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active ribbon microphone buffer measurements   Message List  
Reply Message #17462 of 18286 |
Re: [micbuilders] active ribbon microphone buffer measurements

It's under files > kuribas

http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/micbuilders/files/kuribas/

Kristof

Op 14-02-12 18:14, Jerry Lee Marcel schreef:
> The specified frequency response is +/- 1 dB with a 10k load. I think
> the transformer is loaded with a nearly infinite resistance and the
> input capacitance of the FET stage; that is enough to explain the
> slight HF overshoot.
> Regarding the LF corner frequency, maybe the transformer is not the
> culprit; where is your schemo?
>
> Le 14/02/2012 17:21, kristof Bastiaensen a écrit :
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> some time ago I posted my schematic of a ribbon microphone buffer
>> with opamp. I have tested my buffer and done some THD measurements.
>> I did the measurements by outputting a sinewave and putting it
>> through my buffer into my focusrite Saffire pro 10 interface,
>> and measuring it with a software audio analyser.
>>
>> I put the output from the focusrite directly (through a 1k resistor)
>> into the buffer (unbalanced) without transformer, and I got 0.003%
>> THD at 100Hz and 0.009% THD at 10kHz.
>> The frequency response was rising to about 0.5 dB at 20kHz.
>> When I measured the distortion through a voltage divider (100k:1k) I
>> was getting much larger distortion levels, but my test setup must
>> have been wrong because with the transformer (see below) there was no
>> large distortion.
>>
>> Then I measured the buffer with the transformer installed (1:110) and
>> a 1k:0.1 ohm voltage divider (balanced), and I got 0.07% THD at 45Hz,
>> unmeasureable (<0.002%) above 150Hz, and 0.005% at 8Khz.
>>
>> The frequency response with the transformer is -3dB at 20Hz, 0dB at
>> 1kHz, -0.4 dB at 4kHz, -0.5 at 10kHz and -0.2dB at 20kHz.
>>
>> I am not sure why I am getting a rising frequency response, maybe it
>> is because of the FET gate capacitance?
>> The -3dB point at 20Hz seems to high, since the transformer datasheet
>> (LL1927) says it should be +- 1dB from 10Hz to 70Hz.
>> Maybe the high -3dB point comes from my buffer instead.
>> Unfortunately the phantom power from my interface has broken down
>> (maybe I shorted something while testing my circuit), and I
>> cannot do any measurements at the moment.
>>
>> The SNR seems very good, the noise is slightly more than my Octava
>> MK-012 condenser, and the output level is about the same.
>>
>> I think my circuit is decent enough for a transparent, professional
>> sound, though I'd like to know if the THD and frequency response
>> could be improved, especially at low frequencies.
>>
>> It's also interesting that the circuit will work at lower voltages
>> (even 12V), by bypassing the zener diode. It would also be possible
>> to add gain by including two resistors in the feedback and a
>> capacitor. For example to use a ribbon microphone with a portable
>> recorder with low gain. I found a similar idea here
>> (http://www.ciphersbyritter.com/RADELECT/PREJFET/JFETPRE.HTM)
>> which uses a BJT instead of an opamp for feedback.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Kristof Bastiaensen
>>
>>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




Tue Feb 14, 2012 7:29 pm

kuribas
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Message #17462 of 18286 |
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The specified frequency response is +/- 1 dB with a 10k load. I think the transformer is loaded with a nearly infinite resistance and the input capacitance of...
Jerry Lee Marcel
jerrylee.marcel Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
5:14 pm

It's under files > kuribas http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/micbuilders/files/kuribas/ Kristof ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]...
Kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
7:29 pm

Actually, there is also HF overshoot (about 0.5dB) without the transformer, when I connect the output of the interface directly to the FET with a 1k resistor...
Kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
7:51 pm

The frequency response with the transformer is -3dB at 20Hz, 0dB at 1kHz, -0.4 dB at 4kHz, -0.5 at 10kHz and -0.2dB at 20kHz. There is nothing in your buffer...
Jerry Lee Marcel
jerrylee.marcel Offline Send Email
Feb 15, 2012
10:19 am

Hi, I cannot test my interface at the moment, but in the interface datasheet is written 20Hz - 20kHz +- 0.2dB, but it doesn't say which load they used to...
kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Feb 18, 2012
1:16 pm

Thanks for this. I have been thinking about such a circuit for a while. I don't understand everything you are talking about, but if I can build your circuit...
superfunhappycard
superfunhapp... Offline Send Email
Mar 23, 2012
11:04 am

Hi, the main advantages to an active circuit are * a larger signal, so you can record quiet sources without buying a special preamp * low impedance, which...
kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Mar 26, 2012
7:13 pm

I have a friend who can make me a transformer. What would be the ideal specs? Actual number of turns? Best core material? Are we trying to get the primary DCR...
superfunhappycard
superfunhapp... Offline Send Email
Mar 27, 2012
10:03 am

We need to have a low primary DCR as well as a low secondary DCR. The secondary DCR can be higher, because the signal will be stepped up, but we don't want it...
kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Mar 29, 2012
8:01 am

... The largest transformer I ever encountered that was designed for this purpose was 65:1. I think 200:1 may be unrealistic! The signal only needs to come...
David Pickett
kriegerjoh Offline Send Email
Mar 29, 2012
12:27 pm

... I agree there. I think it may be more realistic to get a bi-filler wound primary and secondary at around 1:55 and then wire both the primaries in...
ron.novy Offline Send Email Mar 29, 2012
11:54 pm

... will be enough interest for 10 transformers? And will the total price/quality be better than an existing ribbon transformer? I read the website...
superfunhappycard
superfunhapp... Offline Send Email
Mar 31, 2012
10:27 am

... Oh, I read that wrongly... ... That edcor RMX1 transformer has a DCR that is even higher than the lundahls, and I am not even sure about distortion, etc......
kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Mar 31, 2012
3:04 pm

... My circuit would be well suited for these transformers. You could also try the one on the royer patent. Kristof...
kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Mar 31, 2012
3:41 pm

... I replaced the two diodes in my circuit with a resistor and a capacitor, and now I don't get any additional noise from a 1k source resistance. I have...
kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Mar 31, 2012
3:46 pm

... to fit in a mic body. ... Kristoff, can you ask them what DC resistances they are aiming for on the Primary & Secondary? Also what Inductances. The...
Richard Lee
ricardo_lee Offline Send Email
Mar 30, 2012
3:00 am

... Richard, http://www.edcorusa.com/p/345/rmx1 (click on the 'specifications' tab) These are the specs for their 1:37 ribbon transformers. Is that any use to...
superfunhappycard
superfunhapp... Offline Send Email
Mar 31, 2012
10:31 am

... There are 2 separate issues 1 Rideal which is the source resistance that gives best noise performance for the input device 2 Gain. How loud is the...
Richard Lee
ricardo_lee Offline Send Email
Apr 1, 2012
7:50 pm

Thanks for the detailed answer! So I've been looking at your active ribbon circuit, and I can get those 2SC3329's. Given its simplicity, and low cost compared...
superfunhappycard
superfunhapp... Offline Send Email
Apr 6, 2012
11:28 pm

... This circuit is one of very few which give good performance with 30-50R mikes. Most preamps are optimised for 200-600R. My circuit will give good noise...
ricardo
ricardo_lee Offline Send Email
Apr 7, 2012
12:54 am

... -- snip 8-<------ ... What makes you think so? The turns ratio in my transformer is large, but the input impedance to my circuit is in the order of...
kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2012
2:51 pm

... There are 2 systems; mechanical & electrical. Transient response of a mechanical system depends not on the stiffness or mass, but on the ratio of...
ricardo
ricardo_lee Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2012
10:06 pm

I might see how the circuit goes, and might try to unwind some of the secondary winding of my transformer after that. ... Hmmm... none of the documents in the...
superfunhappycard
superfunhapp... Offline Send Email
Apr 9, 2012
4:15 am

... secondary winding of my transformer after that. That's a rather drastic step. I'm not sure which circuit you are building but I think the choices are sorta...
ricardo
ricardo_lee Offline Send Email
Apr 10, 2012
1:45 am

... Well, if there is room for improvement, it's always welcome. I did test the circuit with a 0.1ohm resistance, and the response was flat in the audio range...
kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Apr 10, 2012
5:09 pm

Which might be the effect of antialiasing filter before your ADC. Regards,   Sergei. ... [snip] ... [snip]...
Sergei Steshenko
sergstesh Offline Send Email
Apr 10, 2012
8:46 pm

... If it is within 0.1dB at 20kHz and doesn't peak up again at supersonic frequencies, I would say it is beyond reproach. I agree with Sergei that the drop...
ricardo
ricardo_lee Offline Send Email
Apr 10, 2012
10:16 pm

... I measured my ribbon (2.5 micron) at 0.15 ohm, so just a little more that the 0.1 ohm I used for testing. The frequency response is within 0.5db, that's a...
kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Apr 11, 2012
10:05 am

I have tested the frequency response of my microphone. I found a nice tool for linux to convert a sinesweep to a spectogram: ...
kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Apr 13, 2012
4:32 pm

Hmm, I am thinking this -3db dip at 10kHz dip might be a peak in the response from the superlux measurement mic. Kristof...
kristof Bastiaensen
kuribas Offline Send Email
Apr 14, 2012
8:09 pm
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