Hello, gentle people,

I'm looking for recommendations on good books for operating systems
implemetntrs. OS theory, OS design and implementation, Linux kernel
anything, CPU architectures, etc. To jump start the discussion, here
are mini-mini reviews of some books I already have or have read:

- Bovet & Cesati, Understanding the Linux Kernel, both editions, very
good. Strong emphasis on details, not enough on concepts.
- Linux Device Drivers, Rubini et al, likewise.
- Linux Kernel Development, Robert Love, Excellent. Clear, readable
and concise.
- Bach's The Design of the Unix Operating System.
- Curt Schimme's UNIX Systems for Modern Architectures
- UNIX Internals by Uresh Vahalia

More?

Cheers,
Muli
--
Muli Ben-Yehuda
http://www.mulix.org | http://mulix.livejournal.com/

On Fri, Apr 30, 2004 at 03:13:18AM +0300, guy keren wrote:
>
> On Thu, 29 Apr 2004, Tzafrir Cohen wrote:
>
> > BTW: I occasionally automate shell commands in a project using a
> > makefile. This allows me to script a complicated process and allows me
> > to run each step separately. Another atvantage of make: good control
> > over built-in variables.
> >
> > Each makefile step should ideally contain only one command. This means
> > that in case a long command succeds but a subsequent short command
> > fails, you won't have to run that long command again.
>
> can you give some concrete examples? in particular, examples for tasks
> that are not too project-specific?

Here's one example:

I had to run some tests on a remote system. Remote as in: slow trafic,
and line may go down unexpectedly. It involved first syncing the data
and then running a number of different commands to process them. Some of
the processing had to be done remotely. In some cases it was basically
simpler.

Originally I had a remote terminal and a local terminal and ran all
sorts of commands on both. Then I figured out that I make too many
mistakes this way.

The basic scheme of the make file:

Each revesion gets its own subdirectory. It has a makefile that has
something like:

   NUM=123
   include ../tasks.rules

I figured that re-defining NUM every time in the command line is
error-prone.

Some of the data are taken from a mysql database. I could not figure out
a simple and relible way to say "the database has change", so I ended up
making them all depend on "time_stamp" . To signal a change in the
database I would run "touch time_stamp" .

Any copy of data to the remote system is done using $(RSYNC), where
'RSYNC=rsync -z -e ssh' . Thus I generally don't need to copy data
twice:

   copy_somedata: local_file
  	 $(RSYNC) local_file $(REMOTE_DIR)/whatever
	 touch $@

Any future remote processing that depends on the above data available
remotely, simply has to depend on copy_somedata . Thus if I run 'make'
again in that directory I don't even have the overhead of rsync.
Also suppose that local_file has been re-created but is exactly the
same. rsync would now saves me the network overhead even though the
target is re-run.

A local comman would look like:

   output: dependencies
  	 $(SOME_COMMAND)

Make's error handling is pretty simple: if anything goes wrong, call the
operator. When I fixed whatever was wrong I don't want to run
unnecessary commands. If you actually want to re-run a certain stage you
can use 'make -W dependency' . 'make -n' is also handy to see what is
about to be run before it is run.


A remote command sequense is usually run as:

   do_remote_something: copy_somedata other_task
  	 $(SSH) $(REMOTE_HOST) ' set -e; \
  	   command1 ; \
	   command2 ; \
	   for file in $(PATH)/a*b; do \
	     operation of $$file ; \
	     another operation on $$file ; \
	   done ; \
	 '
	 touch $@

('$$var': makewill turn this into '$var' and the remote shell will
expand 'var' . $(VAR): make will expand 'VAR')

Generally if anything goes wrong the ssh command will exit and return an
unsuccessfull status . Note, however , that if there was something wrong
in 'command2' and you need to re-run the target, command1 will have to
be re-run . If command1 doesn't take long to run it might be faster than
running it in a separate ssh connection . In any case you should try
avoiding puting any command after a command that takes long to execute .


As for 'good control over variables':
If I want to override a variable such as REMOTE_HOST from the
command-line I simply need to run:

   make REMOTE_HOST=foo

But maany paramters tend to be revision-specific . It makes sense to put
them in the makefile:

   NUM=123
   REMOTE_HOST=foofoo
   include ../tasks.rules

This means I need to allow overriding them in the task.rules:

Instead of:

   REMOTE_HOST=default_remote_host

put:

   ifnfndef REMOTE_HOST
     REMOTE_HOST=default_remote_host
   endif

(Any better alternative to that?)

Actually you often have a number of different revisions that require
different parameters. What I do is have in the makefile:

   NUM=123
   include ../special.rules

where special.rules is something like:

   VAR1=val1
   VAR2=val2
   include ../task.rules

--
Tzafrir Cohen                       +---------------------------+
http://www.technion.ac.il/~tzafrir/ |vim is a mutt's best friend|
mailto:tzafrir@...       +---------------------------+

<quote sender="Muli Ben-Yehuda">
> - Bovet & Cesati, Understanding the Linux Kernel, both editions, very
> good. Strong emphasis on details, not enough on concepts.
> - Linux Device Drivers, Rubini et al, likewise.
> - Linux Kernel Development, Robert Love, Excellent. Clear, readable
> and concise.
> - Bach's The Design of the Unix Operating System.
> - Curt Schimme's UNIX Systems for Modern Architectures
> - UNIX Internals by Uresh Vahalia

Remember I showed you my paper? Below, I have references to
two advanced operating system books. You might want to check
out both. Pretty good ones.

PS: I am in console, and don't have any pdf software atm,
perhaps you can help me fill in the blanks *g

Eugene

>
> More?
>
> Cheers,
> Muli
> --
> Muli Ben-Yehuda
> http://www.mulix.org | http://mulix.livejournal.com/
>



--
Eugene TEO   <eugeneteo%eugeneteo!net>   <http://www.anomalistic.org/>
1024D/14A0DDE5 print D851 4574 E357 469C D308  A01E 7321 A38A 14A0 DDE5
main(i) { putchar(182623909 >> (i-1) * 5&31|!!(i<7)<<6) && main(++i); }

I am sad to inform the list that Prof. Shimon Even, whom we previously
discussed here[1] has passed away on the 1st of May this year:

http://www.cs.technion.ac.il/GeneralInformation/News/newseven1_item_txt.html

I'm sure he will be missed.

There's a memorial page for him here:

http://www.wisdom.weizmann.ac.il/~oded/s_even.html

where one can send stories about him.

Regards,

	 Shlomi Fish

[1] -
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hackers-il/message/1127
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hackers-il/message/1112
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hackers-il/message/673
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hackers-il/message/660

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Shlomi Fish        shlomif@...
Home Page:         http://shlomif.il.eu.org/

You are banished! You are banished! You are banished!

Hey? I'm just kidding!

As I read "Extensible Programming for the 21st Century"
(URL:http://pyre.third-bit.com/~gvwilson/xmlprog.html), I pondered the
secret of success of XML. In a way, I am already using XML software
(glade, the GUI editing tool, saves the edited GUI description in a XML
file, which can later be read by a Python library and used to construct
the GUI for a script).

After all, it can be considered to be just another syntactic
representation of LISP or Scheme. For example, the transformation between

(+ 1 2)

and

<paren>
     <token name="+"/>
     <token name="1"/>
     <token name="2"/>
</paren>

is trivial.

My guess is that XML succeeds because it allows the developer to add
types to S expressions and to constrain them and their contents. This is
like imposing hard-typedness on variables and/or their values in a
conventional programming language. It works because the developer can
give different names to his expressions besides the equivalent of naming
every tag <paren>.

As a proof of concept, it may be a good idea to develop a XML
representation of a Python script, along with code for transforming a
Python script to its XML representation and vice versa.
                                               --- Omer
My own blog is at http://www.livejournal.com/users/tddpirate/

My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone.
They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which
I may be affiliated in any way.
WARNING TO SPAMMERS:  at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html

I need heavy statistical processing for a project, and found the R
software (http://www.r-project.org/).  I succeeded in using it for
simple tasks such as plotting and linear curve fitting.

However, I see I need some hand-holding to do more complex analysis.
Is there anyone in Israel who is already using R and has few free
moments for holding my hand?
                                          Thanks,
                                               --- Omer
My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone.
They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which
I may be affiliated in any way.
WARNING TO SPAMMERS:  at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html

On Friday 28 May 2004 09:42, Omer Zak wrote:
> As I read "Extensible Programming for the 21st Century"
> (URL:http://pyre.third-bit.com/~gvwilson/xmlprog.html), I pondered the
> secret of success of XML. In a way, I am already using XML software
> (glade, the GUI editing tool, saves the edited GUI description in a XML
> file, which can later be read by a Python library and used to construct
> the GUI for a script).
>
> After all, it can be considered to be just another syntactic
> representation of LISP or Scheme. For example, the transformation between
>
> (+ 1 2)
>
> and
>
> <paren>
>     <token name="+"/>
>     <token name="1"/>
>     <token name="2"/>
> </paren>
>
> is trivial.
>

What makes you think it isn't:

<paren>
     <op name="+" />
     <token name="1" />
     <token name="2" />
</paren>

Or:

<paren op="+">
      <token name="1" />
      <token name="2" />
</paren>

Both of these forms suffer from the fact that if one of the operands (or the
operations) is an expression, then it would be difficulty to encode it that
way. A better way would be:

<paren>
	 <op>+</op>
	 <token>1</token>
	 <token>2</token>
</paren>

That way the Scheme expression ((if cond + -) (+ 5 6) 7) would be encoded as:

<paren>
	 <op>
		 <paren>
			 <op>if</op>
			 <token>cond</token>
			 <token>+</token>
			 <token>-</token>
		 </paren>
	 </op>
	 <token>
		 <paren>
			 <op>+</op>
			 <token>5</token>
			 <token>6</token>
		 </paren>
	 </token>
	 <token>7</token>
</paren>

Furthermore, we may as well use the tag <expr> or <expression> instead of
<paren> and the tag <element> instead of <token>. Another thing that exists
in XML that is missing from S-expressions is the in-text markup. Like:

<p>The quick brown fox jumps over the <b>incredibly</b> lazy dog.</p>
                                       ^^^          ^^^^

Generally XML (and its philosophical father- SGML) is a superset of the markup
functionality given by S-expressions. For every S-expression, there are many
ways (possibly infinite) to encode as XML, while XML conversion to
S-expressions is not always possible in a straightforward manner, may be
lossy, or otherwise will simply be a verbose pseudo-XML encoding into
S-expressions.

Then there's YAML (YAML A'int a Markup Language) of course, which is basically
just nested arrays and associative arrays and their values. This is somewhere
between S-expressions (which are just nested lists) and XML. XML-RPC is a way
to encode YAML-like structures into XML, which makes one not understand why
XML is necessary in this case.

Regards,

	 Shlomi Fish


> My guess is that XML succeeds because it allows the developer to add
> types to S expressions and to constrain them and their contents. This is
> like imposing hard-typedness on variables and/or their values in a
> conventional programming language. It works because the developer can
> give different names to his expressions besides the equivalent of naming
> every tag <paren>.
>
> As a proof of concept, it may be a good idea to develop a XML
> representation of a Python script, along with code for transforming a
> Python script to its XML representation and vice versa.
>                                               --- Omer

--

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Shlomi Fish      shlomif@...
Homepage:        http://shlomif.il.eu.org/

Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.
         [Whatever is said in Latin sounds profound.]

On Fri, May 28, 2004, Omer Zak wrote about "[hackers-il] Why XML caught on where
LISP and Scheme failed to?":
> As I read "Extensible Programming for the 21st Century"
> (URL:http://pyre.third-bit.com/~gvwilson/xmlprog.html), I pondered the
> secret of success of XML. In a way, I am already using XML software
> (glade, the GUI editing tool, saves the edited GUI description in a XML
> file, which can later be read by a Python library and used to construct
> the GUI for a script).
>
> After all, it can be considered to be just another syntactic
> representation of LISP or Scheme. For example, the transformation between
>
> (+ 1 2)
>
> and
>
> <paren>
>     <token name="+"/>
>     <token name="1"/>
>     <token name="2"/>
> </paren>
>
> is trivial.

I think you're misunderstanding XML. XML is was not supposed to be a
programming language, but rather a data representation (markup) language.
Lisp and XML are only related by the fact that both use "0" and "1" bits ;)

I remember that 6-7 years ago or so, at work, I had to invent a file format
for saving large sets of result coming from a certain program. The format had
to be relatively simple to read or write and machine-independant (so ASCII
was a benefit) and extentible (i.e., the reading program could look at
certain sections written by a newer writer, and know that it doesn't recognize
these sections and simply skip them, with no error). XML was exactly right
for this job, but at that time XML was not very popular, so I chose not to
use it and invented my own format that basically looked like a (possibly
recursive)
   <section_name> <type> <length>
   ....

Which corresponds to the XML
   <type section_name>
   ...
   </type>

Nowadays, unfortunately, XML is so hyped that I hear of people using XML
for things that even a simple tab-separated format would do.

In any case, as these data formats do not contain any executable instructions,
loops, and so on, using lisp would not make much sense. Surely, for hand-
edited input files the power of a programming language (having things like
conditionals and loops) can come in handy, but these aren't essential for
machine-generated data files, which are what most XML files are nowadays.

You might want to compare Postscript and PDF - the former was a full
programming language used as a printed page input format, and it was later
replaced by a more simplistic, not-a-language, format.

--
Nadav Har'El                        |       Sunday, May 30 2004, 10 Sivan 5764
nyh@...             |-----------------------------------------
Phone +972-523-790466, ICQ 13349191 |A messy desk is a sign of a messy mind.
http://nadav.harel.org.il           |An empty desk is a sign of an empty mind.

"Nadav Har'El" <nyh@...> writes:

> On Fri, May 28, 2004, Omer Zak wrote about "[hackers-il] Why XML
> caught on where LISP and Scheme failed to?":

> > As I read "Extensible Programming for the 21st Century"
> > (URL:http://pyre.third-bit.com/~gvwilson/xmlprog.html), I pondered the
> > secret of success of XML.
>
> I think you're misunderstanding XML. XML is was not supposed to be a
> programming language, but rather a data representation (markup) language.
> Lisp and XML are only related by the fact that both use "0" and "1" bits ;)

Obligatory disclaimer: I know Lisp pretty well, but my understanding
of XML is rudimentary. You've been warned.

Well, from the Lisp (shall I say, abstract CS?) point of view there is
no difference between program and data. If you have a lisp-like
interpreter for Omer's (or similar) XML representation you can write
code. For all intents and purposes it will be Lisp. I don't think that
anyone here will argue that the actual tokens matter[1].

On the other hand, representing structured data in Lisp is also
possible and frequently done. I did it myself a few times, including
writing custom tools to "lispify" and "delispify" independently
formatted data.

I seriously doubt though that there is a "secret" to XML's success on
the technical level. It's not the first or the last markup
language. It's not the first or the last extensible language. I would
guess ("assert without proof," borrowing an expression from Wilson)
that big business support[2] + some familiarity of syntax to those who
had been using HTML "forever" (on the Internet timescale) were the key
factors. I also suspect that XML is successful as a structured data
representation, with custom tools written in every programming
language known to mankind, including, significantly, Lisp.  Since
anybody can write their own tools one can live with structured data
representation and a small (a.k.a. limited) tool, and without a
full-blown Lisp interpreter (but maybe a JVM :).

Of course, there is Greenspun's 10th Rule of Programming:

"Any sufficiently complicated <insert your favourite language here -
OG[3]> program contains an ad hoc informally-specified bug-ridden slow
implementation of half of Common Lisp."

All the rest is likely to be religious wars. ;-)

[1] One can argue that XML tags afford you some additional capabilities
     w.r.t. error checking, since the closing tag echoes the type of the
     opening one. Any decent editor will match parentheses in Lisp code
     though, making such checking very easy.

[2] IMH(umble)O the same is true, to a significant extent, for Java.

[3] The original said, "C or Fortran" - OG ;-).

--
Oleg Goldshmidt | pub@...

how is it with large matrices of data? or large arrays, depends on the
terminology.
by large I mean10000, 50000,100000 records.
I have data in text files which is 40mb which I need to analyze.
currently I plan to use matlab, unless there is something else(free like
gpl, lgpl).

Regards,
	 tzahi.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Omer Zak [mailto:omerz@...]
> Sent: Sunday, May 30, 2004 12:34 AM
> To: Hackers-IL
> Subject: [hackers-il] The R Project for Statistical Computing
>
>
> I need heavy statistical processing for a project, and found the R
> software (http://www.r-project.org/).  I succeeded in using it for
> simple tasks such as plotting and linear curve fitting.
>
> However, I see I need some hand-holding to do more complex
> analysis. Is there anyone in Israel who is already using R
> and has few free
> moments for holding my hand?
>                                          Thanks,
>                                               --- Omer
> My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine
> alone. They do not represent the official policy of any
> organization with which I may be affiliated in any way.
> WARNING TO SPAMMERS:  at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html
>
>
>
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> --------------------------------------------------------------
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>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

Tzahi Fadida wrote:

> how is it with large matrices of data? or large arrays, depends on the
> terminology.
> by large I mean10000, 50000,100000 records.
> I have data in text files which is 40mb which I need to analyze.
> currently I plan to use matlab, unless there is something else(free like
> gpl, lgpl).

So far I didn't try R on large data matrices.
It is GPLed, and is also an official part of the FSF GNU project.
                                               --- Omer
My blog is at http://www.livejournal.com/users/tddpirate/

My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone.
They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which
I may be affiliated in any way.
WARNING TO SPAMMERS:  at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html

On Monday 31 May 2004 09:51, Omer Zak wrote:
> Tzahi Fadida wrote:
> > how is it with large matrices of data? or large arrays, depends on the
> > terminology.
> > by large I mean10000, 50000,100000 records.
> > I have data in text files which is 40mb which I need to analyze.
> > currently I plan to use matlab, unless there is something else(free like
> > gpl, lgpl).
>
> So far I didn't try R on large data matrices.

Well, I'm not sure that R is a suitable replacement for Matlab. R aims to be a
substitute of S-plus, which is a statistical analysis program. There are a
list of other programs like that here:

http://salstat.sourceforge.net/

(look in the right side-bar).

If you're looking for something to replace Matlab, you are better off with one
of these:

1. octave - http://www.octave.org/ - mostly compatible with Matlab. Still
incomplete.

2. scilab - http://scilabsoft.inria.fr/ - incompatible with Matlab, but
there's a program to convert Matlab programs to it (but not vice-versa).
Still incomplete in comparison to Matlab, but has a nice GUI interface.

It is sourceware, but I'm not sure if it's entirely free-as-in-speech. (albeit
the homepage links the word "Free" to the license) Its license is still
usable.

3. PDL (short for Perl Data Language) - http://pdl.perl.org/
A package offering fast and compact tensor manipulation operations to Perl,
similar to those provided by Matlab. Still incomplete.

There may be other packages like that, but I haven't had any experience with
them, so STFW. I don't think there's anything quite like Matlab available yet
as far as the availability of modules and add-ons is concerned. But if I
understand Tzahi's needs, then he should be able to find something sufficient
for them, that is open-source.

Regards,

	 Shlomi Fish

--

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Shlomi Fish      shlomif@...
Homepage:        http://shlomif.il.eu.org/

Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.
         [Whatever is said in Latin sounds profound.]

I'd like to announce that at a good and successful time, I graduated from the
Technion's Electrical Engineering Department. I'm now a Bachelor of Science
in Electrical Engineering.

My final grade average is 84.6%, which is a bit strange because my grades
list's annotated average varied around 82%. (but I don't complain). In any
case, it is noted there that I graduated "Behitztaynuth" ("cum laude", I
believe).

It took me 11 study semesters and 2 vacation semesters to finish my studies,
but I eventually did it. If it weren't for one semester where I took too many
difficult courses, (due to a miscalculation on my part), and which threw me
out of focus, it is possible that I could have finished earlier.

So I'm happy. I received a graduation notice with my final grades, and my
graduation ceremony is in about two weeks.

Just wanted to let you know.

Regards,

	 Shlomi Fish
--

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Shlomi Fish      shlomif@...
Homepage:        http://shlomif.il.eu.org/

Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.
         [Whatever is said in Latin sounds profound.]

Shlomi Fish wrote:

>I'd like to announce that at a good and successful time, I graduated from the
>Technion's Electrical Engineering Department. I'm now a Bachelor of Science
>in Electrical Engineering.
>
>
>
Congratulations!

-- Arik

Big congratulation from here too.

Regards,
	 tzahi.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Shlomi Fish [mailto:shlomif@...]
> Sent: Friday, June 18, 2004 1:33 PM
> To: Hackers-IL
> Subject: [hackers-il] Ann: I Graduated from the Technion
>
>
>
> I'd like to announce that at a good and successful time, I
> graduated from the
> Technion's Electrical Engineering Department. I'm now a
> Bachelor of Science
> in Electrical Engineering.
>
> My final grade average is 84.6%, which is a bit strange
> because my grades
> list's annotated average varied around 82%. (but I don't
> complain). In any
> case, it is noted there that I graduated "Behitztaynuth"
> ("cum laude", I
> believe).
>
> It took me 11 study semesters and 2 vacation semesters to
> finish my studies,
> but I eventually did it. If it weren't for one semester where
> I took too many
> difficult courses, (due to a miscalculation on my part), and
> which threw me
> out of focus, it is possible that I could have finished earlier.
>
> So I'm happy. I received a graduation notice with my final
> grades, and my
> graduation ceremony is in about two weeks.
>
> Just wanted to let you know.
>
> Regards,
>
>  Shlomi Fish
> --
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Shlomi Fish      shlomif@...
> Homepage:        http://shlomif.il.eu.org/
>
> Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.
>         [Whatever is said in Latin sounds profound.]
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> --------------------~-->
> Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/saFolB/TM
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> ------~->
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

There is a junk FAXer, who does not comply with requests to be removed
from his list.
He offers to order from him all kinds of electronic goods by calling
phone number 03-6121155.

Recently, he registered a domain (sale4all.co.il), and as a result, I
found that his real FAX number is 03-6121144.  ISOC provided also some
other details about him.

Besides complaining to the police (which I already did few weeks ago,
with 6 FAX messages as evidence), are there any bright ideas what can be
done to make him respect requests to stop sending FAXes to people who do
not want to get junk FAXes from him?

Any idea must be legal, annoying and frightening enough to serve as an
example to other junk FAX senders.
                                               --- Omer
My own blog is at http://www.livejournal.com/users/tddpirate/

My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone.
They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which
I may be affiliated in any way.
WARNING TO SPAMMERS:  at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html

did you contacted bezeq?
does the fax have the ability to block a certain callerid number?
if its number is not reported then maybe bezeq can reveal it because of the
harasment.
if all fails, maybe there is a way to use the software to check the
downloaded fax page
before printing it.
you can call him and tell him that you are going to press charges if he
doesn't remove you.
a little lawyer like letter would maybe persuade him.
and last, if you realy realy desperate you can invite them for a
salesmeeting and record the conversation
and advertise it on ynet (its been done before), but you better check that
cz IANAL.

Regards,
	 tzahi.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Omer Zak [mailto:omerz@...]
> Sent: Saturday, June 19, 2004 7:53 PM
> To: hackers-il
> Subject: [hackers-il] Junk FAX sender registered a domain
>
>
> There is a junk FAXer, who does not comply with requests to
> be removed
> from his list.
> He offers to order from him all kinds of electronic goods by calling
> phone number 03-6121155.
>
> Recently, he registered a domain (sale4all.co.il), and as a result, I
> found that his real FAX number is 03-6121144.  ISOC provided
> also some
> other details about him.
>
> Besides complaining to the police (which I already did few weeks ago,
> with 6 FAX messages as evidence), are there any bright ideas
> what can be
> done to make him respect requests to stop sending FAXes to
> people who do
> not want to get junk FAXes from him?
>
> Any idea must be legal, annoying and frightening enough to
> serve as an
> example to other junk FAX senders.
>                                               --- Omer
> My own blog is at http://www.livejournal.com/users/tddpirate/
>
> My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine
> alone. They do not represent the official policy of any
> organization with which I may be affiliated in any way.
> WARNING TO SPAMMERS:  at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html
>
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On Sat, 19 Jun 2004, Omer Zak wrote:

> There is a junk FAXer, who does not comply with requests to be removed
> from his list.
> He offers to order from him all kinds of electronic goods by calling
> phone number 03-6121155.
>
> Recently, he registered a domain (sale4all.co.il), and as a result, I
> found that his real FAX number is 03-6121144.  ISOC provided also some
> other details about him.
>
> Besides complaining to the police (which I already did few weeks ago,
> with 6 FAX messages as evidence), are there any bright ideas what can be
> done to make him respect requests to stop sending FAXes to people who do
> not want to get junk FAXes from him?
>
> Any idea must be legal, annoying and frightening enough to serve as an
> example to other junk FAX senders.
>                                               --- Omer

There is a consumers (and other stuff) site: http://www.bsh.co.il/
I read all of their consumer-complaints section, they actually do things
about the complaints, and get to places the original customer did not
manage to reach.

Maybe they could scare the person behind sale4all. It sounds rather
official when they say "ma'arechet bsh", though it is probably more or
less one person.

I think it is worth a try.

Orna.
--
Orna Agmon http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~ladypine/

I'd like to announce that at a good and successful time, I graduated from the
Technion's Electrical Engineering Department. I'm now a Bachelor of Science
in Electrical Engineering.

My final grade average is 84.6%, which is a bit strange because my grades
list's annotated average varied around 82%. (but I don't complain). In any
case, it is noted there that I graduated "Behitztaynuth" ("cum laude", I
believe).

It took me 11 study semesters and 2 vacation semesters to finish my studies,
but I eventually did it. If it weren't for one semester where I took too many
difficult courses, (due to a miscalculation on my part), and which threw me
out of focus, it is possible that I could have finished earlier.

So I'm happy. I received a graduation notice with my final grades, and my
graduation ceremony is in about two weeks.

Just wanted to let you know.

Regards,

      Shlomi Fish
--

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Shlomi Fish      shlomif@...
Homepage:        http://shlomif.il.eu.org/

Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.
        [Whatever is said in Latin sounds profound.]

Congratulations!! Graduates. The hard work has payed
off finally.

Cheers.



__________________________________
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Hello all,

If you are a hacker, plz take the survey (follow the link below), and
if you are not, plz forward it to all the hackers you know.

i need this survey completed as soon as possible as my assignment, so
please......

Thanks.

The link is:
http://www.geocities.com/tasneememon/hacking/questionnaire.html

On Mon, 21 Jun 2004, tasneememon wrote:

> Hello all,
>
> If you are a hacker, plz take the survey (follow the link below), and
> if you are not, plz forward it to all the hackers you know.
>
> i need this survey completed as soon as possible as my assignment, so
> please......
>
> Thanks.
>
> The link is:
> http://www.geocities.com/tasneememon/hacking/questionnaire.html
>

Hello tasneememon,

This mailing list is about hacking, not cracking. Your questionnaire is
about cracking. Hackers will find that for some answers, they cannot
choose any of the answers, because of false base-assumptions.

Orna.

Tasneem Memon wrote:

> hacker  n. 1 person or thing that hacks or cuts roughly. _2 colloq. a
> person whose hobby is computing or computer programming. *b person who
> uses a computer to gain unauthorized access to a computer network.*_
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------


Only defiinition 2a is relevant in this mailng list, and in polite
society in general, if you want to interview criminals, go look for them
somewhere else.

Our definition is in http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hackers-il/ -
Creative programming discussed intelligently.

I am developing an application, which may need to refer to sections in
text files.
I would like to use URI to refer to the files.  When a file is on local
disk, it is to be refered to (for example) as:

     file:///home/omerz/mysecretstuff.txt

However, I want to refer to a section inside the file, where the section
starts at character (or byte*) position N, and is M characters (or
bytes*) long.
If the file were HTML file, I would have been able to refer to anchors
inside it (as in <a name="myanchor">...</a>) by means of the standard
URI fragment specification such as:

     file:///home/omerz/mysecretstuff.txt#myanchor

However, when the file in question is a text file, I do not have any
anchors inside it, so I have to refer to a range of characters (or bytes*).
One possible way is to use:

     file:///home/omerz/mysecretstuff.txt#b100.300

which refers to 300-byte long fragment, which starts at 100th byte
relative to start of file (where 1st byte in the file is 0).

I googled in vain for any standard (official or de-facto) way to do this.
So, before going forth and inventing my own specification, can any kind
soul please direct me to the established way of doing this?

*in UTF-8 encoding, a character may be more than one byte long, and be
variable-length.
                                          Thanks,
                                               --- Omer
My own blog is at http://www.livejournal.com/users/tddpirate/

My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone.
They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which
I may be affiliated in any way.
WARNING TO SPAMMERS:  at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html

I tried again to google and found:

     http://dret.net/netdret/docs/draft-wilde-text-fragment-00.html

It is exactly what I was looking for!

Omer Zak wrote:
> I googled in vain for any standard (official or de-facto) way to do this.
> So, before going forth and inventing my own specification, can any kind
> soul please direct me to the established way of doing this?
>
> *in UTF-8 encoding, a character may be more than one byte long, and be
> variable-length.

                                                --- Omer
My own blog is at http://www.livejournal.com/users/tddpirate/

My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone.
They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which
I may be affiliated in any way.
WARNING TO SPAMMERS:  at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Omer Zak [mailto:omerz@...]
[snip]
> I googled in vain for any standard (official or de-facto) way
> to do this.
> So, before going forth and inventing my own specification,
> can any kind
> soul please direct me to the established way of doing this?

I'd like to comment. This part of the URI is parsed by the browser
in case of a URL, so you might want to think of a way that will work
with conventional browsers; The '#' example that you gave won't.

What can work is a server-side script that will get the location as
a parameter, convert the text to html (by wrapping it with <html>
<body><pre> and </pre></body></html> and insert the anchor
in html in the right location, like:

http://host.name/doc.txt?loc=line123#anchor

-- Arik

On Mon, Jun 28, 2004, Omer Zak wrote about "Found! (was: Re: [hackers-il]
Specifying a file fragment in URI)":
> I tried again to google and found:
>
>     http://dret.net/netdret/docs/draft-wilde-text-fragment-00.html
>
> It is exactly what I was looking for!

You should note that HTTP 1.1 already a way to get only a byte range from
a file: search "byte ranges" in:

     http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec14.html

It's not exactly what you wanted, but it's an efficient way to actually
get just the byte range you're interested in, instead of getting all the
file and then taking just a part of it. (of course, this only applies if
you get files with HTTP; FTP has another method for getting a part of the
file).


--
Nadav Har'El                        |      Monday, Jun 28 2004, 10 Tammuz 5764
nyh@...             |-----------------------------------------
Phone +972-523-790466, ICQ 13349191 |Windows-2000/Professional isn't.
http://nadav.harel.org.il           |