Thanks to Teddy for the following tip:

Some plugins don't produce any midi output when you move their
onscreen controls. Phatmatik is one.

To learn controls on one of these "difficult" plugins, turn the
track's automation view on, and use the automation flipmenu to select
the automation view for the control you'd like to learn. Instead of
moving the control on the plugin surface, move the little yellow
automation level indicator on the track itself - the appropriate
fader events will be generated and Fadermapper will be able to learn
them.
John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 24 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

>I can convert the demo song and send it to him if you want? What's his
>email address?

Can you zip-compress it and send it back to me? Then I'll have one on
hand for any similar incidents. Thanks.


--
John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 24 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

At 06:09 PM 11/6/2002, you wrote:
  > Anyone using XP? I have a guy wants to try the demo
  > says it crashes XP when converting from Mac format...

Working just fine here in XP, Logic v5.3+ ...

I can convert the demo song and send it to him if you want? What's his
email address?


Best wishes,
Jeremy Martin; sadus@...
http://www.carrollsweb.com/sadus <-- music links, PC DAW parts list

Best wishes,
Jeremy Martin; sadus@...
http://www.carrollsweb.com/sadus <-- music links, PC DAW parts list

XP here...

all rollin here...


----- Original Message -----
From: "John Pitcairn" <johnp@...>
To: <fadermapper-users@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 12:09 AM
Subject: [fadermapper-users] Win XP


> Anyone using XP? I have a guy wants to try the demo says it crashes
> XP when converting from Mac format...
>
> John Pitcairn
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
> http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 24 Oct 2002
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> fadermapper-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

Anyone using XP? I have a guy wants to try the demo says it crashes
XP when converting from Mac format...

John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 24 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

o, and it operates as a sep app so u can still have all ur regular kc's...

and, it's shareware - the basic version has all u need so get it cos it's
gratis...


----- Original Message -----
From: "Muted" <part.muted@...>
To: <fadermapper-users@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 03, 2002 5:45 PM
Subject: Re: [fadermapper-users] Keycommands for sync/mode/mem/bank/shift


> > I've just had some success using Hendrik Jan Veenstra's Qmk utility
> > to send notes to Logic by pressing keys on the computer keyboard, and
> > using those for Fadermapper sync etc. This means you can assign keys
> > for Fadermapper controls, whee....
>
> Great so far...
>
> > Requires that there's no existing Logic keycommand assigned to that
> > key. Also requires OMS, so no good for Windows users, sorry.
>
> The pain, no go for win...however...
>
> Found this lil' prog: Virtual MIDI Keyboard
> (http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Campus/6501/)
> Turns a reg PC keyboard into a device thats outputs midi note msgs, only
> downside being that it'll of course require a whole midiport...all working
> tasty here atm tho with me new Pulsar2 and it's s/w midi ports :)
>
> Keep dem faders flyin'...
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> fadermapper-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

> I've just had some success using Hendrik Jan Veenstra's Qmk utility
> to send notes to Logic by pressing keys on the computer keyboard, and
> using those for Fadermapper sync etc. This means you can assign keys
> for Fadermapper controls, whee....

Great so far...

> Requires that there's no existing Logic keycommand assigned to that
> key. Also requires OMS, so no good for Windows users, sorry.

The pain, no go for win...however...

Found this lil' prog: Virtual MIDI Keyboard
(http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Campus/6501/)
Turns a reg PC keyboard into a device thats outputs midi note msgs, only
downside being that it'll of course require a whole midiport...all working
tasty here atm tho with me new Pulsar2 and it's s/w midi ports :)

Keep dem faders flyin'...

I've just had some success using Hendrik Jan Veenstra's Qmk utility
to send notes to Logic by pressing keys on the computer keyboard, and
using those for Fadermapper sync etc. This means you can assign keys
for Fadermapper controls, whee....

Requires that there's no existing Logic keycommand assigned to that
key. Also requires OMS, so no good for Windows users, sorry.

http://utopia.ision.nl/users/h/soft/qmk.html

John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 24 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

The "default" value for soft takeover for any given control is 64.
This is obviously wrong for just about anything, but will be
corrected whenever a control is moved and passes through the 64 value
for the first time.

However, this won't work for learned controls where the control value
never gets to 64 anyway - exmaples being mute, solo, bypasses, synth
octave settings, that sort of thing, where the range might be 0-1,
0-3, 0-15 etc. For practically all of these, clicking/changing the
_onscreen_ control will set the soft takeover value correctly, and
external control will work fine from then onwards.

The exception is solo - in Logic 5.1+, clicking the solo button does
NOT send a message via the audio object's output cable, regardless of
the track automation preferences setting for solo. This means solo
can't be learned, and the incorrect soft takeover value can't be
reset. The workaround:

To learn solo, learn the mute button instead, then change the learned
Fadermapper control # from 9 (mute) to 3 (solo).

To fix the "stuck" solo soft takeover - create a button fader, out
definition = Fader, ch1, #3, range 0-0. Cable it directly to the
sequencer input in the Clicks & Ports layer. Select the track in the
Arrange and click the button you made.

Now solo should be controllable.


John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 24 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Working on a TX81Z editor w/Fadermapper integration. A wee heads up
to those of you with midi gear - don't send sysex to any part of
Fadermapper. Reliable crash as soon as you move a control...

John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 24 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

>Will try it out later this weekend....

>Sample enviro attached.

Oh bugger. That wasn't meant to go the whole list, must remember to
check the headers before replying. Hadn't had my coffee...

John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 24 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

>Will try it out later this weekend....

Sample enviro attached.

John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 24 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Another nifty feature John...!

Will try it out later this weekend....

Nice1...

Dan //


----- Original Message -----
From: "John Pitcairn" <johnp@...>
To: <fadermapper-users@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 26, 2002 10:25 AM
Subject: [fadermapper-users] Autoscroll mixer window to match ID shift
amount


> Having ditched the Roland JP-8080 in favour of something with a more
> conventional control layout - a Fostex VM200 digital mixer acquired
> at runout special price - I set about attempting to get the onscreen
> mixer (displaying 8 channels at a time to match the external
> controller) to automatically scroll when the "ID shift" function is
> used, so what you see is what you control - WYSIWYC...
>
> Turns out to be not too difficult. At its most basic implementation,
> proceed as follows:
>
> Setup a screenset with an Environment window displaying the same
> number of Audio objects as your external controller layout. In my
> case the VM200 has 8 channels of fader/mute/solo/pan, so I made a
> window that displays just that many Audio objects at once. The window
> will actually need to be a little wider than that so it scrolls
> correctly - the idea is that scrolling one page right will display
> the next group of Audio objects in exactly the same position. You can
> cover the excess up with the edge of another floating window
> (Arrange, perhaps).
>
> At the far right of the Audio environment layer, you need to ensure
> that a final object is positioned so that when you have scrolled to
> the end in 1-page steps, scrolling back down in 1-page steps will
> again position the view correctly. It takes a bit of experimentation,
> but once it's all set up and pages up/down reliably, protect cabling
> & positions for the window so Logic doesn't "helpfully" remove any
> blank space.
>
> Make a Fadermapper "multi" bank to control the first group of Audio
> objects displayed in this window. Set your "ID shift" amount to match
> the number of objects you can see.
>
> Define external midi messages for the commands "page left" and "page
> right". I used note-on C-2 and C#-2 on ch1.
>
> Following the "ext shift" Fadermapper macro, you want a pair of
> transformers - the first one copies matching events: p-press | ch7 |
> note 0 | val<=1 |  and tranforms to the above notes. The second
> transformer splits those notes off and sends them back to the
> physical input. Everything else goes to the "split active cha"
> transformer as before.
>
> Voila! Sometimes I do love Logic.
>
> Note this will only work if you have defined Fadermapper "external
> shift" messages - clicking the shift up & down buttons in the
> floating Fadermapper controls window has no auto-scroll effect - I
> think the wrong window gets focus.
>
> Note also that in the auto-scroll screenset, the window that has
> focus will receive the page left & page right commands. Thus it's a
> good idea to make all the other windows floating windows (works on
> the mac anyway).
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
>
> I've made an example environment based on the above, with window
> setup for an ID shift value of 8, and Audio objects from my Autoload
> (RME Multiface) - email me if you want it. It has a few additional
> enhancements:
>
> * The autoscroll logic is mostly packed into a macro that allows you
> to turn it on & off, since you really don't want other screensets
> auto-scrolling.
>
> * You can set the maximum # of ID shift steps (rightmost white
> value), and the auto-scroll wraps around so when you hit the far
> right, ID shifting up will return you to the far left, & vice versa.
> To do this, you need two more midi messages defined - "page leftmost"
> = note-on D-2; and "page rightmost = note-on D#-2. You also need the
> position of the rightmost object in the Audio layer set so the
> page-right command positions things sensibly.
>
> * The ID shift output from the Fadermapper controls macro is split
> off and sent to the autoscroll macro, so that the Fadermapper ID
> shift buttons will behave the same with respect to maximum steps and
> wraparound when autoscroll is on (but will not autoscroll the mixer
> window).
>
> * The autoscroll macro shows the current step number (leftmost white
> value), as it's possible to get the window position, autoscroll step,
> and ID shift amount out of sync. If/when this happens, turn
> autoscroll off, return the window to the leftmost position, set the
> autoscroll current step number to zero, and click the Fadermapper
> shift up or down buttons until the shift amount (centre grey value)
> shows zero. Then turn autoscroll back on and things should be in sync
> again.
>
> I'll look at getting the autoscroll step number to track the main
> Fadermapper ID shift value at all times, but since the ID shift step
> amount can vary, it'll involve 14-bit division, which is non-trivial
> using the available environment objects. If I can get that working
> then I'll also be able to get the auto-scroll environment window to
> jump to the currently-controlled objects when auto-scroll is switched
> on. Don't hold your breath.
>
> I'll probably build the auto-scroll feature into Fadermapper for
> version 1.1, but as it's very specific to the number of external
> controls and their layout, I don't know whether I'll include it in
> the demo. Certainly it'll be up to the user to setup the autoscroll
> screenset to suit their own controller setup, and I'll need to
> provide decent docs for that (sigh).
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
>
> The example environment also features a revised arrangement of the ID
> select and Soft Takeover modules, which are now modular in 16-object
> groups. This allows considerably easier addition of groups of IDs,
> and importing of Fadermapper to existing songs, for which I have
> completely revised the procedure. Documentation in (slow) progress...
>
> If anyone needs a setup for 208 audio objects, let me know - I built
> one for a new user. It's rather generic, so you need to spend a
> little time to set the "cha" parameter for all the audio objects and
> rename them appropriately.
>
>
> John Pitcairn
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
> http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 24 Oct 2002
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> fadermapper-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

Having ditched the Roland JP-8080 in favour of something with a more
conventional control layout - a Fostex VM200 digital mixer acquired
at runout special price - I set about attempting to get the onscreen
mixer (displaying 8 channels at a time to match the external
controller) to automatically scroll when the "ID shift" function is
used, so what you see is what you control - WYSIWYC...

Turns out to be not too difficult. At its most basic implementation,
proceed as follows:

Setup a screenset with an Environment window displaying the same
number of Audio objects as your external controller layout. In my
case the VM200 has 8 channels of fader/mute/solo/pan, so I made a
window that displays just that many Audio objects at once. The window
will actually need to be a little wider than that so it scrolls
correctly - the idea is that scrolling one page right will display
the next group of Audio objects in exactly the same position. You can
cover the excess up with the edge of another floating window
(Arrange, perhaps).

At the far right of the Audio environment layer, you need to ensure
that a final object is positioned so that when you have scrolled to
the end in 1-page steps, scrolling back down in 1-page steps will
again position the view correctly. It takes a bit of experimentation,
but once it's all set up and pages up/down reliably, protect cabling
& positions for the window so Logic doesn't "helpfully" remove any
blank space.

Make a Fadermapper "multi" bank to control the first group of Audio
objects displayed in this window. Set your "ID shift" amount to match
the number of objects you can see.

Define external midi messages for the commands "page left" and "page
right". I used note-on C-2 and C#-2 on ch1.

Following the "ext shift" Fadermapper macro, you want a pair of
transformers - the first one copies matching events: p-press | ch7 |
note 0 | val<=1 |  and tranforms to the above notes. The second
transformer splits those notes off and sends them back to the
physical input. Everything else goes to the "split active cha"
transformer as before.

Voila! Sometimes I do love Logic.

Note this will only work if you have defined Fadermapper "external
shift" messages - clicking the shift up & down buttons in the
floating Fadermapper controls window has no auto-scroll effect - I
think the wrong window gets focus.

Note also that in the auto-scroll screenset, the window that has
focus will receive the page left & page right commands. Thus it's a
good idea to make all the other windows floating windows (works on
the mac anyway).

-------------------------------------------------------

I've made an example environment based on the above, with window
setup for an ID shift value of 8, and Audio objects from my Autoload
(RME Multiface) - email me if you want it. It has a few additional
enhancements:

* The autoscroll logic is mostly packed into a macro that allows you
to turn it on & off, since you really don't want other screensets
auto-scrolling.

* You can set the maximum # of ID shift steps (rightmost white
value), and the auto-scroll wraps around so when you hit the far
right, ID shifting up will return you to the far left, & vice versa.
To do this, you need two more midi messages defined - "page leftmost"
= note-on D-2; and "page rightmost = note-on D#-2. You also need the
position of the rightmost object in the Audio layer set so the
page-right command positions things sensibly.

* The ID shift output from the Fadermapper controls macro is split
off and sent to the autoscroll macro, so that the Fadermapper ID
shift buttons will behave the same with respect to maximum steps and
wraparound when autoscroll is on (but will not autoscroll the mixer
window).

* The autoscroll macro shows the current step number (leftmost white
value), as it's possible to get the window position, autoscroll step,
and ID shift amount out of sync. If/when this happens, turn
autoscroll off, return the window to the leftmost position, set the
autoscroll current step number to zero, and click the Fadermapper
shift up or down buttons until the shift amount (centre grey value)
shows zero. Then turn autoscroll back on and things should be in sync
again.

I'll look at getting the autoscroll step number to track the main
Fadermapper ID shift value at all times, but since the ID shift step
amount can vary, it'll involve 14-bit division, which is non-trivial
using the available environment objects. If I can get that working
then I'll also be able to get the auto-scroll environment window to
jump to the currently-controlled objects when auto-scroll is switched
on. Don't hold your breath.

I'll probably build the auto-scroll feature into Fadermapper for
version 1.1, but as it's very specific to the number of external
controls and their layout, I don't know whether I'll include it in
the demo. Certainly it'll be up to the user to setup the autoscroll
screenset to suit their own controller setup, and I'll need to
provide decent docs for that (sigh).

-------------------------------------------------------

The example environment also features a revised arrangement of the ID
select and Soft Takeover modules, which are now modular in 16-object
groups. This allows considerably easier addition of groups of IDs,
and importing of Fadermapper to existing songs, for which I have
completely revised the procedure. Documentation in (slow) progress...

If anyone needs a setup for 208 audio objects, let me know - I built
one for a new user. It's rather generic, so you need to spend a
little time to set the "cha" parameter for all the audio objects and
rename them appropriately.


John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 24 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

That works great, thanks. It says P-1 through P-5 when doing this so I'm sure you remembered the right method. Odd that they didn't seem to mention this in the manual at all but maybe I just missed it repeatedly (I looked and looked for a while but gave up:-).

So this is a little less than intuitive, but if you press the button under the numeric display and then use the octave up/down buttons to the right it will switch... the thing is that by default all 5 of the sets are set to the same knob/cc# mapping so you might not know that you have made the change until you set some of the banks differently.
I'm at work telling you this from memory, so it still doesn't work drop me another line and I'll write it while I step through it on my oxy and write up some more detailed instructions.

So this is a little less than intuitive, but if you press the button under the
numeric display and then use the octave up/down buttons to the right it will
switch... the thing is that by default all 5 of the sets are set to the same
knob/cc# mapping so you might not know that you have made the change until you
set some of the banks differently.

I'm at work telling you this from memory, so it still doesn't work drop me
another line and I'll write it while I step through it on my oxy and write up
some more detailed instructions.

/robb


On Tuesday, Oct 15, 2002, at 11:42PM, Jeremy Martin <sadus@...>
wrote:

>--- In fadermapper-users@y..., John Pitcairn <johnp@r...> wrote:
>> In any case, if you can build a new Autoload around the existing
>> Fadermapper 1.0 song, that will always be the quickest solution,
>> unless your existing autoload is insanely large & complicated.
>
>Luckily mine is not at all, so I'll just do that. Thanks for the in-
>depth explanation.
>
>Rob Monn writes:
>> I have an oxygen8 -- it has 8 knobs and 5 "program sets" with
>> different knob settings on each one... so I can get 40 controllers.
>
>Btw Rob, how do you do this? I just got an Oxygen8 recently and can't
>seem to find which function does this. "Program" seems to just send
>out program change #s (not 1-5 but 1-128) and "Set CTRL" seems to
>just be to assign what CCs the knobs send out, but doesn't offer
>the "switch between 5 different banks" functionality you're talking
>about.
>
>Thanks!
>Jeremy Martin; sadus@...
>http://www.carrollsweb.com/sadus
>
>
>
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>fadermapper-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>


/.robb
http://www.nervous.net/~robb

On Thursday, October 17, 2002, at 12:27  AM, Muted wrote:
> People who are comfortable in the enviro should be fine incorporating
> FM
> into they're own song as it's pretty straightforward to do so - as u
> say
> it's mainly one layer...and u can always have 2 songs open and flick
> back n
> forth to see whats happening etc...

Yeah, but eventually someone with practically zero Environment
experience will need to do it - disaster! ;-)

I might just wait until someone really does need to get Fadermapper
into an existing song. The application I had in mind was "what if I
want to go back and mix a song I did a while ago, using Fadermapper to
do the automation?" There might already be a mixer config, plugins,
routing, basic levels & pans etc, which you wouldn't want to lose...

I think the "roll your own" docs will go as follows:

1 - Setting up the Clicks & Ports layer & input cabling.

2 - Importing the "Fadermapper" processing layer & cabling to/from
Clicks & Ports.

3 - Setting up ID sub-select switches for X number of objects as needed.

4 - Adding Soft Takeover modules and ID modules for 16 Audio Objects
and 1 Multi-Instrument, and from then on it's all repetitive
copy/paste/cable work, using the Fadermapper song as a reference.

I will provide a Fadermapper song that is set up in a more
import-friendly way than the "real" Fadermapper song (ie ID modules &
Soft Takeover modules on the same layer, & no cabling between layers).

But I'm a tad sick of writing html documentation, so if I can hold off
until it's needed so much the better...

John Pitcairn

------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 7 Oct 2002
------------------------------------------------------------

I don't think u need to much for the roll ur own help John as I imagine most
people who are not too up to scratch in the enviro would just use the song u
provided as a default setup and work from that to configure they're
autoload...

People who are comfortable in the enviro should be fine incorporating FM
into they're own song as it's pretty straightforward to do so - as u say
it's mainly one layer...and u can always have 2 songs open and flick back n
forth to see whats happening etc...

Best...


Dan //

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeremy Martin" <sadus@...>
To: <fadermapper-users@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2002 9:57 PM
Subject: [fadermapper-users] Re: Roll your own


> --- In fadermapper-users@y..., John Pitcairn <johnp@r...> wrote:
> > So ... seeing as how I'm allegedly working on instructions to roll
> > your own Fadermapper environment starting with the basic
> > components -  does anyone have a real pressing need for this? Or is
> > the supplied version (80 audio objects, 1 multi-inst) just fine for
> > now? If anyone _is_ wanting the "roll your own" docs, what is it
> > that you need to set up? My big problem is that I know it far too
> > well, so specific questions are very welcome at this stage...

--- In fadermapper-users@y..., John Pitcairn <johnp@r...> wrote:
> In any case, if you can build a new Autoload around the existing
> Fadermapper 1.0 song, that will always be the quickest solution,
> unless your existing autoload is insanely large & complicated.

Luckily mine is not at all, so I'll just do that. Thanks for the in-
depth explanation.

Rob Monn writes:
> I have an oxygen8 -- it has 8 knobs and 5 "program sets" with
> different knob settings on each one... so I can get 40 controllers.

Btw Rob, how do you do this? I just got an Oxygen8 recently and can't
seem to find which function does this. "Program" seems to just send
out program change #s (not 1-5 but 1-128) and "Set CTRL" seems to
just be to assign what CCs the knobs send out, but doesn't offer
the "switch between 5 different banks" functionality you're talking
about.

Thanks!
Jeremy Martin; sadus@...
http://www.carrollsweb.com/sadus

Hi Jeremy - I'm posting this to the Fadermapper list as it's a useful
discussion of the difficulties...

>I don't really need to know how to make it 100% from scratch -- just
>a simple guide for copying over the fadermapper into an existing song
>would be sufficient.

It's certainly possible, and doesn't need to be from scratch. The big
problem is that when importing environments, cabling between objects
on different layers almost always gets assigned to the wrong
destination objects - Logic employs some kind of dynamic numbering
scheme for environment objects, so for example "Audio object 1" in
song X will not be the same object reference as "Audio object 1" in
song Y, as far as Logic is concerned.

Fadermapper is _mostly_ in one layer, but on import all the cabling
between the Soft Takeover modules and the Audio or Midi objects
(which runs in a loop between the layers, one loop for each object)
gets messed up. So there will be at least 3 cables per Audio/Midi
object to re-do, and if you need more than the 80 audio objects and 1
midi multi-inst the Fadermapper song provides, you need to make new
Soft Takeover modules as well, which involves more cabling actions
for each of those.

It's rather long and repetitive work, and needs to be done accurately...

>If that's not possible due to cabling etc then
>just building a new autoload song around the fadermapper.lso would be
>far easier than making one from scratch..

It's far, far easier than importing & re-cabling too.

>Honestly I have never tried
>importing environments from song to song before, so please let me
>know if I need to submit a bug report to Emagic about the Environment
>not having a good 'import' feature! (as I'm a beta tester now for
>them)

They'd need to re-code the entire environment to support a static
reference scheme I suspect. I'm certain they are aware of the
difficulty (cough).

I've taken another look at the "roll your own" docs as they currently
stand, and have concluded that importing & cabling the Fadermapper
1.0 song is just too easy to mess up. I'm going to provide a
different Fadermapper song to import, which will help eliminate most
of the re-cabling required, but will require a different approach and
will take some time to build and document.

I'm also going to look at removing the distinction between the
different Soft Takeover modules for midi vs audio, or will at least
try to make them easily switchable (that might be a later version
though).

In any case, if you can build a new Autoload around the existing
Fadermapper 1.0 song, that will always be the quickest solution,
unless your existing autoload is insanely large & complicated.


--
John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 7 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

--- In fadermapper-users@y..., John Pitcairn <johnp@r...> wrote:
> So ... seeing as how I'm allegedly working on instructions to roll
> your own Fadermapper environment starting with the basic
> components -  does anyone have a real pressing need for this? Or is
> the supplied version (80 audio objects, 1 multi-inst) just fine for
> now? If anyone _is_ wanting the "roll your own" docs, what is it
> that you need to set up? My big problem is that I know it far too
> well, so specific questions are very welcome at this stage...


I don't really need to know how to make it 100% from scratch -- just
a simple guide for copying over the fadermapper into an existing song
would be sufficient. If that's not possible due to cabling etc then
just building a new autoload song around the fadermapper.lso would be
far easier than making one from scratch.. Honestly I have never tried
importing environments from song to song before, so please let me
know if I need to submit a bug report to Emagic about the Environment
not having a good 'import' feature! (as I'm a beta tester now for
them)

Best wishes,
Jeremy Martin; sadus@...
http://www.carrollsweb.com/sadus

So I bit the bullet and upgraded OSX from 10.1.5 to 10.2.1. As
expected, it wiped out all my custom Unix config files. Sigh...

Anyway, Logic 5.4 can load OSX AudioUnit plugins. Based on the few
Apple plugins that come with OSX (a few EQs, filters, delays, simple
stuff), Fadermapper seems to work just fine as long as there's an
onscreen control to learn. The Apple AudioUnits all use Logic's
default "controls" view, they don't have a GUI of their own.

I'll test a few AU plugins that _do_ have custom GUIs, but at present
it looks like some will work with Fadermapper's "learn" function,
others won't (but likely will if switched to "controls" view while
learning).

Early days yet...

--
--------------------------------------

John Pitcairn

Got midi fader/knob hardware? Want to control & automate Logic?
Try the Fadermapper demo: http://www.revolver.co.nz/fadermapper/

So ... seeing as how I'm allegedly working on instructions to roll
your own Fadermapper environment starting with the basic components -
does anyone have a real pressing need for this? Or is the supplied
version (80 audio objects, 1 multi-inst) just fine for now?

If anyone _is_ wanting the "roll your own" docs, what is it that you
need to set up? My big problem is that I know it far too well, so
specific questions are very welcome at this stage...

--
John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 7 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Right.  I have an oxygen8 -- it has 8 knobs and 5 "program sets" with different
knob settings on each one... so I can get 40 controllers.  It is a shame I sold
my virus as it had a ton of knobs and buttons.  But I like the Emagic ES2 a lot
more.  My bandmate has a Drehbank and made overlays for it that he can write on
with grease pencil while playing live to track the mappings he has made (in
Reaktor.)  I'm working up a system like that, too, for the Oxy8.



On Tuesday, Oct 08, 2002, at 08:33AM, John Pitcairn <johnp@...>
wrote:

>Maybe a little obvious, but ...
>
>If your controller has multiple presets available in the hardware, it
>can be worth setting those up so preset 1 = CC1-16, preset 2 =
>CC17-32, etc (assuming 16 physical controls). Then you can make use
>of more of the 128 available mappings in a single Fadermapper bank by
>changing presets at the controller.
>
>In my case, the JP-8080 is 2-part multitimbral - if I select the
>"upper" part, it transmits controls on channel 1, and if I select the
>"lower" part it's channel 2 - with a bit of port-splitting &
>transformering prior to Fadermapper, I can translate that into 84
>usable controls per Fadermapper bank, not counting the buttons...
>
>--
>John Pitcairn
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
>http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 7 Oct 2002
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>fadermapper-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>


/.robb
http://www.nervous.net/~robb

Maybe a little obvious, but ...

If your controller has multiple presets available in the hardware, it
can be worth setting those up so preset 1 = CC1-16, preset 2 =
CC17-32, etc (assuming 16 physical controls). Then you can make use
of more of the 128 available mappings in a single Fadermapper bank by
changing presets at the controller.

In my case, the JP-8080 is 2-part multitimbral - if I select the
"upper" part, it transmits controls on channel 1, and if I select the
"lower" part it's channel 2 - with a bit of port-splitting &
transformering prior to Fadermapper, I can translate that into 84
usable controls per Fadermapper bank, not counting the buttons...

--
John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 7 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

>No, I used mine very sparingly (turning it off often) until I got
>the real thing.  I love this thing, John -- it seems to add a good
>bit of overhead but I don't care...  it is just great.  I am
>starting to figure out how I'll use it live, which will be a real
>treat.  The only downside is that I'm lusting after a Drehbank now.
>heh.
>/robb

Yeah, me too - my JP-8080 has plenty of controls, but the layout is
not exactly ideal. And frankly I don't much care about faders ... 64
knobs ... slobber.

--
John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 7 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

No, I used mine very sparingly (turning it off often) until I got the real
thing.  I love this thing, John -- it seems to add a good bit of overhead but I
don't care...  it is just great.  I am starting to figure out how I'll use it
live, which will be a real treat.  The only downside is that I'm lusting after a
Drehbank now.  heh.

/robb


On Tuesday, Oct 08, 2002, at 07:15AM, John Pitcairn <johnp@...>
wrote:

>So ... did anybody's demo copy actually time out yet?
>
>--
>John Pitcairn
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
>http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 7 Oct 2002
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>fadermapper-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>


/.robb
http://www.nervous.net/~robb

So ... did anybody's demo copy actually time out yet?

--
John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 7 Oct 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

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--
John Pitcairn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revolver Design  |  Opus Locus  |  Auckland, New Zealand
http://www.revolver.co.nz/forsale.phtml - updated 31 May 2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------