I concur with Somik's analysis of the various tests at the various levels. I was just making a point that although you *could* drive development directly from...
... Anil has been removed. From the group, that is. Ron Jeffries www.XProgramming.com Speak the affirmative; emphasize your choice by utterly ignoring all that...
... And how many XP projects have led you to this pearl of wisdom? -- I n d u s t r i a l L o g i c , I n c . Joshua Kerievsky Founder, Extreme Programmer &...
... Well, he influenced *one* decision maker, at least ... (PS: Thanks, Ron!) -- Edmund Schweppe -- schweppe@... -- http://schweppe.home.tiac.net The...
Edmund Schweppe
schweppe@...
Feb 1, 2004 6:15 pm
88650
... Would Sarcasm Objection, or Rudeness Objection be more appropriate here? Ron Jeffries www.XProgramming.com Wisdom begins when we discover the difference...
... This question, the need for small-grain tests, is still open for me. Can you give me more background for your statement? Have you tried it both ways? What...
I wrote this article a few months ago for the Cutter Consortium. I thought it might be interesting to those in this group who are looking to synthesize the...
... Josh! It's your cue! ;-) ===== Phlip http://www.xpsd.org/cgi-bin/wiki?TestFirstUserInterfaces __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo!...
... I thought the PatternBacklash on Wiki was a bit much. But I understand the concern that a fool with a tool is still a fool... "Often the Pattern novice...
... I just spent a few days with Amir in SF and know that he's not overly sensitive: i.e. he can handle an email jab. I'm poking at Amir because I believe he...
Arrrrrrrrrgh, didn't get my point across again. Let me rephrase :-) I was just pointing out some reasons why doing *only* story driven tests (through fixtures)...
Waaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhh wahhhhhhhhhhhhh wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh MOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMMMMYYYYYYY The big ugly man made fun of me Mommmmmmmmmyyyy Now that I got...
... They can be. That doesn't mean they always are. If GoF design patterns are used too early, they can rob the developer of the opportunity to do the simplest...
Tim Haughton (OmniBus...
tim.haughton@...
Feb 2, 2004 8:38 am
88663
... I'd certainly be hesitant to say it's impossible. But personally, I frequently notice that I'm thrashing, and that adding lower-layer tests helps focus my...
... So tell us again what the drawbacks of doing only story tests are, based, ideally on your experience doing it both ways, but if not, why you feel that you...
... Yes. There is a tension between design up front and letting the design emerge. I find that the less up front design I put into the code, the better my...
(responding to John Roth) ... Agreed, and that applies outside of XP too. Thinking about the problem and making a stab at a solution is very valuable, and...
... We appear to be discussing the difference between glue code and computer science. If all the user story requests is a dab of glue, its tests won't need to...
... I do not understand the relationship between the original posting and your comment. Ron Jeffries www.XProgramming.com Mixed metaphors are a bright sunny...
... A (perhaps) happy medium would be for a master to say 'OK, I'm pretty sure we're going to need a visitor, so we'll head in that direction, but I'll only...
Tim Haughton (OmniBus...
tim.haughton@...
Feb 2, 2004 12:33 pm
88670
... Yes. In innumerable exchanges with Josh, I have suggested "refactoring /toward/ patterns" rather than "refactoring /to/ patterns". Ron Jeffries ...
... In summary, what problems do you see? ... To me, whoever that is, I think that the main point is the distinction of test owner. The story tests (Customer...
... As you continually refactor *toward* a pattern, certainly at some point to can say that you are there? Not that being there is the end goal... but at some...
... Actually what I find is that I get closer to that pattern, but that then some other forces get strong enough to move me in that direction instead. So I...
... Josh! Name it /Fishtailing between Patterns/! ===== Phlip http://www.xpsd.org/cgi-bin/wiki?TestFirstUserInterfaces __________________________________ Do...
... then some ... So I don't ... code that ... Either you will code a pattern or not, I think they are necessary instead of harmful, if there are beginners in...
Marco Antonio Márq...
marcoamg@...
Feb 2, 2004 4:29 pm
88676
Maybe something is being lost in translation, but I cannot figure out what you are trying to say, Marco. Could you please try again? ... From: Marco Antonio...
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