On 1/6/03 7:05 am, "Michael Haydn" <mhaydn@...> wrote:

> At 13:27 +0000 30.05.03, randallbennett wrote:
>> "You can also edit Channel EQs via the Logic Control-by pushing the
>> EQ button: this will open the first Channel EQ of the selected
>> channel. If no Channel EQ is active/available, it will automatically
>> be inserted in the first free insert slot."
>>
>> This isn't happening for me.
>
> You're right, I simply forgot to implement it. Will be added in a
> later release.

Excellent Michael! Best and most honest answer I ever heard! Looking forward
to the fix.
         Gareth

At 20:53 Uhr -0700 31.05.2003, kenneth_daniels wrote:
>Can anyone else on the list verify results when trying to de-ess using the
>buss method described in the FAQ?

Allright, this is what I do to de-ess speech (not singing, but of
course it works the same way):

- I cut out the offending s and _copy_ it on another track that does
not have an output
- on the track that only has the s I have an EQ that _emphasizes_ the
s (with my speaker it's around 11k Hz)
- on the original track I insert a compressor whose _side chain_ is
the track with only the s on it.
- turn off auto gain in this compressor
- the compression has to be quite big, short attack and release

- then I sometimes take the same audio and put it on yet another
track where I only have the high frequencies to give the speaking
more air. Of course this will also bring back more of the s so I do
some pretty heavy EQ here. The point of this track is just to get a
little more air without being very noticable.

Maybe this helps.

Cheers
Hans

At 4:57 Uhr +0000 01.06.2003, John Pitcairn wrote:
>So what you need is an effect send master for the individual submix
>tracks' sends, which is slaved to the vocal submix master bus for
>volume & mute, but still leaves the effect itself available separately
>for other non-submixed tracks to send to. Phew. It's easier to build
>than to explain:
>
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/logic-users/files/sub&send_master.lso

Hi John,

very clever, will try how it sounds soon.

Cheers
Hans

is this update a "bug-fixer"?  i just want too know if it's better to stay
at 6.0 (using os9) for the time being...
tv

On a fine day, 31-05-2003, Mike Lyons wrote:

>I have been having some weird nonsense in Logic. I have been creating some
>band music in logic which uses timps. In order to get the timps to sound at
>the correct pitch I have to transpose them up an octave, but to get the part
>to print correctly I have to use the transpose that doesn't affect the score
>to shift them up 10 semitones and then use the score transpose to shift the
>notes up the remaining two semitones. My main soundcard is an SB Audigy ex.
>
>When I play the file on any other soundcard or save it as a MIDI file the
>timp part goes back to normal - and therefore is at the wrong pitch! Has
>anyone heard of this and, more importantly, is there a way of stopping it
>happening?

Not an answer, but more of a suggestion: I think that expecting a
piece to both _print_ properly and _play_ properly is asking too much
-- regardless of the software you use (Logic, Sibelius, Finale).
Simply make a song that sounds right, make a duplicate, and edit that
so it prints right.  I just happened to talk about this with a fellow
LUGger over a beer yesterday, and we totally agreed on this one.
Playing and printing are two different issues that should be treated
separately.

--
Hendrik Jan Veenstra  <h@...>
Omega Art: http://www.omega-art.com/

On a fine day, 31-05-2003, Hans Hafner wrote:

>At 21:59 Uhr -0500 30.05.2003, Eli Krantzberg wrote:
>>Why not just assign the output of your 30+ vocal tracks to an unused
>>bus? This would give you exactly what you want. The bus would act as
>>your group master which you can then further automate without
>>compromising any of your original automation on the original 30+
>>tracks.
>
>Only problem here is, that if you have a reverb setup for the voc
>tracks the reverb will get louder as you move the bus where you
>routed the vocs to.

Isn't that also what happens when using the usual post-fader sends
that you use everyday?

>  This is a major inconvenience and the reason why
>group faders have been introduced in Logic 6.

How about: output all vox tracks to bus 1, and additionally send all
vox tracks to bus 2 (i.e. using a send-slot).  Use bus 1 for
group-volume and use bus 2 for the inserted reverb.  Would that work?

--
Hendrik Jan Veenstra  <h@...>
Omega Art: http://www.omega-art.com/

On a fine day, 30-05-2003, kenneth_daniels wrote:

>  > From: "technodork_2000" <technodork_2000@...>
>>  One thing that I always liked about working on the MPC was the note repeat
>>  button that you could use while programming to get an immediate repeat of a
>>  note for the length you held down the button and the note, at the
>>current set
>>  quantize value. Great for odd effects and studders, or rapid kick/hi-hat
>>  patterns, etc.
>>  I would be curious if anyone has some creative ideas on how to best emulate
>  > this behavior, of course I could just copy and past note events, etc.
>
>A quick way would be to use an appregiator, eh?
>But I'm sure by the time I've written this Hendrik will have a more
>intuitive post for you :)

LOL!  Yes, my reply would be: can't be done.  Very intuitive :-)).

--
Hendrik Jan Veenstra  <h@...>
Omega Art: http://www.omega-art.com/

Hi Paul,

> Since 6xx I can't transpose the tracks independently in the "inspector" on
> the upper left part of the arrange window.
> If I transpose the track to , say +12, all the tracks get transposed !!
> Is this a bug or a new feature ? Can I restore the old function somehow ?
> Fortunately all the other parameter changings are indipendent for the single
> track (e.g delay compsation)

In the sequencer parameter box, all the parameters should work
equally independantly on only the selcted sequences. Is it possible
it is pilot error on your part and you unknowingly had multiple
sequences selected when you transposed what you thought was only one
sequence?

Or is it possible that with the new channel strip fader in the
arrange window you were inadvertantly using the instrument parameter
box instead of the sequence parametr controls?

Just some ideas...

--
Eli Krantzberg
Nightshift Orchestra / Almat Productions
http://www.nightshiftorchestra.com

Hi Mike,

> I have been having some weird nonsense in Logic. I have been creating some
> band music in logic which uses timps. In order to get the timps to sound at
> the correct pitch I have to transpose them up an octave, but to get the part
> to print correctly I have to use the transpose that doesn't affect the score
> to shift them up 10 semitones and then use the score transpose to shift the
> notes up the remaining two semitones. My main soundcard is an SB Audigy ex.
>
> When I play the file on any other soundcard or save it as a MIDI file the
> timp part goes back to normal - and therefore is at the wrong pitch! Has
> anyone heard of this and, more importantly, is there a way of stopping it
> happening?

When you are exporting as a standard midi file, you need to "burn
in" any sequence or instrument parameters you have set in Logic. The
playback parameters are just that; non destructive paramters that
only that specific Logic song "sees" when playing back your sequence.

So in order to make the changes destructive (or "constructive" to
use more upbeat language) you need to normalize the sequence
parameters theat you have set in the arrange window. Or 'fix
transpose" at the very least. All this is done from the arrange
window sub menues.

--
Eli Krantzberg
Nightshift Orchestra / Almat Productions
http://www.nightshiftorchestra.com

Logic Users Group (LUG) List Policy

We realize many of you are extremely busy professionals, and that
most people will never read this entire document. This is more
like a manual for the LUG for people to refer to when they have
questions about our list.

*** We do ask that you read through at least sections 3, 4 and 5.
Because this list is moderated, if you do not follow the rules
described in these sections, there is a very good chance that your
message will be returned to you so you can correct it! ***

Before we get started here are a couple of very important tips:
- Before asking a question on the LUG, please try searching our
message archive which contains over 130,000 messages:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/logic-users/messages
- Also please try reading through the Logic FAQ which contains a
lot of useful info about commonly asked questions:
http://www.logic-users.org


----------------------------------------------------------

Index:

0. Introduction
1. Official Language
2. Moderation and Unmoderation
3. Subject Lines
4. Quotes
5. Staying On Topic
   - What belongs here
   - More about Off Topic messages
   - What doesn't belong here
6. Developers / Retailers
7. Yahoo! Groups Features
8. A Few Tips
9. Other Emagic Lists
10. Examples


----------------------------------------------------------

0. Introduction

On this user's group, you'll find a community of users who share
all the information you ever wanted to know about Emagic's Logic
line of software. Members share tips, help each other use the
software, and talk about any other Logic-related issues.

Please keep in mind this is not an official Emagic list! Emagic
employees may answer your questions, but they're not obligated
to. Please email support@... for technical support, or
info@... for general information or to make suggestions.

If you ever wish to unsubscribe simply email
logic-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com from the email address
you're subscribed with, and Yahoo Groups will automatically
remove you from our list.

Because the LUG consists of over 10000 members from around the
world, this list moderated to keep everyone focused - see section
2 for more details. This group averages about 3000 emails per
month, so it is vital that everyone stays focused and on-topic so
the traffic does not become even more overwhelming.

You can either receive an individual email for each message
posted, a digest containing 25 messages all in one email, or you
can receive no email at all and just read the messages on the
web page. To change your preference visit
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/logic-users/join

If you ever need any administrative help please email
logic-users-owner@yahoogroups.com to contact all of the LUG Admins.
We are glad to help out when necessary.



----------------------------------------------------------

1. Official Language

Our group contains members from nearly every background and
nationality possible, and we are very proud of that! Because of
this diversity we ask that you all use the English language to
communicate on our list. Messages written in other languages will
not be approved.

The vast majority of our list members are adults, so profanity
is allowed on the list to an extent, but please try not to
over-do it. On the other hand using profanity to make a personal
attack against someone is not ok. Feel free to send us a copy of
your message in advance by writing to
logic-users-owner@yahoogroups.com and we can let you know if your
message is acceptable or not.



----------------------------------------------------------

2. Moderation and Unmoderation

As mentioned above, this list is moderated. This means for most
people, every single message you write must first be approved or
rejected by a list administrator. We do this to avoid unsolicited
commercial emails (a.k.a. spam), and to also prevent people from
making personal attacks or getting too off topic. Sometimes this
can cause a delay of up to a few hours between when you write
your message, and when it's approved by an admin, but usually we
can approve your messages fairly soon after you write them. Please
see section 5 for more details about what belongs on the list and
what doesn't.

However, some of our list members are not moderated, so messages
they write are sent out to the list immediately, without requiring
an admin to approve them. We do this because a) many list members
are consistentlyhelpful, kind, and follow our rules, so we have no
need to ever edit their messages... and b) this helps reduce the
amount of work we admins do, since we all just volunteer our spare
time and do not get paid to manage this group. If you would like to
become un-moderated, simply follow our rules. After we see you
consistently doing so for a while there is a very good chance we
will make you un-moderated, too.

Please keep in mind that even un-moderated list members need to
follow all of the rules explained in this document. If you are
un-moderated and break any of our rules there will be consequences.
Depending on the severity we might just send you a reminder, or we
might set you back to being moderated for a while. In the most
extreme cases people could even be temporarily or permanently
banned... It all depends on which rules you break and how badly you
break them. For example if someone forgets to trim their quotes now
and then we would just send a reminder, but if an unmoderated person
tries to start an OS war they very well could be banned. As always
people talking about using cracks will be permanently banned. Again,
please see section 5 for a complete list of our moderating guidelines.


----------------------------------------------------------

3. Subject Lines

Due to the high volume of this list we use special labels in the
subjects of all of our messages to indicate what sort of message
it is. For each message, you will need to choose exactly *one*
of the following labels:

[GEN] = relates to both Windows and Mac versions of Logic
[LAW] = relates to the Windows version of Logic only
[LAM] = relates to the Mac version of Logic only
[LC] = relates to the Logic Control device
     (used in any sequencer, on any platform)
[OT] = relates to an Off Topic message (section 5 for details)
[CROSS] = relates to Cross-grading Logic
     (from LAW to LAM, or from Logic to another sequencer)

In addition to using a label, please also use a descriptive subject
line. Please don't use something like "Newbie question", "Logic
problem", etc. Also when replying to messages, please don't be
afraid to change the subject line to something more fitting, if a
thread starts talking about something unrelated to its initial
subject.

Please do not use subject labels like GEN:, (GEN), {GEN}, or GEN.
We ask that you use the labels above *exactly*. Many of our list
members set up email filters that look for the specific labels
listed above. If a filter is looking for [GEN] and you write GEN:
then the message is not going to get filtered properly. While we do
appreciate creativity, please stick to []'s for enclosing the
subject labels and nothing else for this reason.

Also, in order to help the awesome Logic FAQ authors find commonly
asked questions, if you are replying to someone's question and feel
like that question gets asked a *lot* and should be included in the
FAQ, please add "(FAQ)" to the very end of your subject line. Not
[FAQ] but (FAQ) with ()'s.... This is a special extra label that the
Logic FAQ guys are on the lookout for so we can all alert them to new
issues that should be addressed in the Logic FAQ
( http://www.logic-users.org ). You'll still need to use
[LAM]/[LAW]/[GEN]/etc in your subject, just add (FAQ) to the very end.

Finally, please read through the examples in section 10 to learn a few
other subject line subtleties.


----------------------------------------------------------

4. Quotes

Again, due to the high volume of messages here, it is very important
that everyone uses proper quotes on this list. For a while now the
admins have been editing messages that do not follow these rules, and
fixing the quotes ourselves. We hoped that people would get the point
and start using proper quotes on their own, but unfortunately many list
members have not paid any attention and we continue to have to spend a
large amount of time editing messages every day. Please be aware that if
you do not follow these quoting rules, your message will probably be
rejected so you can fix it yourself! Please see section 10 for a big
list of examples.

A) First, and most important: Trim your quotes by erasing unnecessary
parts. There is no need to quote the Yahoo Footers (unsubscribe
information etc), or to quote all 25 messages in a digest when you are
replying to only 1 of them. Also there's no need to quote someone's
5-line-long signature when replying to their message, a simple "From:
whoever" at the top of the quotes will suffice.

B) Do not quote more than 10 lines of text without inserting a comment.
If you wish to quote an entire long message, please insert your comments
between small sections of quotes, so that the quotes and your new message
are mixed together. If you are not replying to specific parts of the
previous message, there is no reason to quote *all* of the old message -
people can always go back and read the original message online or in their
email client if they need to.

C) Quotes always need to go *above* your response. Do not put the quotes
at the bottom of a message. This quoting style was decided here by vote.
Basically, the argument against "bottom quoting" is this: if people can
read through your new message without reading the quotes (down at the
bottom), chances are those quotes are unnecessary and are just wasting
bandwidth.

D) If you attribute quotes to a certain person (for example
"Jeremy@... wrote:" or "From: Jeremy Martin ") please
make sure you are accurate. It is very frustrating to have quotes
attributed to you when you did not even write them! If you are in
doubt about who wrote what, do not attribute the quotes to anyone,
since "anonymous" quotes are ok.

Finally, while this is not really a rule, we do prefer ">" as the
symbol to use for quotes. Many email clients react to this symbol
in special ways, for example displaying the quotes in a special
color so they stand out from the message you are typing. If your
email client gives you an option to choose your own "quote symbol"
please use ">".


----------------------------------------------------------

5. Staying On Topic

In this section I will try to clarify exactly what does and does not
belong on this list. I've tried to make these definitions as complete
as possible, though due to the diversity of our group I am quite sure
it's impossible to define every single type of message that is and is
not ok on the LUG. If you feel anything should be added, or have any
questions about any of this, please contact us by writing to
logic-users-owner@yahoogroups.com

Before we get too far into this, please keep in mind that we do have
another group, Logic-OT, set up specifically for Logic users to
discuss messages that are too off topic for the LUG. Many of our
regular LUG members are also over on Logic-OT list. The Logic-OT list
is unmoderated, though we do enforce a few rules over there: mostly
just no OS wars, and no personal attacks or spam. This list is the
perfect place to send many types of messages that are too off topic
for the LUG that would still be of interest to other Logic users. To
sign up, just send a blank email to Logic-OT-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
or visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/logic-ot/join

WHAT DOES BELONG ON THE LUG:

A) Messages talking about Logic itself (how to use it, tips, bug
reports, suggestions, Environment issues, syncing Logic with other
programs or pieces of hardware, etc). Please use the appropriate [LAM]
[LAW] or [GEN] subject label. Since Logic v6 and above is Mac only,
anything talking about v6 features like Freeze, Project Manager, etc
should be labeled [LAM].

B) Messages talking about the LUG or Yahoo Groups itself (how to access
LUG features like the message archive, info on how to opt out of Yahoo
advertisements, how to sign up for our other Emagic lists, etc). Please
use the [GEN] subject label.

C) Messages about configuring computers to use Logic as efficiently as
possible (OS tweaks, BIOS tweaks, Logic settings, etc). Please use the
appropriate [LAM] or [LAW] subject label since these tweaks are platform
specific.

D) Messages about plug-ins that can be used inside of Logic. Please use
the appropriate [LAM] [LAW] or [GEN] subject label depending on which
platform(s) the plug-in are compatible with.

E) Messages about general mixing and production techniques that can
be applied inside of Logic. Please use the [GEN] subject label in
most cases. Only if you are discussing a new Mac only feature found in
v6 and above, such as grouping, would this sort of message need to be
marked [LAM].

F) Messages relating to other Emagic software products (Waveburner,
Zap, EVB3, etc), with the exception of EXS24 and SoundDiver since
we have separate lists for those two products - see section 9 for
details. There is one exception: please copy EXS bug reports to the
LUG to increase the chance that Emagic sees them, since they don't
seem to be very active on the EXS-Users list. For everything else
please use the appropriate [LAM], [LAW], or [GEN] subject label when
writing to the LUG.

G) Messages relating to Emagic hardware products (Logic Control,
EMI 2|6, AW2/AW8, etc). Please use the [LC] subject label for Logic
Control / XT, or use the appropriate [LAM] [LAW] or [GEN] subject
label for their other hardware products like the AMT8.

H) Messages about using third party hardware to control Logic, such
as MIDI keyboards, knob banks, other MIDI controllers. Also messages
about using other mixers and control surfaces such as the Baby HUI,
SAC 2.2, or Yamaha 01V with Logic. Please use the appropriate [LAM]
[LAW] or [GEN] subject label depending on what platform(s) your
message applies to.

I) Messages about what sound card to use with Logic, or where to get
drivers and support for sound cards. Also messages about DSP cards such
as UAD-1 and TCPowerCore and how to use them in Logic. Please use the
appropriate [LAM] or [LAW] subject label, since sound card performance
is greatly affected by the quality of the drivers written for your
specific OS.

J) Messages comparing Logic to other sequencers note that if you are
using a different sequencer right now and thinking about using Logic, or
trying to find a different sequencer to replace Logic, please use the
[CROSS] subject label. If you would like to suggest extra features you'd
like Logic to have that another sequencer has, please use the appropriate
[LAM] [LAW] or [GEN] subject label.

K) Messages about Emagic itself, such as messages talking about Emagic
trade shows and seminars, how to contact Emagic, how to register Emagic
plug-ins, etc. Please use the [GEN] subject label unless your question
is about a Mac-specific product such as Logic v6, in which case you
should use the [LAM] label.

L) Messages talking about how to convert data (audio, video, MIDI, etc)
into a format that Logic can work with. Examples would be how to convert
an 8 bit 22kHz .wav file into a 16 bit 44.1kHz file Logic can use, how
to convert audio from a movie on a DVD into a file Logic can use, or how
to convert a movie file from one codec to another so you can write a
score with it playing inside of Logic.

M) Messages asking for a "Logic tutor", job postings looking for
Logic producers, asking for other local Logic users in your city to
contact you, brief audio-related announcements (that aren't directly
related to Logic), or for sale announcements. Please use the [OT]
subject label and ask for people to reply to you privately. Note
that it's ok to use [LAM]/[LAW]/[GEN] when announcing new AU or VST
or DXi plug-ins Logic can use. You only need to use [OT] if you have
an announcement such as "ProTools for OSX has been released" that
doesn't relate to Logic directly.

MORE ABOUT OFF TOPIC MESSAGES:

Certain [OT] messages are permitted on the LUG. However all replies to
these off topic messages must be sent privately, or to the Logic-OT list.
[OT] replies sent to the LUG will not be approved. If you think your
reply to an [OT] message does belong on the LUG, chances are it falls
into one of the other categories, not [OT]. Please use the appropriate
label instead.

If you are selling used audio hardware/software you may make an
announcement about using "[OT] For Sale: (whatever)" as the subject
line. Please keep such messages as brief as possible. If you are
selling a large amount of gear at once it would be best to create
your own temporary web page with the full details, and just post
a short announcement with a link to that web page. It is also ok to
make one-time announcements about studios and control rooms for rent
using the [OT] subject label.

It is ok make occasional [OT] posts to ask questions you have been
unable to find the answer to elsewhere which are somehow related to
music/audio. However we ask that if you have general off topic
statements to make, like "I just got a new computer and it's fast!",
please send it to our dedicated [OT] list instead. Please be aware
that if a list admin feels your message might generate too large of
a response we may also ask you to send your [OT] message to Logic-OT
as well.

Again, please keep in mind that all replies to OT messages must be
sent privately or to Logic-OT!!

WHAT DOES NOT BELONG ON THE LUG:

In short, politics, spam, talking about cracks/software piracy,
personal attacks, banned threads, OS war messages (Mac vs PC),
and generally offensive messages are not allowed here. Here are
some details:

A) Messages discussing politics of any sort. This includes
(innocent or otherwise) political jokes, political debates, as
well as political signature lines.

B) Unsolicited commercial email. All spammers will be permanently
banned.

C) Messages advocating the use of cracked/pirated software. Anyone
writing such messages will be permanently banned from *all* of our
Emagic mailing lists. This includes the classic "My dog ate my
manual/I lost my manual while moving/etc, can someone please send
me a PDF manual?" messages. Any legitimate customer who has lost
their manual simply needs to ask Emagic for a replacement.

D) Personal attacks. Of course you are free to agree or disagree with
any ideas or viewpoints presented on our list, but personal attacks
will not be tolerated (such as calling a person stupid, etc.).
Depending on the severity of the personal attack, the attacker could
very well be banned, possibly even permanently. It all depends on the
situation.

F) Any message that an admin feels might cause a large amount of
unnecessary controversy, and/or offend a significant number of list
members. If you wonder if a certain message falls into this category
or not, please feel free to contact us at
logic-users-owner@yahoogroups.com before you post it, and we can let
you know if it would be ok or not. The vast majority of our list
members are adults, so some amount of cursing is allowed here. Please
try not to over-do it or your message might not be approved.

G) Sometimes certain threads never end if left alone. Occasionally we
admins have to step in and put an end to a thread. Please keep your
eye out for messages with [ADMIN] in the subject line, as we will
announce the "death" of certain threads this way. Please do not
continue replying to messages in such threads, they will simply be
deleted by the admins. The classic example of this has been never
ending OS war threads.

H) Messages discussing Macs vs. PCs. It's ok to write a message about
a Mac's performance (e.g. to offer benchmark results, or to ask for
suggestions on how to improve performance). The same goes for Windows
PCs. However it is *not* ok to compare the performance of these two
platforms, or to post links to such comparisons. We have tried to
allow calm, intelligent discussion comparing the two platforms but
no matter what, such threads always end in flame wars that we must
stop. Because of this such talk has been banned on the LUG (for now at
least). If you would like information about Mac vs. PC please search
our message archive as this has been discussed in depth in the past.
Also please keep in mind that Logic v6 and above is Mac only so the
fact is, if you want to continue using the latest versions of Logic,
Mac/PC comparisons are irrelevant.


----------------------------------------------------------

6. Developers / Retailers

We are very proud to have a number of audio software and hardware
developers present on our list. Many times software developers
will even announce new products on or list in person. It's just
fine to announce the existence of a new Logic-related product, as
long as you are not selling the product yourself. For example we
would be thrilled if RME wanted to announce a brand new sound card
on our list, as long as they did not try to sell this sound card
to our list members directly.

Our policy for *selling* products here, is this: It is ok for active
list members (who talk about sometimes Logic too) to announce audio
products they might be selling. It's also ok for regular list members
who also are audio retailers to announce Logic-related group buys or
sales they might be having, as long as they don't do this extremely
often. On the other hand, it is *not* ok for retailers that are
"strangers" here to sign up for our list and use it only to advertise
products they are selling, without being a regular participating
member of the community.

Note that there is an important difference between a person selling
their own personal used hardware (see the "about off topic messages"
section above for details), and a retailer who is trying to sell as
many "units" as possible. Retailers who want to advertise things they
sell on a regular basis here do need to be participating members of
the community first. On the other hand it's ok for someone who doesn't
post here much to announce a used sound card or synthesizer etc for
sale in an off topic message.

No one is allowed to collect the email addresses of LUG members, for
any purpose, especially advertising. Such behavior is unacceptable
and will result in the immediate removal of the offending party. The
exception to this is that it is ok for audio developers to ask list
members if they would like to beta test new plug-ins Logic can use
etc, since that is not trying to sell them anything.


----------------------------------------------------------

7. Yahoo! Groups Features

Below you will find a description of the various parts of our
"Yahoo! Groups" web page. Although our user group can function
as a standard mailing list, through email alone, you can access
all of our messages as well as extra resources not available
through email by visiting: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/logic-users

The big downside to the Yahoo Groups web page is the large number
of advertisements. Each page has one or more ads on it, and you
often have to click through certain ads to read a given message.
Because of this many people prefer to use the LUG through email
only (since the emails contain no ads). Unfortunately for some of
us this is not an option: we moderators must use the web page to
approve posts.

In any case the solution I have found to the Yahoo ads is to run
special software that prevents the ads from being displayed. In
Windows both Norton Internet Security and Zone Alarm Pro have
built in "Ad Blockers", and I'm sure there are many other
alternatives out there. Once the ads are blocked, the Yahoo! Groups
web page looks much cleaner, not to mention speeding up the load
time quite a bit. Plus if you have epilepsy, "Ad Blockers" can be
an invaluable tool to avoid seizures caused by annoying flashing
banner ads. ;-)

In any case, here are the some of the features that do make our
Yahoo Groups web page worth visiting:

A) Messages Archive: this is a searchable archive of previous messages
(over 130,000 to date). Note that because we have so many messages
now, the Yahoo servers only search 5000 messages at a time. After you
search once, if you don't find any results, click "Next" down at the
bottom to search the next 5000 messages. This way you can search
through our entire archive if necessary.

B) Bookmarks: here you can find a large number of useful links to other
web pages that have to deal with Logic or music-making in some way,
including dozens of other related user groups and web forums among
other things.

C) Polls: visiting this webpage will show you a list of different polls
you can vote on. Because we have such a large number of people on this
list, it is very easy to collect useful information this way. Feel free
to create a poll yourself if you think of a good question!

D) Files: here you can find many useful Logic-related files. Note that
we only have about 20 megabytes of space, so please don't upload
anything huge. Also all files uploaded need to be completely legal. If
you notice anything odd that shouldn't be in there please let an admin
know by writing to logic-users-owner@yahoogroups.com


----------------------------------------------------------

8. A Few Tips

Before asking a question on the LUG, please check the FAQ and the
Message Archive. Chances are someone else has had the exact same
question as you in the past. If you can find the answer in our archive
or in the FAQ it will save us all time and bandwidth.

Logic FAQ: Please give a big thanks to the team of "Logicians" who
helped put together that informative FAQ: Mark Cahill, Sascha Frank,
Michael Gerdau, Henrik Jensen, and Hendrik Jan Veenstra!!!

Message Archive: Enter some text to search (in the box right by the
"Search Archive" button) then click the button to start the search.
Because we have so many messages in our archive, Yahoo only searches
through 5000 messages at a time. If you don't find what you are looking
for in the most recent 5000 messages just click "Next" and Yahoo will
search through the next 5000 messages... keep going back further and
further until you find what you are looking for.

Here are a few other tips that can help make being a LUG member a little
easier:

Please include necessary details in your message, such as what version
of Logic you are using (e.g. 5.5, 4.8.1, etc), whether or not you're
using Platinum/Gold/Audio (Audio is the new name for Logic Silver as
of v5), and information about your computer (such as sound card,
CPU/motherboard for Windows users, how much RAM you have, etc).

If you are looking for an Environment please check the massive
Swiftkick collection first (managed by one of our resident Environment
Gurus, Len Sasso).

Before asking a question, it's also a good idea to check the Logic
manual, or even better, search through Logic's built-in help system.
Don't forget about other documentation as well: the Update Info file
that lists all new features in each new release, printed manual
addendums, as well as Emagic's InfoWeb.


----------------------------------------------------------

9. Other Emagic Lists

First, here are the other Emagic lists that are managed by the head
admin of the LUG (a.k.a. me), Jeremy Martin:

Logic OT list (for interesting messages too off topic for the LUG)
Subscribe: logic-ot-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: logic-ot-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Manage your list settings: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/logic-ot/join
Send messages to: logic-ot@yahoogroups.com

Logic TDM (for the use of Logic with DigiDesign's TDM/etc hardware)
Subscribe: logic-tdm-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: logic-tdm-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Manage your list settings: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/logic-tdm/join
Send messages to: logic-tdm@yahoogroups.com

SoundDiver Users (for discussing the use of Emagic's SoundDiver)
Subscribe: sounddiver-users-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: sounddiver-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Manage your list settings: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sounddiver-users/join
Send messages to: sounddiver-users@yahoogroups.com

EXS Users (for those using Emagic's EXS24/mkII or EXS24P samplers)
Subscribe: exs-users-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: exs-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Manage your list settings: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exs-users/join
Send messages to: exs-users@yahoogroups.com

Also, here are a few other independent Emagic-related Yahoo Groups:

ES2 Users Group (for Emagic's ES2 software synth)
Subscribe: es2--subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: es2--unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Manage your list settings: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/es2-/join
Send messages to: es2-@yahoogroups.com

Unitor 8 Users Group (for Emagic's Unitor8 MIDI device)
Subscribe: unitor8-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: unitor8-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Manage your list settings: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unitor8/join
Send messages to: unitor8@yahoogroups.com

Wavebrner User Group (for Emagic's WaveBurner software)
Subscribe: waveburner-users-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: waveburner-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Manage your list settings: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/waveburner-users/join
Send messages to: waveburner-users@yahoogroups.com

----------------------------------------------------------

10. Examples

To help illustrate a few points here are some examples of common
mistakes we see on the LUG, I have collected 11 examples on how to
quote messages etc. First you will see a list of what is wrong with
the example, then the incorrect message ("before"), with the correct
version below ("after").

To save space the examples are contained in a separate file:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/logic-users/files/admin/examples.txt or
if you don't like visiting the Yahoo! Groups web pages:
http://www.carrollsweb.com/sadus/LUG/examples.txt

Cheers
the LUG Staff
logic-users-owner@yahoogroups.com

I've been recording a group which is going to be played on the radio.
Basically it's a midi sound modules with vocals on top. I record vocals in
an acoustically deadened room, Neumann TLM 103 into a focusrite voicemaster
into my G3s mac AV sound ins.
The group is happy with the sound quality. I am very happy with how the
vocals came out, nice commercial sounding harmonies. I put on a cd called
'Your Woman' by Sunshine Anderson. It is awesome to hear how nice, warm and
clear the pros get the sound. But I feel I'm not far from that quality.
I have been told that the sound quality difference between an RME multiface
and the macs AV is big. I have also read endless praise about the UAD-1
cards sound.
This is a very subjective question but are people here getting an equal
quality of sound to the big studios with gear like an RME multiface, UAD-1
for mixing and obviously nice mic, vocalist and production?

What sort of difference, quality can I expect from this upgrade?

I can't wait to record some beautiful voices through the multiface and
compress them with UAD-1 and add a touch of realverb.

Funny thing is I'm pretty impressed with my mastreing with 'tracks'. All I
do is eq the song to match a pro cd and then compress till it's a similar
level, but of course making it appropriate to that song. I don't like to
sound too squashed.

Hope everyone else is happy with the sound they're getting. I'm looking
forward to these new items. Exciting to be able make pro recordings at home
with attainable equipment.
Peace.

on 6/1/03 5:16 AM, tony vincent at aps@... wrote:

> is this update a "bug-fixer"?  i just want too know if it's better to stay
> at 6.0 (using os9) for the time being...
> tv


I'm on OS 9 and 6.1 and I love it.  It fixed a bug that was driving me nuts
- the changing length of all objects at once in the matrix editor.  In 6.0
all lengths jump to zero in 6.0 they work like they're supposed to do.  Lots
of other fixes too.  IMO, it's great.

JR

--- In logic-users@yahoogroups.com, "stevelindsay63" <jslre@b...> wrote:
> I've just installed LAM 5.5  (previously a 4.8 user), on my system (OS9.1)
> which is also running a Motu 828 audio interface and an AMT8 midi
> interface. Whatever I do though, I cannot get the record armed buttons to
> show up on any of my midi tracks (they show up on my audio tracks).


OK, well the answer seems to be that it's a limitation of the Logic Audio (nee
Silver) software - the answer was buried in the archives (aren't they all?).

--- In logic-users@yahoogroups.com, Michael Haydn <mhaydn@m...> wrote:
> At 13:27 +0000 30.05.03, randallbennett wrote:
> >"You can also edit Channel EQs via the Logic Control-by pushing the
> >EQ button: this will open the first Channel EQ of the selected
> >channel. If no Channel EQ is active/available, it will
automatically
> >be inserted in the first free insert slot."
> >
> >This isn't happening for me.
>
> You're right, I simply forgot to implement it. Will be added in a
> later release.
> Beste Gruesse - best regards,
> Michael Haydn

Thanks Michael. I forgive you.
Randall

>> Emagic support told me that their midi interfaces are able to do that.
>> Every other interface will send midi clock only to the first port if
>> "send midi clock to all" is selected.
>> Sending only a midi clock stream is obviously much more efficient than
>> sending many streams, but I think that if you have 2 midi interfaces,
>> even emagic ones, only one will receive midi clock. I say this because
>> I have a Tascam US-428 and a midiman 4x4 and only one of them receives
>> midi clock on the first port.
>
>
> Do you know is this hardware or driver issue? I am very close to buy
> AMT8
> because I am very bored to use MidiPatchbay
> (http://pete.yandell.com/software/) to send midiclock to all ports of
> my
> Midiman Midisport 8/8s.

I think this is a driver issue and I hope that the midiman drivers will
be fixed.
I'm going to write them.

Sabato, 31 Mag 2003, alle 18:56 Europe/Rome, stretto11 ha scritto:

> I'm hoping someone will respond to my posts.
> Previously, I thought that there was a problem between my midi and
> audio
> sync, but now I know that it must be a midi issue only.  Can anyone
> shed
> some light?  Just to remind, there is a predelay of sorts when I
> record midi into
> Logic.  I have to somehow compensate for this by opening the
> synchronization menu, and delaying all midi output by 40ms or so, just
> to get
> my midi to allign to the grid.


Midi delay can be controlled even in the arrange window.
Look on the left in the topmost box; the latest option "delay" is what
we meant.
Leave te global midi delay on 0.

Check that delay in the arrange window is set to 0 on the midi
sequences that you hear out of sync.
Beware that delay is a per-object parameter, so you should check all
the sequences (select all of them and change delay).

Does anyone know what causes logic to stop with the error message,

"Error while trying to synchronise Audio and Midi.
Sample rate 30561 recognized.
Check conflict between Logic and external device"

This is very annoying, even more so in a live situation when
everything comes to halt halfway through a song!
I'm using a new 17" Powerbook 1ghz with 1gig memory just using the
built in audio controller for output to the P.A. I have no midi
drivers on this system and I have disabled auto sync detection.
Audio sync mode is set to MTC Trigger.
It might only happen once during an evening, but that is one time too
many!
<snipped by admin>

Thanks for the floods of replies and helpful advise.
Mike.

roman pirie <romanp@...> writes:
>I record vocals in an acoustically deadened room,
>Neumann TLM 103 into a focusrite voicemaster into
>my G3s mac AV sound ins.

Too bad.  Such a  nice mic and preamp, but such a crappy
convertor by comparison.

roman pirie <romanp@...> writes:
>I have been told that the sound quality difference between
>an  RME multiface and the macs AV is big.

I think any soundcard would be better than MacAV. Furthermore,
RME convertors are among the best of the low/mid priced native
soundcard solutions out there.

If your Voicemaster has a digital output, use that into whatever
soundcard you choose that also has a digital input.

roman pirie <romanp@...> writes:
>I have also read
>endless  praise about the UAD-1 cards sound.

It sounds great, and is generally an improvement over any
native plugin I've ever heard.  Remember, it's not a "sound card"
in that it has no input/output.  It's a DSP card that has some
very nice plugins that can be used in Logic.


f-erenc szabo,  smarty pants
                         Z+E+R+O+B+E+A+T
"NOW POWERED BY THE MIRACLE OF THE TRANSISTOR!"

roman pirie wrote:

> I can't wait to record some beautiful voices through the multiface and
> compress them with UAD-1 and add a touch of realverb.

That's interesting. I just ordered a UAD-1 to use with Logic on my G4 (450
DP) and a Delta 1010. I am looking forward to work with the UAD-1, because
the included plug-ins are said to have an extremely high sound quality -
about the same as the emulated hardware. It might give small project
studio's and home studio's a big leap in quality.

I am just a tad worried about reports I read about the fact that Logic,
UAD-1 and Delta 1010 might not be a good team (errors, problems, etc.). I
was wondering if anybody would like to shed any light on this.

Gert
www.waveworld.tv

On 1/6/03 10:43, "roman pirie" <romanp@...> wrote:

> The group is happy with the sound quality. I am very happy with how the
> vocals came out, nice commercial sounding harmonies. I put on a cd called
> 'Your Woman' by Sunshine Anderson. It is awesome to hear how nice, warm and
> clear the pros get the sound. But I feel I'm not far from that quality.
> I have been told that the sound quality difference between an RME multiface
> and the macs AV is big. I have also read endless praise about the UAD-1
> cards sound.

Well the Converters from the Mac AV are C*** & using good converters like
the RME/Apogee will definitely give you more depth, better resolution & a
finer high end.

> This is a very subjective question but are people here getting an equal
> quality of sound to the big studios with gear like an RME multiface, UAD-1
> for mixing and obviously nice mic, vocalist and production?

Well I think you can get very good mixes with Logic, good plug ins, good
converters, good microphone, preamps & good ears.

If you do lots of electronic music, where most of the sounds come from
keyboards, etc & using decent gear for vocals, etc, you should have a
reasonable quality.

I both work at home with Logic, MOTU 896 some outboard gear, etc & in
diverse studios using SSL/Neve/Euphonix, etc sometimes recording to analog,
sometimes to PT, Logic, depending on the budget & the style of music.

I think nowadays, you can get very close to professional productions at
home, especially if you know what you're doing. However, the main difference
I experience from mixes I do in Logic compared to mixes in nice studios is
that they lack a certain amount of depth & stereo imaging. You can't really
say what's different, but it's just 'warmer, bigger, etc' but the difference
is quite subtle & I guess most people wouldn't even hear it.

I work with loads of acoustic recordings, so I don't think I'll be able to
pull of as good a sound at home than in a good studio.

Basically you can say is to get the last 10% of amazing sound you have to
spend millions & millions of dollars.

But then again, think about what you are able to do with a quite limited
budget today, compared to only 5 years ago... You can't expect getting a
ferrari for the same amount than a ford (no offence to anybody ;-)), but the
difference is not big anymore...

Well you said you're happy with your mixes & masters & that's already a good
sign. I haven't heard the UAD-1, but I heard from other people is that it's
really nice & the RME will definitely be an improvement over the Mac AV.

Good luck & have fun doing your music/projects,

Cheers,

Gilles

--
Gilles Ruppert
Sound Engineer
gilles@...

PowerBook G4 1GHz 1GB RAM
MOTU 896 / MOTU MTP AV
Mbox PT 5.2.1 / LAP 6.1
Oxygen8 / SAC 2k

> Check that delay in the arrange window is set to 0 on the midi
> sequences that you hear out of sync.
> Beware that delay is a per-object parameter, so you should check all
> the sequences (select all of them and change delay).


I checked, and Delay is set to 0.
Any other suggestions?
Thanks.

Is anyone using the AUD-1 card with MOTU pci hardware and getting good
results (or bad?)

-Ben

Hello, I work with Logic 5.5

If I use a Vst synth in logic (audioinstrument) and it's an arpeggiator that
plays. Can I record this notes on a separate midi-tack?
But how???? Wat must I connect or setup?
Thanks for your help

> I've been recording a group which is going to be played on the radio.
> Basically it's a midi sound modules with vocals on top. I record vocals in
> an acoustically deadened room, Neumann TLM 103 into a focusrite
> voicemaster
> into my G3s mac AV sound ins.

Roman,

DEFINITELY get a new soundcard! The RME added alot for me - plus the pre's
on the digimax and ... KAPOWIE!  This setup kicks everyones ass in town (but
they use behringer and roland vs recorders ;).   The RME really boosts your
processing power as well, the routing of inputs to outputs is phenomenal to
boot.  However, I don't have a really nice mic...I've been using the
AT3035($200) for vocals and a room mic and my results have still been very
good.

I think I may get a blue mic or a neumann sometime in the future.  The
Focusrite ISA 428 pre looks pretty cool as well...I just need $1600


My setup is:

RME Multiface
Presonus Digimax 8 channel pre
Logic
1.5ghz AthlonXP

www.gmgrecording.com

I've run into a problem with the score edit feature in 6.1 (haven't
tried this in earlier versions). If I change the time signature of a
measure to 2/4 and then go back to 4/4 a measure later, the bar
lines in subsequent measures are all screwed up. Most of them
are in 4/4, but many of them are displayed as if they're in 2/4. If I
try to drop a whole note rest into one of these measures, Logic
puts a half note rest in the bar I dropped the rest into and puts
another half note rest in the following bar, since it apparently
thinks these bars are in 2/4. As you can imagine, there's no
possibliity of making an accurate chart with this sort of behavior.
Is this a bug or am I missing something? If it's a bug, does
anyone know a workaround?

Thanks,
Scott

>> The group is happy with the sound quality. I am very happy with how the
>> vocals came out, nice commercial sounding harmonies. I put on a cd called
>> 'Your Woman' by Sunshine Anderson. It is awesome to hear how nice, warm and
>> clear the pros get the sound. But I feel I'm not far from that quality.
>> I have been told that the sound quality difference between an RME multiface
>> and the macs AV is big. I have also read endless praise about the UAD-1
>> cards sound.
>
> Well the Converters from the Mac AV are C*** & using good converters like
> the RME/Apogee will definitely give you more depth, better resolution & a
> finer high end.


I was going to ask how the RME multiface compares to an Apogee. Is a Rosetta
the same quality as top end apogees?
I've somehow assumed that the RME multiface has better sound than the Pro
Tools 888s. If that is true then we are using better quality converters than
those which were industry standards and used on many top commercial
releases. Does the Apogee sound better then the multiface?

> The group is happy with the sound quality. I am very happy with how
the
> vocals came out, nice commercial sounding harmonies. I put on a cd
called
> 'Your Woman' by Sunshine Anderson. It is awesome to hear how nice,
warm
> and
> clear the pros get the sound. But I feel I'm not far from that
quality.
> I have been told that the sound quality difference between an RME
> multiface
> and the macs AV is big. I have also read endless praise about the
UAD-1
> cards sound.

Hi Roman-

In my opinion you could do better than the Mac converters for relatively
little money.  But keep in mind that if your ears are telling you that
you are on the right track with what you have, then I would say go with
that.  You may be talking about fixing something that isn't broken.

In my experience, there exists a definite point of diminishing returns
with audio gear (and pretty much everything else for that matter).  The
jump from a $100 mic to a $500 mic is appreciable.  The difference
between the $500 mic and a $2500 mic is much more subtle.  Of course it
all depends on the mic, etc. but the point being that you already have
some good gear and are getting good sounds.  For a lot of money you may
only see a small improvement.

That being said, the weak link is certainly your audio card. But you
said you already have tracks that sound good.  Who knows, you may have
captured performances that make up for the fidelity issue.  You could go
back and record them with 100 times the gear and they could sound like
shit...believe me, I've made that mistake.  What makes a good producer
is knowing when that kind of thing matters and when it doesn't.

I have a UAD card and it does indeed sound good.  Would it be my "desert
island pick"?  No.  It adds some really nice flavors to the palate but
it is no substitute for tracks that sound good as soon as you throw up
the fader.  Also, maybe because they are emulations of their analogue
counterparts, you give up a bit of the precision that you may be used to
when using digital compression and eq.  (stuff like real lookahead
brickwall limiting, automatic gain compensation, surgical eq, blah,
blah, blah).  Not true for RealVerb and the channel strip plugs, but
potentially and issue with the LA2A, 1176, and Pultec.  Make no mistake,
these are great plugins but they fall on the other end of the spectrum
from something like the Waves C1, L1, and Q series.  For example, with
the compressors, I have found that often to get the sound I want, all I
have to do is apply little or no compression and just crank the output
gain of the plugin.  To my ears, it sounds nothing like just turning it
up:)  That may take some getting used to unless you are coming from an
analogue background.

If you feel like you mix is almost there, then maybe save your money and
put it towards a really good mastering job.  If you are set on getting
some new toys anyhow, I doubt you would regret the RME and UAD.

best, Nathan
___
Nathan Rosenberg
Music Production                    www.doghouseNYC.com
The Doghouse NYC                    www.pianoVOX.com

It really all depends on your ability to engineer and mix. Nothing will
replace someone who really knows how to use the gear and I don't mean
using some program and plugging someone else's presets in either. Doing
that isn't really going to do someone's music justice as every song and
instrumentation is going to be different and require different things.

As far as the Delta 1010 and the UAD-1. Well, I have them both. I've
had the UAD-1 for several months now and haven't even used it since
they haven't made OSX drivers for it yet. I'm beginning to feel like I
need to sell my Delta 1010 and move over to the RME. I'm getting so
frustrated by M-audio's lack of driver updates for OSX. For anyone
doing recording at 96k, which the delta should do, it chokes hard and
the only cause appears to be M-Audio's driver. Same reason I didn't use
the UAD-1 in OS9, it doesn't work well with the Delta. UGH.

Jody
Music you'll love or hate!
http://www.cdbaby.com/jodywhitesides
or visit:
http://jodywhitesides.com

On Sunday, June 1, 2003, at 08:50  AM, Gert van Santen wrote:

> I am just a tad worried about reports I read about the fact that Logic,
> UAD-1 and Delta 1010 might not be a good team (errors, problems,
> etc.). I
> was wondering if anybody would like to shed any light on this.
>

I love my UAD-1. I feel it's been the best $$ I have spent in 20 years
of recording. It does have a few issues, but if you go to the UAD site,
you'll see the work arounds. This card sounds so darn good! My work
sounds much better, and because of that, 3 of my friends have also
purchased the card!

George
________________________________________________________
My Home : www.utopiaparkwaymusic.com

EXS/Logic FAQ: http://logicfaq.omega-art.com/

"Reet to tee to tee to tee to teeeeeeee"
Frank Zappa

" All our dreams can come true, if we have the courage to pursue them"
Walt Disney

On Sunday, June 1, 2003, at 01:44  PM, Jody Whitesides wrote:

>  Same reason I didn't use
> the UAD-1 in OS9, it doesn't work well with the Delta. UGH.

Hey Jody,
			 Have you tried the workaround?

George
________________________________________________________
My Home : www.utopiaparkwaymusic.com

EXS/Logic FAQ: http://logicfaq.omega-art.com/

"Reet to tee to tee to tee to teeeeeeee"
Frank Zappa

" All our dreams can come true, if we have the courage to pursue them"
Walt Disney