Stas and I were having a conversation. I'm moving it here, because it is exactly the type of stuff I need to understand better. ... Not per se. It's a given,...
Another interesting conversation with Tom Brown. ... You aren't going to need it. It's an XP term. I've got a glossary with these terms. I'm probably going...
[I apologize in advance if you didn't want me to take these conversations public. -- Rob] ... Hopefully by June, but maybe July... ... Thanks. ... They are too...
4
Perrin Harkins
perrin@...
Jan 28, 2002 8:02 pm
Not perl-specific, but kind of an XP thing: I am trying to convert the management at my organization to a more XP way of thinking regarding estimates. I just...
5
Tom Brown
tbrown@...
Jan 28, 2002 9:01 pm
... Not it my experience. Pair programming and testing were harder to introduce to an environment foreign to those concepts... and the test suites are of...
In a message dated 28-Jan-02 6:15:30 PM GMT Standard Time, nagler@... ... Actually I don't find either of these to be particularly true. While it is true...
7
Ged Haywood
ged@...
Jan 29, 2002 1:08 am
Hi Perrin, ... For the last two thousand years or so, people who have tried to change the way other people think have usually wound up nailed to something. ......
8
Ed Grimm
ed@...
Jan 29, 2002 4:27 am
... I'd say it's a natural consequence of testing. Who finds bugs then releases the code? ... I disagree - modular programming is necessary for XP, but OO is...
9
Uwe Voelker
uwe.voelker@...
Jan 29, 2002 4:40 pm
... Does the book only refer to bOP examples? It then would be like "Instant CGI/Perl" which relates to the Extropia web application framework. I would like to...
... For the most part, yes. I am not particularly happy about it. My goal is to sell the idea that perl is an application programming language, and that it...
... Excellent point. ... I like this. One of the points I try to make in the refactoring chapter is that every refactoring has and equally valid converse. ...
12
Tom Brown
tbrown@...
Jan 29, 2002 7:36 pm
... but it's not. An array in a scalar context is the number of elements in it. I don't need to tell you that, your knowledge of the language is better than...
... I've had fairly good results combining the two. It's convincing free software folks to write tests that's tricky. -- chromatic...
15
Ged Haywood
ged@...
Jan 29, 2002 8:58 pm
Hi Rob, ... I spent the better part of the previous two years doing both, for a system with something approaching 4 million users world-wide (IE and Netscape,...
Sorry -- just saw this posting on RMIUG... hope some of you can make it on such short notice! - Alex *** Randal L. Schwartz will be giving a presentation on...
I uploaded the story card we use at bivio: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/extremeperl/files/story-card.pdf I have gotten into the habit of using story cards for...
18
Ed Grimm
ed@...
Feb 2, 2002 2:31 am
... Correction: it's convincing *anybody* to write tests when they haven't learned to on their own that's tricky. I've also noticed it's rather difficult to...
Well, as a new convert to writing tests I can attest to your hypothesis. In general I have not sat down and written a good test suite when coding something...
... How about some brainstorming then? Here are several benefits of writing tests, in no particular order: - to clarify the intent of the code - to enforce...
... Well, based on some work I did last night I have a prime example. I had written some modules previously that worked and are currently in production. Since...
... I like to distinguish between acceptance and unit tests. For unit tests, I would add: - to validate the API - to enable refactoring - to keep the cost of...
Could you explain a little more about the two types of tests you mention below? Specifically the acceptance tests, and how they would relate to web apps. I'm...
... There are many different kinds of tests including performance and load testing. In XP we're mostly concerned about unit and acceptance testing. ... What...
... How do you do that? I've only heard of tools that allow you to create a script and then playback that script. This is semiuseful, but what happens if you...
... If it's hidden, it's not hidden very well. :) Here's my take. Programmers don't want to write tests because: - it's not their job - it's not "real"...
... All your points are right on the money. I would venture to guess that most "good" programmers would not be against writing tests. IMHO, it's usually ...
28
Ged Haywood
ged@...
Feb 8, 2002 1:11 am
Hi all, ... [snip] ... See attached. I once had to fly to seven or eight different countries over a period of several weeks to fix a $0.25 problem in a couple...
... The first step is to make sure your interface has structure. If you are testing arbitrarily constructed templates, you're going to have a rough time. If...
... Rob, Can you upload an example of a filled-in story card? I'm curious about the level of detail you're using in these. We always have a problem of getting...
