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I feel we should not have any arbitrary standards. We need to be flexible in the solutions we consider. If there is a good reason to only remove 80% of the lipids or if it just less costly, let's go for it.
We do not necessarily need 100% separation of components. More to the point, we only need the froth flotation to remove about 25% of the algae cells from the culture. Your supposition may be the key to why people think froth flotation is considered expensive. If someone has to work it really hard to get all the algae out of the culture, the cost may be much higher than trying to get a fraction of the cells out.
I don't feel getting the lipids pure is essential. There are lots of processes to filter and clarify lipids. I assume they will be added to the end of our process, if needed.
I fear that Brian may be correct that we can not just dump the algae debris back into the culture and expect the still growing algae cells to be able to break it down and use the nutrients. That may especially be true with the lipids. We may have to compost, aerobically digest, or otherwise treat the cell debris and unextracted lipids before we can return them to the culture.
Even if that processing cost more than it is worth, we still may be satisfied with extracting on 80% of the lipids. For instance, if we sell the cell debris for animal feed, the farmers may want us to leave some of the lipids in the press cake - the animals may need a little fat in their feed.
(Reality note - accepting less than perfect processes is just to get started with. Once we have a process that allows us to make a profit, we will keep working on each part of it, trying to get closer to perfection.)
Bobby
Alex,
First we have to get the algae out of the culture.
Removing lipids is second.
I assume your point was that we should not use a treatment that prevents us from some other processing we would want to do. A good thought, but we might end up doing it if that is a drastically cheaper process.
It does give another reason for my favorite - Froth flotation.
Until we have run a lost more tests and costed out a lot of techniques, we need to keep our minds open to all possibilities.
Bobby
On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 10:13 AM, Alex Markin <anzactwo@...> wrote:
Alex,
Reading between the lines, there may be some info here that could help when trying to floc out algae.
Also, it says that alum can give a boost to sand filters.
I still like the idea of froth flotation, but who knows what is going to be cost effective?
BobbyOn Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 12:08 PM, Alex Markin <anzactwo@...> wrote:
Bruce,
Do you think it might work as a flocculant?
I am also considering using it to remove gypsum from drinking water.
BobbyOn Wed, Jul 1, 2009 at 8:05 AM, lendlabs <lendlabs@...> wrote:
???Alum (pronounced /ˈæləm/) is both a specific chemical compound and a class of chemical compounds. The specific compound is the hydrated aluminum potassium sulfate with the formula KAl(SO4)2.12H2O. The wider class of compounds known as alums have the related stoichiometry, AB(SO4)2.12H2O.
--- In oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com, Bobby Yates Emory <liberty1@...> wrote:
>
> Ron and Gianfranco,
>
> I think that is commonly called Alum and is easily available - this is
> WalMart's listing:
>
> <
> http://www.walmart.com/search/search-ng.do?search_constraint=0&ic=48_0&search_query=alum&Find.x=11&Find.y=8&Find=Find
> >
>
> Bobby
>
> 2009/7/1 Gian Roncolato alchemirg@...
>
> >
> >
> > Dear Ron,
> > In the water treatment industries to clarify the water and flocculatind all
> > te suspended solids it is normally used "Aluminum Sulfate" (liquid form
> > about 8% content), can be used fram 10 to 25 grams per cubic meters.
> > It is not expensive and it work perfectly. It need a "pre-dilution" with
> > water followed by a distribution and good mixture inside the tank.
> > Regards
> > Gianfranco Roncolato
> >
> > ------------------------------
> > To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
> > From: potrzebie44@...
> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:23:21 -0700
> > Subject: [oil_from_algae] Learning from Failure [1 Attachment]
> >
> > [Attachment(s)<http://co119w.col119.mail.live.com/mail/EditMessageLight.aspx?ReadMessageId=fa6d5360-f2a2-4af6-9a38-e81dcc479708&FolderID=00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000001&CP=-1&n=1316965772&Action=Reply&AllowUnsafe=False#TopText>from Ron Brown included below]
> >
> > The attached photo shows an algae culture we grew from one slant of
> > Chlorella vulgaris that we got from Carolina Biological Supply Company
> > ($9.00 + $30.00 s&H) in one week. I count that part as a success. But we
> > tried to flocculate it with lime, and that was a little disappointing.
> > "Microalgae Harvesting and
> > Processing: A Literature Review" discusses the use of lime to flocculate
> > algae. a quick search of the internet confirmed that lime has been used to
> > control algae in ponds. Well, it was quick, cheap and easy, but it didn't
> > work. We applied a pound or two of lime that was left over from a
> > construction project to about 300 gallons of culture. I was hoping to be
> > able to scoop up the floc with a household strainer. Although there was a
> > fine white precipitate on the bottom, there was no sign of flocculation.
> >
> >
> > ---rsb
> > Ron Brown
> > 30JUNE2009
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> > What can you do with the new Windows Live? Find out<http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/default.aspx>
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Toward freedom,
>
> Bobby Yates Emory
>
--
Toward freedom,
Bobby Yates Emory
Â
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Toward freedom,
Bobby Yates Emory
Â
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Toward freedom,
Bobby Yates Emory
Â
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Toward freedom,
Bobby Yates Emory
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