valhalla with the riches he had
with him upon the pile; and he would also enjoy whatever he
himself had buried in the earth. For men of consequence a mound
should be raised to their memory, and for all other warriors who
had been distinguished for manhood a standing stone; which custom
remained long after Odin's time.'

ie. inhumation for his own men (those of consequence), cremation for
everyone else, like a dictator from the steppes would do, if he
intended to stay.


Torsten






Sun Jul 5, 2009 11:38 am

tgpedersen
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Message #64338 of 65390 |
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... Scholar, not scholars. Boosen. GK: He cites others. Erh, OK. (GK) So that whatever changes are noted in the Oder/Warthe and other regions in the 1rst c....
george knysh
gknysh
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Jul 5, 2009
11:10 am

... Thanks. Just ordered it. A Snorri qoute to make you happy: http://omacl.org/Heimskringla/ynglinga.html '8. ODIN'S LAWGIVING. Odin established the same law...
tgpedersen
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Jul 5, 2009
11:38 am

... A Snorri qoute to make you happy: http://omacl. org/Heimskringla /ynglinga. html '8. ODIN'S LAWGIVING. Odin established the same law in his land that had...
gknysh@...
gknysh
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Jul 5, 2009
10:21 pm

... http://omacl.org/Heimskringla/ynglinga.html 5. '... Now when Odin heard that things were in a prosperous condition in the land to the east beside Gylve; he...
tgpedersen
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Jul 6, 2009
9:58 am

... ****GK: Cut for economy, since none of this has any relevance to the fact that Swedish kings were cremated at Old Uppsala in the 6th century. According to...
gknysh
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Jul 6, 2009
12:03 pm

... The answer is that you are talking through your hat. http://tinyurl.com/kqsscf ... Nor that it is done over a cremation. ... That remains to be seen. The...
tgpedersen
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Jul 7, 2009
7:37 am

... ****GK: (From James Burnham): "An ideologue--one who thinks ideologically- can't lose. He can't lose because his answer, his interpretation and his...
gknysh
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Jul 7, 2009
12:12 pm

... BTW, did the "Yas" earlier the 13th century to the same Yazyg nation (or tribal group)? I mean the Yas population that, prior to the Mongolian invasion,...
tolgs001
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Jul 7, 2009
2:10 pm

... ****GK: I stand to be corrected on this, but my impression is that the classical Yazygi had been assimilated by the end of the 5th c. The Yazygi groups...
gknysh
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Jul 7, 2009
3:13 pm

... Is your false claim that Scandinavia used cremation exclusively an argument, an observations or an experiment? I disabuse you of your ignorance of funeral...
tgpedersen
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Jul 8, 2009
7:23 am

... BTW the Götar/Svear rivalry continues, in other forms, in Sweden http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6taland_theory The article is a good example of the...
tgpedersen
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Jul 8, 2009
9:50 am

... ****GK: I point out that you have misinterpreted your idol on a particular point, and you go berserk with irrelevant citations and incongruous as well as...
gknysh
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Jul 8, 2009
3:38 pm

... That would have been that Snorri did not specifically say that burials in mounds were inhumations? But archaeology shows they could be. ... In ...
tgpedersen
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Jul 8, 2009
5:55 pm

... the presence if inhumation is a prerequisite for Yasig presence ****GK: Indeed. But that is only one characteristic. Others are: the grave shape; the body...
gknysh@...
gknysh
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Jul 9, 2009
4:00 am

... Of course. But actually that raises an interesting principal question: Whatt does one do in the case of a partial match. Torsten...
tgpedersen
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Jul 9, 2009
7:43 am

... Yasig presence GK: Indeed. But that is only one characteristic. Others are: the grave shape; the body position and orientation; the funeral inventory...
george knysh
gknysh
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Jul 9, 2009
12:22 pm

... Doligocephality? http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/12962 cf. http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/12960 and ...
tgpedersen
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Jul 9, 2009
6:25 pm
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