In the past 17 years, GE has increased its market value from $12 billion to some $280 billion. For all that time of stupendous enrichment, the management training centre at Croton-on-Hudson (known as Crotonville) has been central to the company's vaunted management system. The three-week development course for high-fliers is so important in GE's scheme of things that CEO Jack Welch (who is even more vaunted than the system) goes to Crotonville every month to teach its 700-odd students.

http://www.thinkingmanagers.com/management/management-training.php

Hi guys, I know there are one billion books on management but do you

have some tips on books related to management models and/or efficient

teamwork/team leadership?



Regards



Emil





--- In leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Chakravarthy R

<chakravarthy.rajagopalan@...> wrote:

>

> Thanks Robin, Mary , George for your replies.

>

> Regards,

> Chak.

>

> On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 10:57 PM, Mary Poppendieck mary@...wrote:

>

> >

> >

> > Hi Chak,

> >

> >

> >

> > Since you are in India, I would not expect that an American model of

> > self-organized teams would be the only model of leadership that you

might

> > consider. Here are some additional successful models (and these are

not the

> > only ones):

> >

> >

> >

> > 1) The open source model. In this model, the kernel of capability is

> > tightly controlled and managed by a core – often self-managed

– group. In

> > this model, the main role of management is to figure out how to

create an

> > environment in which people are motivated to contribute to the

commons. The

> > best managers are the ones who know how to organize volunteer

efforts.

> >

> >

> >

> > 2) The military model. In this model, small units have appointed

> > leaders who know that "you can't manage men into battle, you

have to lead

> > them". Good small unit leaders are deeply committed to the

people in the

> > unit, to keeping them safe, to sharing the purpose of the mission,

etc. The

> > senior leaders communicate "command intend" and the small

unit leaders –

> > often in consultation with the members of the unit– make local

decisions to

> > achieve the command intent.

> >

> >

> >

> > 3) The reciprocity model. In this model, people contribute their

> > best efforts to the company because they feel the company will take

care of

> > them over time and help them reach their personal goals. When this

model is

> > operative, people respond to a line manager who works to develop the

full

> > potential of every employee. Not a good model for India, because

this model

> > is based on long term, reciprocating relationships.

> >

> >

> >

> > In every case, good leadership means figuring out what motivates

front-line

> > people to contribute their best efforts, and aligning those efforts

(and

> > associated motivation) with the short and long term good of the

larger

> > organization or community. This is not always going to mean

self-organizing

> > teams, which are mainly a reaction to bad management practices

(practices

> > which do not respect the workers).

> >

> >

> >

> > Mary Poppendieck

> >

> > 952-934-7998

> >

> > www.poppendieck.com

> >

> > Author of: Lean Software Development & Implementing Lean Software

> > Development

> >

> >

> >

> > *From:* leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com [mailto:

> > leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Robin Dymond

> > *Sent:* Friday, July 03, 2009 11:45 AM

> > *To:* leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> > *Subject:* Management value proposition was Re: [leandevelopment]

Re: FW:

> > Sailing a Straight Course in a Time of Variances

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Hi Chak,

> >

> > These are great questions. George has pointed you to some great

resources

> > from Esther Derby on self organizing teams, Esther is an authority

in this

> > space so I recommend you start there.

> >

> > Let's talk about the manager value proposition for a moment.

> >

> > Jack Welch, CEO of GE would regularly assign Vice Presidents to

various

> > plants and facilities to make improvements. He was very clear about

one

> > thing with all of them - make yourself redundant. If you are still

doing the

> > same job in two years I will fire you. He saw management's role as

system's

> > thinkers who could go in, analyze the system, find the urgent things

that

> > needed fixing and work within the organization to fix them. This

philosophy

> > fed the growth of Six Sigma in GE, because it gave a toolset that

could be

> > used across plants/products/markets by managers to analyze a

manufacturing

> > system, find issues and make improvements.

> >

> > I view a manager's most effective role as someone who is continually

> > looking for opportunities to improve the system in which people work

so that

> > it is more effective for the manager, their co-workers, and the

customer.

> > Just as the teams should continually learn about the tools and

business

> > domain to deliver a quality product, an effective manager will also

be

> > reaching for ideas/tools that make them more effective in improving

the

> > system. In this again we see GE's leadership. GE setup GE University

with

> > tough courses that challenged managers with new ideas (like Six

Sigma). They

> > were expected to apply these ideas in their organizations. Most of

us aren't

> > lucky enough to have a corporate learning agenda, so it is up to us

to find

> > our own ways to learn and apply that knowledge.

> >

> > *In the past 17 years, GE has increased its market value from $12

billion

> > to some $280 billion. For all that time of stupendous enrichment,

the

> > management training centre at Croton-on-Hudson (known as

Crotonville) has

> > been central to the company's vaunted management system. The

three-week

> > development course for high-fliers is so important in GE's scheme of

things

> > that CEO Jack Welch (who is even more vaunted than the system) goes

to

> > Crotonville every month to teach its 700-odd students.*

> >

> > http://www.thinkingmanagers.com/management/management-training.php

> >

> >

> > When we watch the Olympics or a master artist perform on stage it is

> > amazing to see what they have accomplished. Athletes often put their

lives

> > and careers on hold to perfect that one skill, usually with little

reward

> > other than the satisfaction of the process of training and

improving. Even

> > if they set a world record, how long will it stand before someone

else

> > breaks it?

> >

> > What is the perfect company? Can we make one? Think of all the

moving parts

> > required to deliver a non-trivial software product to market. What

would the

> > perfect company look like to its customers, its employees,

shareholders? If

> > we take the customer as the first stakeholder, then I am sure they

would

> > have opinions on what the perfect company would be. Applying Lean

thinking

> > to the process from a customer request to request fulfilled gives us

a long

> > list of work we need to do to become better at what we do. Asking

the same

> > question of the people who work there will also provide a long list

of

> > things we can improve. These are not trivial things on the surface,

but core

> > issues that impact the activity of work. Consider the athlete. If

you

> > thought of yourself as a coach, and everyone who reported to you as

athletes

> > looking to experience the satisfaction of the process of training

and

> > improving, how would that change your perspective? How would it

change

> > theirs? How do we measure our improvement?

> >

> > The specific steps you take to become a great manager are the same

things

> > one would do to be good at anything, learn, practice, reflect on the

> > improvements, what is working, what isn't, repeat. Lean, Scrum, XP,

are all

> > inspirational sources of learning about what works. None of these

methods

> > are comprehensive, so the learning never really stops. :) I just

took Luke

> > Hohmann's course on Innovation Games. Luke has built some very

useful tools

> > for collaboration on product vision and process. These are

complementary to

> > Agile ideas, teamwork collaboration. However they are not specific

to Agile,

> > for example they are regularly used by a company that manufactures

> > airconditioning (HVAC) systems.

> >

> > cheers,

> > Robin.

> >

> > On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 10:44 AM, George Dinwiddie lists@...

> > wrote:

> >

> > Chakravarthy R wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > > Hi Robin,

> > >

> > > As a newbie to this entire philosophy, i still dont get one thing.

How

> > > exactly does an Agile Manager train his team to be self managing ?

> >

> > One way is http://estherderby.com/workshops/secrets.htm

> >

> >

> > > How

> > > does he know this self managing team is in line with the quality

> > > standards and other objectives of the company ?

> >

> > Can you not see the quality being produced? And what other

objectives

> > do you mean? Are these not observable?

> >

> >

> > > How exactly does an

> > > Agile manager strike a balance between a 'free for all' delegation

on

> > > the one hand, and command and control autocracy on the other ? If

he

> > > delegates to these self managing teams then what exactly does he

do with

> > > his time, and justify his presence in the company ? If he only

coaches

> > > these teams, then what does he do after they have been coached and

ready

> > > to carry on ?

> >

> > There's still management to do other than telling other people how

to do

> > their work. Esther Derby's blog has a bunch of stuff on this.

> >

> >

> > > I had asked the same question in a different way and got a lot of

> > > specific steps, but even if this question is naive, could you

please

> > > point me to some resources on how to be hands off and yet be hands

on ?

> > > Okay so the manager can build an atmosphere of agile and lean . He

sees

> > > the big picture and teaches his people to do so. . However the

bottom

> > > line is that if this team fails, he is accountable to his seniors.

So he

> > > needs to keep an eye without being intrusive. How does he do it ?

> >

> > Maybe

> >

> >

http://www.estherderby.com/weblog/2009/06/when-to-stand-back-when-to-ste\

p-in.html

> > will be of help.

> >

> > - George

> > --

> >

----------------------------------------------------------------------

> > * George Dinwiddie * http://blog.gdinwiddie.com

> > Software Development http://www.idiacomputing.com

> > Consultant and Coach http://www.agilemaryland.org

> >

----------------------------------------------------------------------

> >

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> > Yahoo! Groups Links

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Robin Dymond, CST

> > Managing Partner, Innovel, LLC.

> > www.innovel.net

> > www.scrumtraining.com

> > (804) 239-4329

> >

> >

> >

>

GM Is Bankrupt: Does That Mean GM Managers Are Bad Managers?

http://www.lean.org/shook/

Thanks so much Mary. I hope the list was prioritized since that was a

big batch ;-)



Robin, I agree with John Shook. I have asked myself the same question

several times without coming up with an answer I can trust. Is it a

trait of the human race that when grouped together and being forced to

walk off a cliff nobody in the group can see the escape route? Common

sence seem not so common in large organizations.

Is this a bad side of swarming theory? Is it personal turf protection or

about the huge amount of wishful thinking that people seem to have

hard-wired?



For me as a Swede I react on shook's focus on putting responsibility on

the shoulders of the CEO. I think we have a more distributed sence of

responsibility in our management culture.



I guess it is much about:



Great managers selects a Great workforce and takes Great decisions which

creates a Great culture which breeds Great managers... (and loop)



You could probably see this as a value flow with a huge risk of

variation at each step because the process is made of human actions. If

one of the steps changes from Great to Poor then you are in a lot of

trouble because it takes a long time to recover even if you manage to

break the bad spiral.



Could we not automate the process to get it more predictable? Oh cr*p, a

company named Cyberdyne Systems have the patent for that.



Regards

Emil









--- In leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com, "Mary Poppendieck" <mary@...>

wrote:

>

> My favorite management writer is Jeffry Pfeffer. Two of his books that

I

> really like were co-authored with Robert Sutton. These are:

>

> The Knowing-Doing Gap (2000)

>

> Hard Facts, Dangerous Half-Truths, & Total Nonsense (2006)

>

>

>

> He also co-authored the book Hidden Value (2000) with Charles O'Reily,

which

> discusses the practices you find in well-managed companies.

>

>

>

> Pfeffer's latest book, What were They Thinking? (2007), is also

delightful.

>

>

>

> I also have a couple of his earlier books - Managing with Power (1994)

and

> The Human Equation (1996) -these have his foundation ideas behind

managing

> and compensating people.

>

>

>

> Another favorite management writer is John Shook, especially his book

> Managing to Learn (2008). His blog is at http://www.lean.org/shook/

(you may

> need to register).

>

>

>

> Finally, I like Peter Scholtes books, especially The Leader's Handbook

> (1997), but also The Team Handbook (2003). This book is in its 3rd

edition,

> it was originally published in 1988.

>

>

>

> Mary Poppendieck

>

> 952-934-7998

>

> <http://www.poppendieck.com> www.poppendieck.com

>

> Author of: Lean Software Development & Implementing Lean Software

> Development

>

>

>

> From: leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> [mailto:leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ejmull

> Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 1:07 PM

> To: leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> Subject: Management value proposition was Re: [leandevelopment] Re:

FW:

> Sailing a Straight Course in a Time of Variances

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Hi guys, I know there are one billion books on management but do you

> have some tips on books related to management models and/or efficient

> teamwork/team leadership?

>

> Regards

>

> Emil

>

> --- In leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> <mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com> , Chakravarthy R

> chakravarthy.rajagopalan@ wrote:

> >

> > Thanks Robin, Mary , George for your replies.

> >

> > Regards,

> > Chak.

> >

> > On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 10:57 PM, Mary Poppendieck mary@...:

> >

> > >

> > >

> > > Hi Chak,

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Since you are in India, I would not expect that an American model

of

> > > self-organized teams would be the only model of leadership that

you

> might

> > > consider. Here are some additional successful models (and these

are

> not the

> > > only ones):

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > 1) The open source model. In this model, the kernel of capability

is

> > > tightly controlled and managed by a core - often self-managed

> - group. In

> > > this model, the main role of management is to figure out how to

> create an

> > > environment in which people are motivated to contribute to the

> commons. The

> > > best managers are the ones who know how to organize volunteer

> efforts.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > 2) The military model. In this model, small units have appointed

> > > leaders who know that "you can't manage men into battle, you

> have to lead

> > > them". Good small unit leaders are deeply committed to the

> people in the

> > > unit, to keeping them safe, to sharing the purpose of the mission,

> etc. The

> > > senior leaders communicate "command intend" and the small

> unit leaders -

> > > often in consultation with the members of the unit- make local

> decisions to

> > > achieve the command intent.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > 3) The reciprocity model. In this model, people contribute their

> > > best efforts to the company because they feel the company will

take

> care of

> > > them over time and help them reach their personal goals. When this

> model is

> > > operative, people respond to a line manager who works to develop

the

> full

> > > potential of every employee. Not a good model for India, because

> this model

> > > is based on long term, reciprocating relationships.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > In every case, good leadership means figuring out what motivates

> front-line

> > > people to contribute their best efforts, and aligning those

efforts

> (and

> > > associated motivation) with the short and long term good of the

> larger

> > > organization or community. This is not always going to mean

> self-organizing

> > > teams, which are mainly a reaction to bad management practices

> (practices

> > > which do not respect the workers).

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Mary Poppendieck

> > >

> > > 952-934-7998

> > >

> > > www.poppendieck.com

> > >

> > > Author of: Lean Software Development & Implementing Lean Software

> > > Development

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > *From:* leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> <mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:

> > > leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> <mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com> ] *On Behalf Of *Robin

Dymond

> > > *Sent:* Friday, July 03, 2009 11:45 AM

> > > *To:* leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> <mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>

> > > *Subject:* Management value proposition was Re: [leandevelopment]

> Re: FW:

> > > Sailing a Straight Course in a Time of Variances

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Hi Chak,

> > >

> > > These are great questions. George has pointed you to some great

> resources

> > > from Esther Derby on self organizing teams, Esther is an authority

> in this

> > > space so I recommend you start there.

> > >

> > > Let's talk about the manager value proposition for a moment.

> > >

> > > Jack Welch, CEO of GE would regularly assign Vice Presidents to

> various

> > > plants and facilities to make improvements. He was very clear

about

> one

> > > thing with all of them - make yourself redundant. If you are still

> doing the

> > > same job in two years I will fire you. He saw management's role as

> system's

> > > thinkers who could go in, analyze the system, find the urgent

things

> that

> > > needed fixing and work within the organization to fix them. This

> philosophy

> > > fed the growth of Six Sigma in GE, because it gave a toolset that

> could be

> > > used across plants/products/markets by managers to analyze a

> manufacturing

> > > system, find issues and make improvements.

> > >

> > > I view a manager's most effective role as someone who is

continually

> > > looking for opportunities to improve the system in which people

work

> so that

> > > it is more effective for the manager, their co-workers, and the

> customer.

> > > Just as the teams should continually learn about the tools and

> business

> > > domain to deliver a quality product, an effective manager will

also

> be

> > > reaching for ideas/tools that make them more effective in

improving

> the

> > > system. In this again we see GE's leadership. GE setup GE

University

> with

> > > tough courses that challenged managers with new ideas (like Six

> Sigma). They

> > > were expected to apply these ideas in their organizations. Most of

> us aren't

> > > lucky enough to have a corporate learning agenda, so it is up to

us

> to find

> > > our own ways to learn and apply that knowledge.

> > >

> > > *In the past 17 years, GE has increased its market value from $12

> billion

> > > to some $280 billion. For all that time of stupendous enrichment,

> the

> > > management training centre at Croton-on-Hudson (known as

> Crotonville) has

> > > been central to the company's vaunted management system. The

> three-week

> > > development course for high-fliers is so important in GE's scheme

of

> things

> > > that CEO Jack Welch (who is even more vaunted than the system)

goes

> to

> > > Crotonville every month to teach its 700-odd students.*

> > >

> > > http://www.thinkingmanagers.com/management/management-training.php

> > >

> > >

> > > When we watch the Olympics or a master artist perform on stage it

is

> > > amazing to see what they have accomplished. Athletes often put

their

> lives

> > > and careers on hold to perfect that one skill, usually with little

> reward

> > > other than the satisfaction of the process of training and

> improving. Even

> > > if they set a world record, how long will it stand before someone

> else

> > > breaks it?

> > >

> > > What is the perfect company? Can we make one? Think of all the

> moving parts

> > > required to deliver a non-trivial software product to market. What

> would the

> > > perfect company look like to its customers, its employees,

> shareholders? If

> > > we take the customer as the first stakeholder, then I am sure they

> would

> > > have opinions on what the perfect company would be. Applying Lean

> thinking

> > > to the process from a customer request to request fulfilled gives

us

> a long

> > > list of work we need to do to become better at what we do. Asking

> the same

> > > question of the people who work there will also provide a long

list

> of

> > > things we can improve. These are not trivial things on the

surface,

> but core

> > > issues that impact the activity of work. Consider the athlete. If

> you

> > > thought of yourself as a coach, and everyone who reported to you

as

> athletes

> > > looking to experience the satisfaction of the process of training

> and

> > > improving, how would that change your perspective? How would it

> change

> > > theirs? How do we measure our improvement?

> > >

> > > The specific steps you take to become a great manager are the same

> things

> > > one would do to be good at anything, learn, practice, reflect on

the

> > > improvements, what is working, what isn't, repeat. Lean, Scrum,

XP,

> are all

> > > inspirational sources of learning about what works. None of these

> methods

> > > are comprehensive, so the learning never really stops. :) I just

> took Luke

> > > Hohmann's course on Innovation Games. Luke has built some very

> useful tools

> > > for collaboration on product vision and process. These are

> complementary to

> > > Agile ideas, teamwork collaboration. However they are not specific

> to Agile,

> > > for example they are regularly used by a company that manufactures

> > > airconditioning (HVAC) systems.

> > >

> > > cheers,

> > > Robin.

> > >

> > > On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 10:44 AM, George Dinwiddie lists@

> > > wrote:

> > >

> > > Chakravarthy R wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Hi Robin,

> > > >

> > > > As a newbie to this entire philosophy, i still dont get one

thing.

> How

> > > > exactly does an Agile Manager train his team to be self managing

?

> > >

> > > One way is http://estherderby.com/workshops/secrets.htm

> > >

> > >

> > > > How

> > > > does he know this self managing team is in line with the quality

> > > > standards and other objectives of the company ?

> > >

> > > Can you not see the quality being produced? And what other

> objectives

> > > do you mean? Are these not observable?

> > >

> > >

> > > > How exactly does an

> > > > Agile manager strike a balance between a 'free for all'

delegation

> on

> > > > the one hand, and command and control autocracy on the other ?

If

> he

> > > > delegates to these self managing teams then what exactly does he

> do with

> > > > his time, and justify his presence in the company ? If he only

> coaches

> > > > these teams, then what does he do after they have been coached

and

> ready

> > > > to carry on ?

> > >

> > > There's still management to do other than telling other people how

> to do

> > > their work. Esther Derby's blog has a bunch of stuff on this.

> > >

> > >

> > > > I had asked the same question in a different way and got a lot

of

> > > > specific steps, but even if this question is naive, could you

> please

> > > > point me to some resources on how to be hands off and yet be

hands

> on ?

> > > > Okay so the manager can build an atmosphere of agile and lean .

He

> sees

> > > > the big picture and teaches his people to do so. . However the

> bottom

> > > > line is that if this team fails, he is accountable to his

seniors.

> So he

> > > > needs to keep an eye without being intrusive. How does he do it

?

> > >

> > > Maybe

> > >

> > >

>

http://www.estherderby.com/weblog/2009/06/when-to-stand-back-when-to-ste\

\

>

<http://www.estherderby.com/weblog/2009/06/when-to-stand-back-when-to-st\

ep-i

> n.html>

> p-in.html

> > > will be of help.

> > >

> > > - George

> > > --

> > >

> ----------------------------------------------------------

> > > * George Dinwiddie * http://blog.gdinwiddie.com

> > > Software Development http://www.idiacomputing.com

> > > Consultant and Coach http://www.agilemaryland.org

> > >

> ----------------------------------------------------------

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > >

> > > Yahoo! Groups Links

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > --

> > > Robin Dymond, CST

> > > Managing Partner, Innovel, LLC.

> > > www.innovel.net

> > > www.scrumtraining.com

> > > (804) 239-4329

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

>

Hello, ejmull.  On Friday, July 3, 2009, at 4:07:43 PM, you wrote:



> Is it a

> trait of the human race that when grouped together and being forced to

> walk off a cliff nobody in the group can see the escape route?



Nope. Just a lot of the race.



Ron Jeffries

www.XProgramming.com

www.xprogramming.com/blog

Just because XP doesn't talk about how to make fire, should we assume it

requires us to use sticks? -- Richard MacDonald

I will read it when I feel I can motivate the buy to my manager =);

LEI's shipping for the book outside the US is as much as the book

itself: 40$! two books for 47$. It seem hard to get it in another way.



The company I work for (large telecom) was started in 1918, GM in 1908.

I don't think that say so much though, the company wisdom is probably

not that old. =)

From what I've heard it seems that the wisdom is about 10 years, pretty

scary.



Also, global factors which you cannot influence probably affects more

than management.



Otherwise I think you are spot on.

People finally uniting when the world (read company) is under attack is

a popular Hollywood theme =)



Emil





--- In leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Robin Dymond <robin.dymond@...>

wrote:

>

> Very funny reference.

>

> I think if you read shook's managing to learn you see something

different

> than the impression the blog gives.

>

> Many in Germany in the 20th century thought differently than the

management,

> as the people in Iran do today. Organizations control behavior mostly

> through some sort of carrot/stick incentive and modeled behaviors.

Perhaps

> organizations like GM should not be expected to go on perpetually?

What

> economic organizations have lasted as long?

>

> Most large organizations tend to dysfunction unless they had to

weather a

> regular series of crises that caused them to regularly re-examine and

change

> their approach. My experience in large profitable companies is that

the

> people who have started and climbed the ladder to become executives in

thode

> companies are often very focused on the politics and personal ambition

while

> remaining a very long way from their real customers. They are

excellent at

> fighting internal turf battles, and their energy goes there, while

improving

> the organization for the benefit of the customer is not on the agenda,

or

> delegated to others. A crises such as our current one reveal their

inability

> to react effectively, leaving the organization in a perilous state.

However

> they do start to focus more on what really matters.

>

> An author perhaps more suited to the scandanaivian sensibility is

Peter

> Senge, author of the fifth disciple.

>

> Cheers,

> Robin.

>

> On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 4:07 PM, ejmull ejmull@... wrote:

>

> >

> >

> >

> > Thanks so much Mary. I hope the list was prioritized since that was

a

> > big batch ;-)

> >

> > Robin, I agree with John Shook. I have asked myself the same

question

> > several times without coming up with an answer I can trust. Is it a

> > trait of the human race that when grouped together and being forced

to

> > walk off a cliff nobody in the group can see the escape route?

Common

> > sence seem not so common in large organizations.

> > Is this a bad side of swarming theory? Is it personal turf

protection or

> > about the huge amount of wishful thinking that people seem to have

> > hard-wired?

> >

> > For me as a Swede I react on shook's focus on putting responsibility

on

> > the shoulders of the CEO. I think we have a more distributed sence

of

> > responsibility in our management culture.

> >

> > I guess it is much about:

> >

> > Great managers selects a Great workforce and takes Great decisions

which

> > creates a Great culture which breeds Great managers... (and loop)

> >

> > You could probably see this as a value flow with a huge risk of

> > variation at each step because the process is made of human actions.

If

> > one of the steps changes from Great to Poor then you are in a lot of

> > trouble because it takes a long time to recover even if you manage

to

> > break the bad spiral.

> >

> > Could we not automate the process to get it more predictable? Oh

cr*p, a

> > company named Cyberdyne Systems have the patent for that.

> >

> > Regards

> > Emil

> >

> > --- In leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

<leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>,

> > "Mary Poppendieck" mary@

> > wrote:

> >

> > >

> > > My favorite management writer is Jeffry Pfeffer. Two of his books

that

> > I

> > > really like were co-authored with Robert Sutton. These are:

> > >

> > > The Knowing-Doing Gap (2000)

> > >

> > > Hard Facts, Dangerous Half-Truths, & Total Nonsense (2006)

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > He also co-authored the book Hidden Value (2000) with Charles

O'Reily,

> > which

> > > discusses the practices you find in well-managed companies.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Pfeffer's latest book, What were They Thinking? (2007), is also

> > delightful.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > I also have a couple of his earlier books - Managing with Power

(1994)

> > and

> > > The Human Equation (1996) -these have his foundation ideas behind

> > managing

> > > and compensating people.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Another favorite management writer is John Shook, especially his

book

> > > Managing to Learn (2008). His blog is at

http://www.lean.org/shook/

> > (you may

> > > need to register).

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Finally, I like Peter Scholtes books, especially The Leader's

Handbook

> > > (1997), but also The Team Handbook (2003). This book is in its 3rd

> > edition,

> > > it was originally published in 1988.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Mary Poppendieck

> > >

> > > 952-934-7998

> > >

> > > <http://www.poppendieck.com> www.poppendieck.com

> > >

> > > Author of: Lean Software Development & Implementing Lean Software

> > > Development

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > From:

leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com<leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>

> > >

[mailto:leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com<leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.co\

m>]

> > On Behalf Of ejmull

> > > Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 1:07 PM

> > > To: leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

<leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>

> > > Subject: Management value proposition was Re: [leandevelopment]

Re:

> > FW:

> > > Sailing a Straight Course in a Time of Variances

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Hi guys, I know there are one billion books on management but do

you

> > > have some tips on books related to management models and/or

efficient

> > > teamwork/team leadership?

> > >

> > > Regards

> > >

> > > Emil

> > >

> > > --- In

leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com<leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>

> > >

<mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com<leandevelopment%2540yahoogroup\

s.com>>

> > , Chakravarthy R

> > > chakravarthy.rajagopalan@ wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Thanks Robin, Mary , George for your replies.

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Chak.

> > > >

> > > > On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 10:57 PM, Mary Poppendieck mary@:

> >

> > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Hi Chak,

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Since you are in India, I would not expect that an American

model

> > of

> > > > > self-organized teams would be the only model of leadership

that

> > you

> > > might

> > > > > consider. Here are some additional successful models (and

these

> > are

> > > not the

> > > > > only ones):

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > 1) The open source model. In this model, the kernel of

capability

> > is

> > > > > tightly controlled and managed by a core - often self-managed

> > > - group. In

> > > > > this model, the main role of management is to figure out how

to

> > > create an

> > > > > environment in which people are motivated to contribute to the

> > > commons. The

> > > > > best managers are the ones who know how to organize volunteer

> > > efforts.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > 2) The military model. In this model, small units have

appointed

> > > > > leaders who know that "you can't manage men into battle, you

> > > have to lead

> > > > > them". Good small unit leaders are deeply committed to the

> > > people in the

> > > > > unit, to keeping them safe, to sharing the purpose of the

mission,

> > > etc. The

> > > > > senior leaders communicate "command intend" and the small

> > > unit leaders -

> > > > > often in consultation with the members of the unit- make local

> > > decisions to

> > > > > achieve the command intent.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > 3) The reciprocity model. In this model, people contribute

their

> > > > > best efforts to the company because they feel the company will

> > take

> > > care of

> > > > > them over time and help them reach their personal goals. When

this

> > > model is

> > > > > operative, people respond to a line manager who works to

develop

> > the

> > > full

> > > > > potential of every employee. Not a good model for India,

because

> > > this model

> > > > > is based on long term, reciprocating relationships.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > In every case, good leadership means figuring out what

motivates

> > > front-line

> > > > > people to contribute their best efforts, and aligning those

> > efforts

> > > (and

> > > > > associated motivation) with the short and long term good of

the

> > > larger

> > > > > organization or community. This is not always going to mean

> > > self-organizing

> > > > > teams, which are mainly a reaction to bad management practices

> > > (practices

> > > > > which do not respect the workers).

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Mary Poppendieck

> > > > >

> > > > > 952-934-7998

> > > > >

> > > > > www.poppendieck.com

> > > > >

> > > > > Author of: Lean Software Development & Implementing Lean

Software

> > > > > Development

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > *From:*

leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com<leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>

> > >

<mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com<leandevelopment%2540yahoogroup\

s.com>>

> > [mailto:

> > > > > leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

<leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>

> > >

<mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com<leandevelopment%2540yahoogroup\

s.com>>

> > ] *On Behalf Of *Robin

> > Dymond

> > > > > *Sent:* Friday, July 03, 2009 11:45 AM

> > > > > *To:*

leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com<leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>

> > >

<mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com<leandevelopment%2540yahoogroup\

s.com>

> > >

> >

> > > > > *Subject:* Management value proposition was Re:

[leandevelopment]

> > > Re: FW:

> > > > > Sailing a Straight Course in a Time of Variances

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Hi Chak,

> > > > >

> > > > > These are great questions. George has pointed you to some

great

> > > resources

> > > > > from Esther Derby on self organizing teams, Esther is an

authority

> > > in this

> > > > > space so I recommend you start there.

> > > > >

> > > > > Let's talk about the manager value proposition for a moment.

> > > > >

> > > > > Jack Welch, CEO of GE would regularly assign Vice Presidents

to

> > > various

> > > > > plants and facilities to make improvements. He was very clear

> > about

> > > one

> > > > > thing with all of them - make yourself redundant. If you are

still

> > > doing the

> > > > > same job in two years I will fire you. He saw management's

role as

> > > system's

> > > > > thinkers who could go in, analyze the system, find the urgent

> > things

> > > that

> > > > > needed fixing and work within the organization to fix them.

This

> > > philosophy

> > > > > fed the growth of Six Sigma in GE, because it gave a toolset

that

> > > could be

> > > > > used across plants/products/markets by managers to analyze a

> > > manufacturing

> > > > > system, find issues and make improvements.

> > > > >

> > > > > I view a manager's most effective role as someone who is

> > continually

> > > > > looking for opportunities to improve the system in which

people

> > work

> > > so that

> > > > > it is more effective for the manager, their co-workers, and

the

> > > customer.

> > > > > Just as the teams should continually learn about the tools and

> > > business

> > > > > domain to deliver a quality product, an effective manager will

> > also

> > > be

> > > > > reaching for ideas/tools that make them more effective in

> > improving

> > > the

> > > > > system. In this again we see GE's leadership. GE setup GE

> > University

> > > with

> > > > > tough courses that challenged managers with new ideas (like

Six

> > > Sigma). They

> > > > > were expected to apply these ideas in their organizations.

Most of

> > > us aren't

> > > > > lucky enough to have a corporate learning agenda, so it is up

to

> > us

> > > to find

> > > > > our own ways to learn and apply that knowledge.

> > > > >

> > > > > *In the past 17 years, GE has increased its market value from

$12

> > > billion

> > > > > to some $280 billion. For all that time of stupendous

enrichment,

> > > the

> > > > > management training centre at Croton-on-Hudson (known as

> > > Crotonville) has

> > > > > been central to the company's vaunted management system. The

> > > three-week

> > > > > development course for high-fliers is so important in GE's

scheme

> > of

> > > things

> > > > > that CEO Jack Welch (who is even more vaunted than the system)

> > goes

> > > to

> > > > > Crotonville every month to teach its 700-odd students.*

> > > > >

> > > > >

http://www.thinkingmanagers.com/management/management-training.php

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > When we watch the Olympics or a master artist perform on stage

it

> > is

> > > > > amazing to see what they have accomplished. Athletes often put

> > their

> > > lives

> > > > > and careers on hold to perfect that one skill, usually with

little

> > > reward

> > > > > other than the satisfaction of the process of training and

> > > improving. Even

> > > > > if they set a world record, how long will it stand before

someone

> > > else

> > > > > breaks it?

> > > > >

> > > > > What is the perfect company? Can we make one? Think of all the

> > > moving parts

> > > > > required to deliver a non-trivial software product to market.

What

> > > would the

> > > > > perfect company look like to its customers, its employees,

> > > shareholders? If

> > > > > we take the customer as the first stakeholder, then I am sure

they

> > > would

> > > > > have opinions on what the perfect company would be. Applying

Lean

> > > thinking

> > > > > to the process from a customer request to request fulfilled

gives

> > us

> > > a long

> > > > > list of work we need to do to become better at what we do.

Asking

> > > the same

> > > > > question of the people who work there will also provide a long

> > list

> > > of

> > > > > things we can improve. These are not trivial things on the

> > surface,

> > > but core

> > > > > issues that impact the activity of work. Consider the athlete.

If

> > > you

> > > > > thought of yourself as a coach, and everyone who reported to

you

> > as

> > > athletes

> > > > > looking to experience the satisfaction of the process of

training

> > > and

> > > > > improving, how would that change your perspective? How would

it

> > > change

> > > > > theirs? How do we measure our improvement?

> > > > >

> > > > > The specific steps you take to become a great manager are the

same

> > > things

> > > > > one would do to be good at anything, learn, practice, reflect

on

> > the

> > > > > improvements, what is working, what isn't, repeat. Lean,

Scrum,

> > XP,

> > > are all

> > > > > inspirational sources of learning about what works. None of

these

> > > methods

> > > > > are comprehensive, so the learning never really stops. :) I

just

> > > took Luke

> > > > > Hohmann's course on Innovation Games. Luke has built some very

> > > useful tools

> > > > > for collaboration on product vision and process. These are

> > > complementary to

> > > > > Agile ideas, teamwork collaboration. However they are not

specific

> > > to Agile,

> > > > > for example they are regularly used by a company that

manufactures

> > > > > airconditioning (HVAC) systems.

> > > > >

> > > > > cheers,

> > > > > Robin.

> > > > >

> > > > > On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 10:44 AM, George Dinwiddie lists@

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Chakravarthy R wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Hi Robin,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > As a newbie to this entire philosophy, i still dont get one

> > thing.

> > > How

> > > > > > exactly does an Agile Manager train his team to be self

managing

> > ?

> > > > >

> > > > > One way is http://estherderby.com/workshops/secrets.htm

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > > How

> > > > > > does he know this self managing team is in line with the

quality

> > > > > > standards and other objectives of the company ?

> > > > >

> > > > > Can you not see the quality being produced? And what other

> > > objectives

> > > > > do you mean? Are these not observable?

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > > How exactly does an

> > > > > > Agile manager strike a balance between a 'free for all'

> > delegation

> > > on

> > > > > > the one hand, and command and control autocracy on the other

?

> > If

> > > he

> > > > > > delegates to these self managing teams then what exactly

does he

> > > do with

> > > > > > his time, and justify his presence in the company ? If he

only

> > > coaches

> > > > > > these teams, then what does he do after they have been

coached

> > and

> > > ready

> > > > > > to carry on ?

> > > > >

> > > > > There's still management to do other than telling other people

how

> > > to do

> > > > > their work. Esther Derby's blog has a bunch of stuff on this.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > > I had asked the same question in a different way and got a

lot

> > of

> > > > > > specific steps, but even if this question is naive, could

you

> > > please

> > > > > > point me to some resources on how to be hands off and yet be

> > hands

> > > on ?

> > > > > > Okay so the manager can build an atmosphere of agile and

lean .

> > He

> > > sees

> > > > > > the big picture and teaches his people to do so. . However

the

> > > bottom

> > > > > > line is that if this team fails, he is accountable to his

> > seniors.

> > > So he

> > > > > > needs to keep an eye without being intrusive. How does he do

it

> > ?

> > > > >

> > > > > Maybe

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > >

> >

http://www.estherderby.com/weblog/2009/06/when-to-stand-back-when-to-ste\

\

> > \

> >

<http://www.estherderby.com/weblog/2009/06/when-to-stand-back-when-to-st\

e>

> > >

> >

<http://www.estherderby.com/weblog/2009/06/when-to-stand-back-when-to-st\

\

> >

ep-i<http://www.estherderby.com/weblog/2009/06/when-to-stand-back-when-t\

o-step-i>

> > > n.html>

> > > p-in.html

> > > > > will be of help.

> > > > >

> > > > > - George

> > > > > --

> > > > >

> > > ----------------------------------------------------------

> > > > > * George Dinwiddie * http://blog.gdinwiddie.com

> > > > > Software Development http://www.idiacomputing.com

> > > > > Consultant and Coach http://www.agilemaryland.org

> > > > >

> > > ----------------------------------------------------------

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > >

> > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > --

> > > > > Robin Dymond, CST

> > > > > Managing Partner, Innovel, LLC.

> > > > > www.innovel.net

> > > > > www.scrumtraining.com

> > > > > (804) 239-4329

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

> --

> Robin Dymond, CST

> Managing Partner, Innovel, LLC.

> www.innovel.net

> www.scrumtraining.com

> (804) 239-4329

>

Is there any possibility to have a recommended book list in this group?

It seems you are sitting on a lot of good tips.



Emil





--- In leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Alan Shalloway <alshall@...>

wrote:

>

> Scholtes book "The Leaders Handbook" is pretty awesome. It

incorporates

> lean management throughout as well.

>

> I just noticed mary's recommendations before this went out. Haven't

read

> them so can't compare - she has so her order is probably more

relevant.

> OK, new books for my list. J

>

> Alan Shalloway, CEO, Sr. Consultant

> Net Objectives. Achieving Enterprise Agility

> 425-269-8991

>

>

>

> From: leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> [mailto:leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ejmull

> Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 11:07 AM

> To: leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> Subject: Management value proposition was Re: [leandevelopment] Re:

FW:

> Sailing a Straight Course in a Time of Variances

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Hi guys, I know there are one billion books on management but do you

> have some tips on books related to management models and/or efficient

> teamwork/team leadership?

>

> Regards

>

> Emil

>

> --- In leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> <mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com> , Chakravarthy R

> chakravarthy.rajagopalan@ wrote:

> >

> > Thanks Robin, Mary , George for your replies.

> >

> > Regards,

> > Chak.

> >

> > On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 10:57 PM, Mary Poppendieck mary@...:

> >

> > >

> > >

> > > Hi Chak,

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Since you are in India, I would not expect that an American model

of

> > > self-organized teams would be the only model of leadership that

you

> might

> > > consider. Here are some additional successful models (and these

are

> not the

> > > only ones):

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > 1) The open source model. In this model, the kernel of capability

is

> > > tightly controlled and managed by a core - often self-managed

> - group. In

> > > this model, the main role of management is to figure out how to

> create an

> > > environment in which people are motivated to contribute to the

> commons. The

> > > best managers are the ones who know how to organize volunteer

> efforts.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > 2) The military model. In this model, small units have appointed

> > > leaders who know that "you can't manage men into battle, you

> have to lead

> > > them". Good small unit leaders are deeply committed to the

> people in the

> > > unit, to keeping them safe, to sharing the purpose of the mission,

> etc. The

> > > senior leaders communicate "command intend" and the small

> unit leaders -

> > > often in consultation with the members of the unit- make local

> decisions to

> > > achieve the command intent.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > 3) The reciprocity model. In this model, people contribute their

> > > best efforts to the company because they feel the company will

take

> care of

> > > them over time and help them reach their personal goals. When this

> model is

> > > operative, people respond to a line manager who works to develop

the

> full

> > > potential of every employee. Not a good model for India, because

> this model

> > > is based on long term, reciprocating relationships.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > In every case, good leadership means figuring out what motivates

> front-line

> > > people to contribute their best efforts, and aligning those

efforts

> (and

> > > associated motivation) with the short and long term good of the

> larger

> > > organization or community. This is not always going to mean

> self-organizing

> > > teams, which are mainly a reaction to bad management practices

> (practices

> > > which do not respect the workers).

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Mary Poppendieck

> > >

> > > 952-934-7998

> > >

> > > www.poppendieck.com

> > >

> > > Author of: Lean Software Development & Implementing Lean Software

> > > Development

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > *From:* leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> <mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:

> > > leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> <mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com> ] *On Behalf Of *Robin

Dymond

> > > *Sent:* Friday, July 03, 2009 11:45 AM

> > > *To:* leandevelopment@yahoogroups.com

> <mailto:leandevelopment%40yahoogroups.com>

> > > *Subject:* Management value proposition was Re: [leandevelopment]

> Re: FW:

> > > Sailing a Straight Course in a Time of Variances

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Hi Chak,

> > >

> > > These are great questions. George has pointed you to some great

> resources

> > > from Esther Derby on self organizing teams, Esther is an authority

> in this

> > > space so I recommend you start there.

> > >

> > > Let's talk about the manager value proposition for a moment.

> > >

> > > Jack Welch, CEO of GE would regularly assign Vice Presidents to

> various

> > > plants and facilities to make improvements. He was very clear

about

> one

> > > thing with all of them - make yourself redundant. If you are still

> doing the

> > > same job in two years I will fire you. He saw management's role as

> system's

> > > thinkers who could go in, analyze the system, find the urgent

things

> that

> > > needed fixing and work within the organization to fix them. This

> philosophy

> > > fed the growth of Six Sigma in GE, because it gave a toolset that

> could be

> > > used across plants/products/markets by managers to analyze a

> manufacturing

> > > system, find issues and make improvements.

> > >

> > > I view a manager's most effective role as someone who is

continually

> > > looking for opportunities to improve the system in which people

work

> so that

> > > it is more effective for the manager, their co-workers, and the

> customer.

> > > Just as the teams should continually learn about the tools and

> business

> > > domain to deliver a quality product, an effective manager will

also

> be

> > > reaching for ideas/tools that make them more effective in

improving

> the

> > > system. In this again we see GE's leadership. GE setup GE

University

> with

> > > tough courses that challenged managers with new ideas (like Six

> Sigma). They

> > > were expected to apply these ideas in their organizations. Most of

> us aren't

> > > lucky enough to have a corporate learning agenda, so it is up to

us

> to find

> > > our own ways to learn and apply that knowledge.

> > >

> > > *In the past 17 years, GE has increased its market value from $12

> billion

> > > to some $280 billion. For all that time of stupendous enrichment,

> the

> > > management training centre at Croton-on-Hudson (known as

> Crotonville) has

> > > been central to the company's vaunted management system. The

> three-week

> > > development course for high-fliers is so important in GE's scheme

of

> things

> > > that CEO Jack Welch (who is even more vaunted than the system)

goes

> to

> > > Crotonville every month to teach its 700-odd students.*

> > >

> > > http://www.thinkingmanagers.com/management/management-training.php

> > >

> > >

> > > When we watch the Olympics or a master artist perform on stage it

is

> > > amazing to see what they have accomplished. Athletes often put

their

> lives

> > > and careers on hold to perfect that one skill, usually with little

> reward

> > > other than the satisfaction of the process of training and

> improving. Even

> > > if they set a world record, how long will it stand before someone

> else

> > > breaks it?

> > >

> > > What is the perfect company? Can we make one? Think of all the

> moving parts

> > > required to deliver a non-trivial software product to market. What

> would the

> > > perfect company look like to its customers, its employees,

> shareholders? If

> > > we take the customer as the first stakeholder, then I am sure they

> would

> > > have opinions on what the perfect company would be. Applying Lean

> thinking

> > > to the process from a customer request to request fulfilled gives

us

> a long

> > > list of work we need to do to become better at what we do. Asking

> the same

> > > question of the people who work there will also provide a long

list

> of

> > > things we can improve. These are not trivial things on the

surface,

> but core

> > > issues that impact the activity of work. Consider the athlete. If

> you

> > > thought of yourself as a coach, and everyone who reported to you

as

> athletes

> > > looking to experience the satisfaction of the process of training

> and

> > > improving, how would that change your perspective? How would it

> change

> > > theirs? How do we measure our improvement?

> > >

> > > The specific steps you take to become a great manager are the same

> things

> > > one would do to be good at anything, learn, practice, reflect on

the

> > > improvements, what is working, what isn't, repeat. Lean, Scrum,

XP,

> are all

> > > inspirational sources of learning about what works. None of these

> methods

> > > are comprehensive, so the learning never really stops. :) I just

> took Luke

> > > Hohmann's course on Innovation Games. Luke has built some very

> useful tools

> > > for collaboration on product vision and process. These are

> complementary to

> > > Agile ideas, teamwork collaboration. However they are not specific

> to Agile,

> > > for example they are regularly used by a company that manufactures

> > > airconditioning (HVAC) systems.

> > >

> > > cheers,

> > > Robin.

> > >

> > > On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 10:44 AM, George Dinwiddie lists@

> > > wrote:

> > >

> > > Chakravarthy R wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Hi Robin,

> > > >

> > > > As a newbie to this entire philosophy, i still dont get one

thing.

> How

> > > > exactly does an Agile Manager train his team to be self managing

?

> > >

> > > One way is http://estherderby.com/workshops/secrets.htm

> > >

> > >

> > > > How

> > > > does he know this self managing team is in line with the quality

> > > > standards and other objectives of the company ?

> > >

> > > Can you not see the quality being produced? And what other

> objectives

> > > do you mean? Are these not observable?

> > >

> > >

> > > > How exactly does an

> > > > Agile manager strike a balance between a 'free for all'

delegation

> on

> > > > the one hand, and command and control autocracy on the other ?

If

> he

> > > > delegates to these self managing teams then what exactly does he

> do with

> > > > his time, and justify his presence in the company ? If he only

> coaches

> > > > these teams, then what does he do after they have been coached

and

> ready

> > > > to carry on ?

> > >

> > > There's still management to do other than telling other people how

> to do

> > > their work. Esther Derby's blog has a bunch of stuff on this.

> > >

> > >

> > > > I had asked the same question in a different way and got a lot

of

> > > > specific steps, but even if this question is naive, could you

> please

> > > > point me to some resources on how to be hands off and yet be

hands

> on ?

> > > > Okay so the manager can build an atmosphere of agile and lean .

He

> sees

> > > > the big picture and teaches his people to do so. . However the

> bottom

> > > > line is that if this team fails, he is accountable to his

seniors.

> So he

> > > > needs to keep an eye without being intrusive. How does he do it

?

> > >

> > > Maybe

> > >

> > >

>

http://www.estherderby.com/weblog/2009/06/when-to-stand-back-when-to-ste

> \

> p-in.html

>

<http://www.estherderby.com/weblog/2009/06/when-to-stand-back-when-to-st

> ep-in.html>

> > > will be of help.

> > >

> > > - George

> > > --

> > >

> ----------------------------------------------------------

> > > * George Dinwiddie * http://blog.gdinwiddie.com

> > > Software Development http://www.idiacomputing.com

> > > Consultant and Coach http://www.agilemaryland.org

> > >

> ----------------------------------------------------------

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > >

> > > Yahoo! Groups Links

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > --

> > > Robin Dymond, CST

> > > Managing Partner, Innovel, LLC.

> > > www.innovel.net

> > > www.scrumtraining.com

> > > (804) 239-4329

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

>

>

>

>

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>

Robin Dymond wrote:

> Hi Chak,

>

> These are great questions. George has pointed you to some great

> resources from Esther Derby on self organizing teams, Esther is an

> authority in this space so I recommend you start there.



As it so happens, I recently finished compiling a fairly comprehensive

list of online resources about self-organizing teams at

http://blog.bradapp.net/search/label/Self-Organization



--

Brad Appleton <brad {AT} bradapp.net>

    Agile CM Environments (http://blog.bradapp.net/)

    & Software CM Patterns (www.scmpatterns.com)

"And miles to go before I sleep" -- Robert Frost