On second thoughts, Skt. ahi- is *h2ngWHi- rather than *h1eg^Hi- -- cf. Av. az^i (and the the phonetically repetitive poetic formula <ahann ahim> 'he killed the serpent', which may well go back to pre-Indic times). This reduces the evidence for *h1eg^Hi- 'viper'. The main witness is Greek, where <ekhis> may be idiosyncratic ("stinger"? -- cf. the "sea-urchin" and "hedgehog" words). I wonder if there is a real basis for reconstructing *h1eg^Hi- as a PIE "snake" word. Baltic, Slavic and Latin require only *h2(o)ngWH-i- for "snake" and its derivatives for "eel". Gk. ophis and Arm. iz^ are a little irregular but at any rate require a root in *-gWH-, not *-g^H-; <ophis> may be a compromise between the ablaut variants *aphi- and *omphi- (as you seem to suggest) or between *omphi- and ekhi-.
Sorry for these changes of opinion, but I'm just analysing the material as the discussion goes on; please treat the above as tentative thoughts to be verified later :)
I think these two words (perhaps related in a older origin) developped into *h2ongWHi- "snake" and h1eg^Hi- "venomous snake, viper". Or perhaps *h1eg^Hi- "hedgehog" contaminated first root.
The Greek ophis is curious. We must have something like aphis, amphis or omphis <*(o)ngWHi-, beside ekhis, ekhidna "viper", ekhinos "hedgehod" < *eg^Hi- . I think the element Amphi- in some anthroponyms could have the meaning "snake" instead of "both".
And Germanic has the enigmatic egi/dehsa (OHG) "lizard". egi < eg^Hi- ?
What words _are_ diagnostic, I wonder? The danger of circular argumenation is always there, as groups migrating out of the range of X (X = beech, birch,...
Piotr Gasiorowski
gpiotr@...
Jul 9, 2001 9:13 am
... argumenation is always there, as groups migrating out of the range of X (X = beech, birch, salmon, lion, eel or whatever) Talking of birch, there are three...
S.Kalyanaraman
kalyan97@...
Jul 9, 2001 6:07 pm
They look like local names borrowed into Sanskrit. I wonder if khadira (> khair) 'cutch, Acacia catechu' isn't derived from the root {khad} 'be hard', as its...
Piotr Gasiorowski
gpiotr@...
Jul 9, 2001 8:43 pm
... the ... known ... the ... argumenation is always there, as groups migrating out of the range of X (X = beech, birch, salmon, lion, eel or whatever) would...
tgpedersen@...
Jul 10, 2001 9:36 am
Some of these words may be cognate after all; in particular, the "snake" and "eel" words are not quite unrelatable. Lat. anguis : anguilla, Lith. angis :...
Piotr Gasiorowski
gpiotr@...
Jul 10, 2001 12:03 pm
I think these two words (perhaps related in a older origin) developped into *h2ongWHi- "snake" and h1eg^Hi- "venomous snake, viper". Or perhaps *h1eg^Hi-...
Joćo S. Lopes Filho
jodan99@...
Jul 10, 2001 6:00 pm
On second thoughts, Skt. ahi- is *h2ngWHi- rather than *h1eg^Hi- -- cf. Av. az^i (and the the phonetically repetitive poetic formula <ahann ahim> 'he killed...
Piotr Gasiorowski
gpiotr@...
Jul 10, 2001 7:35 pm
... cf. Av. az^i (and the the phonetically repetitive poetic formula <ahann ahim> 'he killed the serpent', which may well go back to pre- Indic times). This...
tgpedersen@...
Jul 11, 2001 9:50 am
Of course IE snakes could be "emanations of the principle of crookedness" or creepy-crawly snakehood, but in that case derivatives of *serp- 'to wind, be...
Piotr Gasiorowski
gpiotr@...
Jul 11, 2001 10:44 am
... crookedness" or creepy-crawly snakehood, but in that case derivatives of *serp- 'to wind, be crooked, creep' were used, hence Lat. serpent- , Gk. herpet-...
tgpedersen@...
Jul 12, 2001 9:59 am
Sorry, a typo. I mean {h2eng^H-} as in German eng, Latin angere, etc. Piotr ... From: Piotr Gasiorowski To: cybalist@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 11,...
Piotr Gasiorowski
gpiotr@...
Jul 11, 2001 12:56 pm
... From: tgpedersen@... To: cybalist@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2001 4:59 AM Subject: [tied] Re: PIE for "eel" <snip> "You have to...
proto-language
proto-language@...
Jul 12, 2001 11:43 am
... was ... more ... , which is analyzable into *a:-, 'water'+ *le/o-, 'worm'. ... language/ ... religion/indexR.html ... My NuDansk Ordbog says of ål, Aal,...
tgpedersen@...
Jul 13, 2001 8:48 am
The trick won't work. The sequence *-ngWH- can only give -ng(w)- across the board in Germanic. Vernerian alternations are only possible in words containing an...
Piotr Gasiorowski
gpiotr@...
Jul 13, 2001 3:48 pm
There were attempts to connect *e:laz with Greek *egkhe:lys (-e:lus). Other possibility is to analyze *e:laz as *es-los, perhaps a root *es- related to Latin...
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