Interesting parallels to my own ongoing case found in comp.risks: Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2001 10:12:13 PDT From: "Peter G. Neumann" <neumann@...> Subject:...
merlyn@...
Aug 26, 2001 2:16 pm
103
See <http://www.salon.com/tech/feature/2001/08/29/west/>, "How do you fix a leaky net?". This stuff scares me. And this is a federal case of felony-charging a...
merlyn@...
Aug 29, 2001 12:26 pm
104
... None of these cases are about the simple process of whistleblowing. Sklyarov violated federal law by reverse-engineering software. If you focus on the...
Chris Nandor
yahoo@...
Aug 29, 2001 1:04 pm
105
... Good points Chris. What about some kind of 'Code of Conduct' that suggests reasonable behaviour in light of security flaws? This could help illumnitate the...
jasons@...
Aug 29, 2001 7:05 pm
106
... That's what we have judges and juries. Theoretically. In reality, as we all know, the system doesn't always work the way it was supposed to work. And then...
Dave Sill
de5-fors-discuss@...
Aug 29, 2001 7:32 pm
107
... But it's hard to explain technical issues (by definition), and it's especially difficult to explain them to legislators, prosecutors, judges, and juries....
Tom Phoenix
rootbeer+fors-d@...
Aug 29, 2001 8:24 pm
108
] On Wed, 29 Aug 2001, Dave Sill wrote: ] ] > jasons@... wrote: ] > ] > >... We need a way to help the legal system show leniency when people ] > >were...
David Keegel
djk@...
Aug 30, 2001 12:16 am
109
... I agree. But it won't be easy to accomplish, since I'm sure that most legislators (judges, juries, reporters, columnists, employers) think that "breaking...
Tom Phoenix
rootbeer+fors-d@...
Aug 30, 2001 2:42 pm
110
... Tom> I agree. But it won't be easy to accomplish, since I'm sure that most Tom> legislators (judges, juries, reporters, columnists, employers) think that ...
merlyn@...
Aug 30, 2001 3:21 pm
111
... The logical extension to this analogy is that having noticed the door is open, we step just inside the room to have a quick look - to see whether the...
Dave Mitchell
davem@...
Aug 30, 2001 3:56 pm
112
... Or "to look if indeed this is the room we thought should be locked". A couple of guys here in NL noticed a window to the bank open at night when they were...
R.E.Wolff@...
Aug 30, 2001 4:26 pm
113
* Dave Mitchell ... In the recent case the looking-around was made more problematic IMHO because the person took some photocopies of the papers on the table in...
Ralf Fassel
ralf@...
Aug 30, 2001 4:29 pm
114
At 01:24 -0700 2001.08.30, Dmitry Kohmanyuk ... He was in the United States. It is a bad law, but that doesn't change the fact that he was in the U.S. If I...
Chris Nandor
yahoo@...
Aug 30, 2001 5:18 pm
115
... OK ... OK ... Oops. Not OK. It's not legal, and even if they have the best intentions, it's not safe. Suppose someone sees them enter and calls the cops?...
Dave Sill
de5-fors-discuss@...
Aug 30, 2001 5:22 pm
116
... How could he have broken a U.S. law while he was in Russia? If nosepicking is illegal in Denmark, does that mean I could be arrested if I ever go...
Dave Sill
de5-fors-discuss@...
Aug 30, 2001 5:28 pm
117
... If I steal Russian government secrets while I am in the United States, does that mean they have no grounds to arrest me if I ever go there? His actions, in...
Chris Nandor
yahoo@...
Aug 30, 2001 5:44 pm
118
... You're right, that this is what we should do. But there is still an important legal principle. The principle is _not_ that Sklyarov wasn't in the US when...
Tom Phoenix
rootbeer+fors-d@...
Aug 30, 2001 6:07 pm
119
... Right. But, again, the law in question is a law regarding harm done to someone (for example) in Idaho. If you harm someone in Idaho, then Idaho may have...
Chris Nandor
yahoo@...
Aug 30, 2001 6:14 pm
120
... Tom> I agree. But it won't be easy to accomplish, since I'm sure that most Tom> legislators (judges, juries, reporters, columnists, employers) think that ...
Frossie
frossie@...
Aug 30, 2001 7:11 pm
121
... Agreed. As Randall argued in his trial, our computers (as agents of our bidding) access and modify the content of computers owned by other organizations...
jasons@...
Aug 30, 2001 7:59 pm
122
... In that case, the bank's story IS: You only get access to the toilet, and if you'd be able to get out of that toilet, you wouldn't get access to anything...
R.E.Wolff@...
Aug 30, 2001 10:49 pm
123
] On Thu, 30 Aug 2001, David Keegel wrote: ] ] > getting legislators to focus more on intent (eg: requiring clear ] > mal-intent for computer crime offenses)...
David Keegel
djk@...
Aug 31, 2001 1:51 am
124
... Correct, but what was of equal significance, we felt, was the apparent truth that the application of statutes which are grounded in ancient real property ...
larryo@...
Sep 3, 2001 9:05 pm
125
... I disagree. Double jeopardy is a concept that is separate and distinct from the notion of jurisdiction. For instance, an actor may be prosecuted for acts...
larryo@...
Sep 3, 2001 9:05 pm
126
(I'm not a lawyer.) ] Sysadmins do things every day that, if their employer decides at a later ] time any one of which was "unauthorized," subject them to...
David Keegel
djk@...
Sep 4, 2001 12:20 am
127
... David> In that case, if you could show that you didn't realise at the time David> that the act was "without authorization" (because you had implicit David>...
merlyn@...
Sep 4, 2001 12:36 am
128
... One of the "problems" with your trial is that you should've said "NO" to the question: "Was this for personal gain?" . The way you answered that question...
R.E.Wolff@...
Sep 4, 2001 5:35 pm
129
... R> One of the "problems" with your trial is that you should've said "NO" R> to the question: "Was this for personal gain?" . R> The way you answered that...
merlyn@...
Sep 4, 2001 6:03 pm
130
... That you could, if it were not for ORS 161.115(1), which provides in part: (1) If a statute defining an offense prescribes a culpable mental state but does...
larryo@...
Sep 7, 2001 10:31 pm
131
Friends, Randal told me the other day that a number of people had asked if they could help in any way, and I talked it over with Marc and here it is: We are...
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