Thanks so much Mary. I hope the list was prioritized since that was a
big batch ;-)

Robin, I agree with John Shook. I have asked myself the same question
several times without coming up with an answer I can trust. Is it a
trait of the human race that when grouped together and being forced to
walk off a cliff nobody in the group can see the escape route? Common
sence seem not so common in large organizations.
Is this a bad side of swarming theory? Is it personal turf protection or
about the huge amount of wishful thinking that people seem to have
hard-wired?

For me as a Swede I react on shook's focus on putting responsibility on
the shoulders of the CEO. I think we have a more distributed sence of
responsibility in our management culture.

I guess it is much about:

Great managers selects a Great workforce and takes Great decisions which
creates a Great culture which breeds Great managers... (and loop)

You could probably see this as a value flow with a huge risk of
variation at each step because the process is made of human actions. If
one of the steps changes from Great to Poor then you are in a lot of
trouble because it takes a long time to recover even if you manage to
break the bad spiral.

Could we not automate the process to get it more predictable? Oh cr*p, a
company named Cyberdyne Systems have the patent for that.

Regards
Emil

--- In leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com, "Mary Poppendieck" <mary@...>
wrote:
>
> My favorite management writer is Jeffry Pfeffer. Two of his books that
I
> really like were co-authored with Robert Sutton. These are:
>
> The Knowing-Doing Gap (2000)
>
> Hard Facts, Dangerous Half-Truths, & Total Nonsense (2006)
>
>
>
> He also co-authored the book Hidden Value (2000) with Charles O'Reily,
which
> discusses the practices you find in well-managed companies.
>
>
>
> Pfeffer's latest book, What were They Thinking? (2007), is also
delightful.
>
>
>
> I also have a couple of his earlier books - Managing with Power (1994)
and
> The Human Equation (1996) -these have his foundation ideas behind
managing
> and compensating people.
>
>
>
> Another favorite management writer is John Shook, especially his book
> Managing to Learn (2008). His blog is at http://www.lean.org/shook/
(you may
> need to register).
>
>
>
> Finally, I like Peter Scholtes books, especially The Leader's Handbook
> (1997), but also The Team Handbook (2003). This book is in its 3rd
edition,
> it was originally published in 1988.
>
>
>
> Mary Poppendieck
>
> 952-934-7998
>
> <http://www.poppendieck.com> www.poppendieck.com
>
> Author of: Lean Software Development & Implementing Lean Software
> Development
>
>
>
> From: leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ejmull
> Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 1:07 PM
> To: leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Management value proposition was Re: [leandevelopment] Re:
FW:
> Sailing a Straight Course in a Time of Variances
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi guys, I know there are one billion books on management but do you
> have some tips on books related to management models and/or efficient
> teamwork/team leadership?
>
> Regards
>
> Emil
>
> --- In leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com> , Chakravarthy R
> chakravarthy.rajagopalan@ wrote:
> >
> > Thanks Robin, Mary , George for your replies.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Chak.
> >
> > On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 10:57 PM, Mary Poppendieck mary@...:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Chak,
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Since you are in India, I would not expect that an American model
of
> > > self-organized teams would be the only model of leadership that
you
> might
> > > consider. Here are some additional successful models (and these
are
> not the
> > > only ones):
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > 1) The open source model. In this model, the kernel of capability
is
> > > tightly controlled and managed by a core - often self-managed
> - group. In
> > > this model, the main role of management is to figure out how to
> create an
> > > environment in which people are motivated to contribute to the
> commons. The
> > > best managers are the ones who know how to organize volunteer
> efforts.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > 2) The military model. In this model, small units have appointed
> > > leaders who know that "you can't manage men into battle, you
> have to lead
> > > them". Good small unit leaders are deeply committed to the
> people in the
> > > unit, to keeping them safe, to sharing the purpose of the mission,
> etc. The
> > > senior leaders communicate "command intend" and the small
> unit leaders -
> > > often in consultation with the members of the unit- make local
> decisions to
> > > achieve the command intent.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > 3) The reciprocity model. In this model, people contribute their
> > > best efforts to the company because they feel the company will
take
> care of
> > > them over time and help them reach their personal goals. When this
> model is
> > > operative, people respond to a line manager who works to develop
the
> full
> > > potential of every employee. Not a good model for India, because
> this model
> > > is based on long term, reciprocating relationships.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > In every case, good leadership means figuring out what motivates
> front-line
> > > people to contribute their best efforts, and aligning those
efforts
> (and
> > > associated motivation) with the short and long term good of the
> larger
> > > organization or community. This is not always going to mean
> self-organizing
> > > teams, which are mainly a reaction to bad management practices
> (practices
> > > which do not respect the workers).
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Mary Poppendieck
> > >
> > > 952-934-7998
> > >
> > > www.poppendieck.com
> > >
> > > Author of: Lean Software Development & Implementing Lean Software
> > > Development
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > *From:* leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:
> > > leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com> ] *On Behalf Of *Robin
Dymond
> > > *Sent:* Friday, July 03, 2009 11:45 AM
> > > *To:* leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > *Subject:* Management value proposition was Re: [leandevelopment]
> Re: FW:
> > > Sailing a Straight Course in a Time of Variances
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Chak,
> > >
> > > These are great questions. George has pointed you to some great
> resources
> > > from Esther Derby on self organizing teams, Esther is an authority
> in this
> > > space so I recommend you start there.
> > >
> > > Let's talk about the manager value proposition for a moment.
> > >
> > > Jack Welch, CEO of GE would regularly assign Vice Presidents to
> various
> > > plants and facilities to make improvements. He was very clear
about
> one
> > > thing with all of them - make yourself redundant. If you are still
> doing the
> > > same job in two years I will fire you. He saw management's role as
> system's
> > > thinkers who could go in, analyze the system, find the urgent
things
> that
> > > needed fixing and work within the organization to fix them. This
> philosophy
> > > fed the growth of Six Sigma in GE, because it gave a toolset that
> could be
> > > used across plants/products/markets by managers to analyze a
> manufacturing
> > > system, find issues and make improvements.
> > >
> > > I view a manager's most effective role as someone who is
continually
> > > looking for opportunities to improve the system in which people
work
> so that
> > > it is more effective for the manager, their co-workers, and the
> customer.
> > > Just as the teams should continually learn about the tools and
> business
> > > domain to deliver a quality product, an effective manager will
also
> be
> > > reaching for ideas/tools that make them more effective in
improving
> the
> > > system. In this again we see GE's leadership. GE setup GE
University
> with
> > > tough courses that challenged managers with new ideas (like Six
> Sigma). They
> > > were expected to apply these ideas in their organizations. Most of
> us aren't
> > > lucky enough to have a corporate learning agenda, so it is up to
us
> to find
> > > our own ways to learn and apply that knowledge.
> > >
> > > *In the past 17 years, GE has increased its market value from $12
> billion
> > > to some $280 billion. For all that time of stupendous enrichment,
> the
> > > management training centre at Croton-on-Hudson (known as
> Crotonville) has
> > > been central to the company's vaunted management system. The
> three-week
> > > development course for high-fliers is so important in GE's scheme
of
> things
> > > that CEO Jack Welch (who is even more vaunted than the system)
goes
> to
> > > Crotonville every month to teach its 700-odd students.*
> > >
> > > http://www.thinkingmanagers.com/management/management-training.php
> > >
> > >
> > > When we watch the Olympics or a master artist perform on stage it
is
> > > amazing to see what they have accomplished. Athletes often put
their
> lives
> > > and careers on hold to perfect that one skill, usually with little
> reward
> > > other than the satisfaction of the process of training and
> improving. Even
> > > if they set a world record, how long will it stand before someone
> else
> > > breaks it?
> > >
> > > What is the perfect company? Can we make one? Think of all the
> moving parts
> > > required to deliver a non-trivial software product to market. What
> would the
> > > perfect company look like to its customers, its employees,
> shareholders? If
> > > we take the customer as the first stakeholder, then I am sure they
> would
> > > have opinions on what the perfect company would be. Applying Lean
> thinking
> > > to the process from a customer request to request fulfilled gives
us
> a long
> > > list of work we need to do to become better at what we do. Asking
> the same
> > > question of the people who work there will also provide a long
list
> of
> > > things we can improve. These are not trivial things on the
surface,
> but core
> > > issues that impact the activity of work. Consider the athlete. If
> you
> > > thought of yourself as a coach, and everyone who reported to you
as
> athletes
> > > looking to experience the satisfaction of the process of training
> and
> > > improving, how would that change your perspective? How would it
> change
> > > theirs? How do we measure our improvement?
> > >
> > > The specific steps you take to become a great manager are the same
> things
> > > one would do to be good at anything, learn, practice, reflect on
the
> > > improvements, what is working, what isn't, repeat. Lean, Scrum,
XP,
> are all
> > > inspirational sources of learning about what works. None of these
> methods
> > > are comprehensive, so the learning never really stops. :) I just
> took Luke
> > > Hohmann's course on Innovation Games. Luke has built some very
> useful tools
> > > for collaboration on product vision and process. These are
> complementary to
> > > Agile ideas, teamwork collaboration. However they are not specific
> to Agile,
> > > for example they are regularly used by a company that manufactures
> > > airconditioning (HVAC) systems.
> > >
> > > cheers,
> > > Robin.
> > >
> > > On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 10:44 AM, George Dinwiddie lists@
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > Chakravarthy R wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Hi Robin,
> > > >
> > > > As a newbie to this entire philosophy, i still dont get one
thing.
> How
> > > > exactly does an Agile Manager train his team to be self managing
?
> > >
> > > One way is http://estherderby.com/workshops/secrets.htm
> > >
> > >
> > > > How
> > > > does he know this self managing team is in line with the quality
> > > > standards and other objectives of the company ?
> > >
> > > Can you not see the quality being produced? And what other
> objectives
> > > do you mean? Are these not observable?
> > >
> > >
> > > > How exactly does an
> > > > Agile manager strike a balance between a 'free for all'
delegation
> on
> > > > the one hand, and command and control autocracy on the other ?
If
> he
> > > > delegates to these self managing teams then what exactly does he
> do with
> > > > his time, and justify his presence in the company ? If he only
> coaches
> > > > these teams, then what does he do after they have been coached
and
> ready
> > > > to carry on ?
> > >
> > > There's still management to do other than telling other people how
> to do
> > > their work. Esther Derby's blog has a bunch of stuff on this.
> > >
> > >
> > > > I had asked the same question in a different way and got a lot
of
> > > > specific steps, but even if this question is naive, could you
> please
> > > > point me to some resources on how to be hands off and yet be
hands
> on ?
> > > > Okay so the manager can build an atmosphere of agile and lean .
He
> sees
> > > > the big picture and teaches his people to do so. . However the
> bottom
> > > > line is that if this team fails, he is accountable to his
seniors.
> So he
> > > > needs to keep an eye without being intrusive. How does he do it
?
> > >
> > > Maybe
> > >
> > >
>
http://www.estherderby.com/weblog/2009/06/when-to-stand-back-when-to-ste\
\
>
<http://www.estherderby.com/weblog/2009/06/when-to-stand-back-when-to-st\
ep-i
> n.html>
> p-in.html
> > > will be of help.
> > >
> > > - George
> > > --
> > >
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> > > * George Dinwiddie * http://blog.gdinwiddie.com
> > > Software Development http://www.idiacomputing.com
> > > Consultant and Coach http://www.agilemaryland.org
> > >
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Robin Dymond, CST
> > > Managing Partner, Innovel, LLC.
> > > www.innovel.net
> > > www.scrumtraining.com
> > > (804) 239-4329
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>