oil_from_algae : Messages : 14562-14591 of 14869

Very, very, interesting, Ron. Thanks for sharing. Is this with chlorella only, or a chlorella polyculture?

David Sieg

From: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com [mailto:oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ron Brown
Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2012 9:05 PM
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Flocculation [1 Attachment]

[Attachment(s) from Ron Brown included below]

Hello, All,

Well, I was finally able to tie everything together concerning flocculation. Since I am limited to five attachments, and since I needed to use nine, I put everything into the attached "Floc.pdf". Enjoy!

---rsb

Ron Brown

07NOV2012

Reply | Messages in this Topic (3)

#14563

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
Date: Thu Nov 8, 2012 3:26 am
Subject: RE: Flocculation

potrzebie44

--- On Wed, 11/7/12, David Sieg <dsieg58@...> wrote:

From: David Sieg <dsieg58@...>
Subject: RE: [oil_from_algae] Flocculation
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, November 7, 2012, 7:23 PM

David,

>>Very, very, interesting, Ron. Thanks for sharing. Is this with chlorella only, or a chlorella polyculture?

This is polyculture using Chlorella with Euglena. I haven't got around to adding the third one, yet.

Reply | Messages in this Topic (3)

#14564

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
Date: Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:18 am
Subject: Electrostatic Harvesting

potrzebie44

Hello, All,

Algae has a negative charge. I thought that applying an electric field across some algae culture would cause the algae toi migrate towards one side and away from the orther. I didn't want to cause hydroilysis, so I used a Whimshurst Machine to generate the electrostatic charge. I felt that it could generate quite a few kilovolts, while keeping the current down to a couple of microamps. I verified that the equipment was working properly and set it up as shown in the attached "Setup.jpg". Then I cranked it for 15 minutes. There was no change at all. I checked the outpuit with a digital voltmeter and was surprised to find only two tenths of a volt AC current. I was expecting DC current--AC isn't going to do us any good at all. Anyhow, now we know about one more thing that doesn't work.

---rsb

Ron Brown

09NOV2012

1 of 1 Photo(s)

setup.jpg

#14565

From: "Marcel" <mpageers@...>
Date: Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:33 pm
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting

mpageers

0.2V AC where you expect DC sounds like noise to me.

--- In oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com, Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...> wrote:
>
> ���� Hello, All,
> �
> ���� Algae has a negative charge.��I thought�that applying an electric field
across some algae culture would cause the algae toi migrate towards one side and
away from the orther.� I didn't want to cause hydroilysis, so I� used a
Whimshurst Machine to generate the electrostatic charge.� I felt that it could
generate quite a few kilovolts, while keeping the current down to a couple of
microamps.� I verified that the equipment was working properly and set it up as
shown in the attached "Setup.jpg".� Then I cranked it for 15 minutes.� There was
no change at all.� I checked the outpuit with a digital voltmeter and was
surprised to find only two tenths of a volt AC current.� I was expecting DC
current--AC isn't going to do us any good at all.� Anyhow, now we know about one
more thing that doesn't work.
> �
> �
> ---rsb
> Ron Brown
> 09NOV2012
>

#14566

From: "rikmid" <rikmid@...>
Date: Wed Oct 31, 2012 9:57 pm
Subject: Best algae strain for biodiesel production

rikmid

Can someone suggest to me the best strain of algae to use for biodiesel
production? I would prefer a fresh water species.

Reply | Messages in this Topic (2)

#14567

From: Carroll Lendrum <lendlabs@...>
Date: Mon Nov 12, 2012 3:20 pm
Subject: Re: Best algae strain for biodiesel production

lendlabs

That also depends on your daily tempature. We have worked with B.Braunii in West Texas due to the heat and salt tolerance but this did not work very well for the National Study done by John Benamann (also this is renewable diesel as Bb only makes hydrocarbons).. The Race A Bb like cooler weather more then hot but the need is more for More CO2. Light penitration is very important so the angle to the sun is very important... I have a South light study for production with a 90 degree angle glass wall( it is an Air Lift PBR).

John Benamann will have more data from Denmark then I have also..Also remember that organic Omega 3 or 9 oil we sell for about $10 to $15/ gal wholesale.

Just a thought,

Bruce

Reply | Messages in this Topic (2)

#14568

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
Date: Tue Nov 13, 2012 12:04 am
Subject: Electrostatic Harvesting

potrzebie44

Hello, All,

>>I am not sure if you had it wired right for this type of generator.

No, I had it wired wrong. Instead of building up a charge in the Leiden Jars, everything that was generated was constantly leakled away, but I was able to fix it. I used the same container for the algae culture, and the same electrodes, but I routed the wires from the electrodes to the back of a styrofoam board into which I had cut two holes that were aligned with the Leiden Jars' terminals. By tilting the board back and forth, I was able to discharge the Leiden jars repeatedly through the algae culture.

Here is a view of what that looked like:

http://www.estudiosbiblicospeniel.org/sparks.htm

The attached "Second_try.jpg" shows how the algae looked afterwards.
I did not see any separation taking place, but it is obvious that something changed.
Also, I did not experience any atomization of the water or explosions.
(After reading the water cannon stuff, I wasn't entirely sure what to expect.)
So, I would count this as progress.

Yesterday, I tested it, again. I bent the electrodes so there was only about 1/4" gap between them, and ran the generator for 30 minutes. Since it was sparking once a second, I delivered 1800 pulses of microamp, kilovolt current through the algae culture. I did not see any change in the algae culture.

Today, I tried again, after restoring the long path and adding 1 teaspoon of baking soda to the algae culture. After 5 minutes, it looked like the attached "Fourth_try.jpg".

It did not work the first time, because I wired it wrong. The second time, the algae were seen to clump together. The third time, my error was to shorten the path through the algae culture, thinking thatthe longer path was a hindrance. The fourth time, it seemed to be working the same way as the second time. Rather than migrating
towards one of the electrodes, the algae seems to be clumping together. This is not at all what I had expected, but it may be good enough.

I have ordered an Ion generator kit to use as a power supply instead of the Wimshurst Machine, so trials should continue.

---rsb
Ron Brown
12NOV2012

2 of 2 Photo(s)

Fourth_Try.jpg

second_try.JPG

#14569

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Date: Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:25 am
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting [2 Attachments]

aliendave2525

More info, this is a link to a PDF file about something along this discussuion:

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=9&ved=0CG8QFjAI&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.faradaytechnology.com%2FPDF%2520files%2FPublications%2FECS%25202012%2520-%2520ElectroConcentration%2520for%2520Dewatering.pdf&ei=P66hUKehAovPqQGBp4Ao&usg=AFQjCNHPdsxYfcfvu2IvRVnazj7lZE14vg

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2012 4:04 PM
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting [2 Attachments]

[Attachment(s) from Ron Brown included below]

Hello, All,

http://www.estudiosbiblicospeniel.org/sparks.htm

Today, I tried again, after restoring the long path and adding 1 teaspoon of baking soda to the algae culture. After 5 minutes, it looked like the attached "Fourth_try.jpg".

I have ordered an Ion generator kit to use as a power supply instead of the Wimshurst Machine, so trials should continue.

---rsb
Ron Brown
12NOV2012

2 of 2 Photo(s)

second_try.JPG

Fourth_Try.jpg

#14570

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Date: Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:28 am
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting [2 Attachments]

aliendave2525

Another link to some more info about something similar to this topic:

http://www.patentstorm.us/applications/20110003350/description.html

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2012 4:04 PM
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting [2 Attachments]

[Attachment(s) from Ron Brown included below]

Hello, All,

http://www.estudiosbiblicospeniel.org/sparks.htm

Today, I tried again, after restoring the long path and adding 1 teaspoon of baking soda to the algae culture. After 5 minutes, it looked like the attached "Fourth_try.jpg".

I have ordered an Ion generator kit to use as a power supply instead of the Wimshurst Machine, so trials should continue.

---rsb
Ron Brown
12NOV2012

2 of 2 Photo(s)

second_try.JPG

Fourth_Try.jpg

#14571

From: "David Sieg" <dsieg58@...>
Date: Tue Nov 13, 2012 3:56 am
Subject: RE: Electrostatic Harvesting [2 Attachments]

dsieg58

http://www.estudiosbiblicospeniel.org/sparks.htm

Ron,

How is this different from the electro-floatation (In the French press) technique you experimented with before? Are they basically the same? Or is there a major difference I’m not seeing?

Also, would it help to add some alum before the electrical charge? Would that help in clumping them together?

Good work, and thanks for sharing.

David Sieg

From: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com [mailto:oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ron Brown
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2012 6:04 PM
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting [2 Attachments]

[Attachment(s) from Ron Brown included below]

Hello, All,

Today, I tried again, after restoring the long path and adding 1 teaspoon of baking soda to the algae culture. After 5 minutes, it looked like the attached "Fourth_try.jpg".

I have ordered an Ion generator kit to use as a power supply instead of the Wimshurst Machine, so trials should continue.

---rsb
Ron Brown
12NOV2012

#14572

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
Date: Tue Nov 13, 2012 5:38 pm
Subject: RE: Electrostatic Harvesting

potrzebie44

--- On Mon, 11/12/12, David Sieg <dsieg58@...> wrote:

From: David Sieg <dsieg58@...>
Subject: RE: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, November 12, 2012, 7:56 PM

David,

>>How is this different from the electro-floatation (In the French press) technique you experimented with before? Are they basically the same? Or is there a major difference I’m not seeing?

      Yes. There is a difference. Before, I was using more amperage and less volts. This caused water to break down into hydrogen and oxygen, and one of the electrodes would turn into rust before my eyes. Now, I am using a lot of voltage, but hardly any amperage. Now, there are hardly any bubbles, but the algae are clumping together, and both electrodes are like new.

>>Also, would it help to add some alum before the electrical charge? Would that help in clumping them together?

     Well, adding alum would certainly cause clumping. That's what it does. But, part of the reason for doing this is to see if the alum could be eliminated.

>>Good work, and thanks for sharing.
      Thank you for the kind words. It is a pleasure to be of service.

---rsb
Ron Brown
13NOV2012
David Sieg

From: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com [mailto:oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ron Brown
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2012 6:04 PM
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting [2 Attachments]

[Attachment(s) from Ron Brown included below]

Hello, All,

>>I am not sure if you had it wired right for this type of generator.

     No, I had it wired wrong. Instead of building up a charge in the Leiden Jars, everything that was generated was constantly leakled away, but I was able to fix it. I used the same container for the algae culture, and the same electrodes, but I routed the wires from the electrodes to the back of a styrofoam board into which I had cut two holes that were aligned with the Leiden Jars' terminals. By tilting the board back and forth, I was able to discharge the Leiden jars repeatedly through the algae culture.

     Here is a view of what that looked like:

          http://www.estudiosbiblicospeniel.org/sparks.htm

     The attached "Second_try.jpg" shows how the algae looked afterwards.
I did not see any separation taking place, but it is obvious that something changed.
Also, I did not experience any atomization of the water or explosions.
(After reading the water cannon stuff, I wasn't entirely sure what to expect.)
So, I would count this as progress.

     Yesterday, I tested it, again. I bent the electrodes so there was only about 1/4" gap between them, and ran the generator for 30 minutes. Since it was sparking once a second, I delivered 1800 pulses of microamp, kilovolt current through the algae culture. I did not see any change in the algae culture.

     Today, I tried again, after restoring the long path and adding 1 teaspoon of baking soda to the algae culture. After 5 minutes, it looked like the attached "Fourth_try.jpg".

     It did not work the first time, because I wired it wrong. The second time, the algae were seen to clump together. The third time, my error was to shorten the path through the algae culture, thinking thatthe longer path was a hindrance. The fourth time, it seemed to be working the same way as the second time. Rather than migrating
towards one of the electrodes, the algae seems to be clumping together. This is not at all what I had expected, but it may be good enough.

     I have ordered an Ion generator kit to use as a power supply instead of the Wimshurst Machine, so trials should continue.

---rsb
Ron Brown
12NOV2012

#14573

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
Date: Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:59 am
Subject: Electrostatic Harvesting

potrzebie44

Hello, All.

I ordered an Ion Generator Kit from Alltronics.com for $18.95. The kit was very well laid out, one feature being that it can be set up either as a negative or positive Ion Generator. I chose to set it up as a positive ion generator. It is based on the Cockroft-Walton circuit, and uses 30 diodes and 30 capacitors, as well as a handful of resistors. It took me a couple of days to populate the board. The attached "Front.jpg" and "Back.jpg" show how it turned out. I hooked it up to the terminals in what's left of my French Press coffeemaker, and turned it on for a half-hour. The attached "Electrostatics.gif" is a time-lapse record of fifteen of these minutes. One exposure was made every thirty seconds. Although the moving shadows of my fence attest to the passage of time, I could not see any migration of the algae. Niether was there any evidence of clumping. The neon lingt on board remained lit for the entire time, and while packing things up, (after disconnectting it from the mains) the device gave me a minor shock. So, it seems that the device was functioning property. I'm not sure where to go from here.

---rsb

Ron Brown

21NOV2012

3 of 3 Photo(s)

front.JPG

back.JPG

electrostatics.gif

#14574

From: mrinnovation@...
Date: Thu Nov 22, 2012 3:49 am
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting [3 Attachments]

zenseeker70

You are most likely going to need pulsed capacitor discharge in the 10-20 Joule
range in order to break cells. Not sure about what it would take for clumping.
Thankfully this is as simple to build as the multiplier unit.

Tad

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Brown" <potrzebie44@...>
To: "oil from algae" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 6:59:12 PM
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting [3 Attachments]

[ Attachment(s) from Ron Brown included below]

Hello, All.

I ordered an Ion Generator Kit from Alltronics.com for $18.95. The kit was very
well laid out, one feature being that it can be set up either as a negative or
positive Ion Generator. I chose to set it up as a positive ion generator. It is
based on the Cockroft-Walton circuit, and uses 30 diodes and 30 capacitors, as
well as a handful of resistors. It took me a couple of days to populate the
board. The attached "Front.jpg" and "Back.jpg" show how it turned out. I hooked
it up to the terminals in what's left of my French Press coffeemaker, and turned
it on for a half-hour. The attached "Electrostatics.gif" is a time-lapse record
of fifteen of these minutes. One exposure was made every thirty seconds.
Although the moving shadows of my fence attest to the passage of time, I could
not see any migration of the algae. Niether was there any evidence of clumping.
The neon lingt on board remained lit for the entire time, and while packing
things up, (after disconnectting it from the mains) the device gave me a minor
shock. So, it seems that the device was functioning property. I'm not sure where
to go from here.

---rsb
Ron Brown
21NOV2012

#14575

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Date: Thu Nov 22, 2012 5:50 am
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting [3 Attachments]

aliendave2525

Did you put 2 leads in or just one, if 2 leads then maybe it shorted out and did not make any ions, I would do the high voltage 1 lead only that has the meg ohm resistors, the high voltage itself will product ions by stripping electrons away from the air or other conductiver or semi conductive material, the other lead completes the circuit through the environment. Just and idea.

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 5:59 PM
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting [3 Attachments]

[Attachment(s) from Ron Brown included below]

Hello, All.

---rsb

Ron Brown

21NOV2012

3 of 3 Photo(s)

front.JPG

back.JPG

electrostatics.gif

#14576

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
Date: Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:50 am
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting

potrzebie44

--- On Wed, 11/21/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Wednesday, November 21, 2012, 9:50 PM

>>Did you put 2 leads in or just one, if 2 leads then maybe it shorted out and did not make any ions, I would do the high voltage 1 lead only that has the meg ohm resistors, the high voltage itself will product ions by stripping electrons away from the air or other conductiver or semi conductive material, the other lead completes the circuit through the environment. Just and idea.

     Yes, I used two leads. One was attached to the pin farm, and the other went to ground.   This was the recommendation of the water cannon guys, who suggested the use of an ion generator as an electrostatic power supply.

---rsb

Ron Brown

21NOV2012

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 5:59 PM
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting [3 Attachments]

[Attachment(s) from Ron Brown included below]

     Hello, All.

     I ordered an Ion Generator Kit from Alltronics.com for $18.95. The kit was very well laid out, one feature being that it can be set up either as a negative or positive Ion Generator. I chose to set it up as a positive ion generator. It is based on the Cockroft-Walton circuit, and uses 30 diodes and 30 capacitors, as well as a handful of resistors. It took me a couple of days to populate the board. The attached "Front.jpg" and "Back.jpg" show how it turned out. I hooked it up to the terminals in what's left of my French Press coffeemaker, and turned it on for a half-hour. The attached "Electrostatics.gif" is a time-lapse record of fifteen of these minutes. One exposure was made every thirty seconds. Although the moving shadows of my fence attest to the passage of time, I could not see any migration of the algae. Niether was there any evidence of clumping. The neon lingt on board remained lit for the entire time, and while packing things up, (after disconnectting it from the mains) the device gave me a minor shock. So, it seems that the device was functioning property. I'm not sure where to go from here.

---rsb

Ron Brown

21NOV2012

Attachment(s) from Ron Brown

3 of 3 Photo(s)

front.JPG

back.JPG

electrostatics.gif

#14577

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Date: Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:26 pm
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting

aliendave2525

I see, so were both leads in contact with the liquid? If so the it was shotring out.

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 10:50 PM
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting

--- On Wed, 11/21/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Wednesday, November 21, 2012, 9:50 PM

>>Did you put 2 leads in or just one, if 2 leads then maybe it shorted out and did not make any ions, I would do the high voltage 1 lead only that has the meg ohm resistors, the high voltage itself will product ions by stripping electrons away from the air or other conductiver or semi conductive material, the other lead completes the circuit through the environment. Just and idea.

     Yes, I used two leads. One was attached to the pin farm, and the other went to ground.   This was the recommendation of the water cannon guys, who suggested the use of an ion generator as an electrostatic power supply.

---rsb

Ron Brown

21NOV2012

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 5:59 PM
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting [3 Attachments]

[Attachment(s) from Ron Brown included below]

     Hello, All.

     I ordered an Ion Generator Kit from Alltronics.com for $18.95. The kit was very well laid out, one feature being that it can be set up either as a negative or positive Ion Generator. I chose to set it up as a positive ion generator. It is based on the Cockroft-Walton circuit, and uses 30 diodes and 30 capacitors, as well as a handful of resistors. It took me a couple of days to populate the board. The attached "Front.jpg" and "Back.jpg" show how it turned out. I hooked it up to the terminals in what's left of my French Press coffeemaker, and turned it on for a half-hour. The attached "Electrostatics.gif" is a time-lapse record of fifteen of these minutes. One exposure was made every thirty seconds. Although the moving shadows of my fence attest to the passage of time, I could not see any migration of the algae. Niether was there any evidence of clumping. The neon lingt on board remained lit for the entire time, and while packing things up, (after disconnectting it from the mains) the device gave me a minor shock. So, it seems that the device was functioning property. I'm not sure where to go from here.

---rsb

Ron Brown

21NOV2012

Attachment(s) from Ron Brown

3 of 3 Photo(s)

front.JPG

back.JPG

electrostatics.gif

#14578

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
Date: Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:59 pm
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting

potrzebie44

d-i-y-250-kv-high-voltage-.pdf

--- On Thu, 11/22/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, November 22, 2012, 6:26 AM

Dave,

>>I see, so were both leads in contact with the liquid? If so the it was >>shotring out.

     OK. The pin farm output was connected to one of the terminals, and the ground wire was connected to the other. Both were in the liquid.

     Here is a quote from the article:

"The circular black foam disk is the NEGATIVE power supply terminal. The other terminal, the

POSITIVE one, is invisibly connected to ground through the AC cord."

     I had to look it up to make sure I wasn't making this up.

     What you suggest is really counter-intuitive, but I will try it.

     I have attached a .PDF that relates to the issue, as well.

---rsb

Ron Brown

22NOV2012

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 10:50 PM
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting

--- On Wed, 11/21/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Wednesday, November 21, 2012, 9:50 PM

>>Did you put 2 leads in or just one, if 2 leads then maybe it shorted out and did not make any ions, I would do the high voltage 1 lead only that has the meg ohm resistors, the high voltage itself will product ions by stripping electrons away from the air or other conductiver or semi conductive material, the other lead completes the circuit through the environment. Just and idea.

     Yes, I used two leads. One was attached to the pin farm, and the other went to ground.   This was the recommendation of the water cannon guys, who suggested the use of an ion generator as an electrostatic power supply.

---rsb

Ron Brown

21NOV2012

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 5:59 PM
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting [3 Attachments]

[Attachment(s) from Ron Brown included below]

     Hello, All.

     I ordered an Ion Generator Kit from Alltronics.com for $18.95. The kit was very well laid out, one feature being that it can be set up either as a negative or positive Ion Generator. I chose to set it up as a positive ion generator. It is based on the Cockroft-Walton circuit, and uses 30 diodes and 30 capacitors, as well as a handful of resistors. It took me a couple of days to populate the board. The attached "Front.jpg" and "Back.jpg" show how it turned out. I hooked it up to the terminals in what's left of my French Press coffeemaker, and turned it on for a half-hour. The attached "Electrostatics.gif" is a time-lapse record of fifteen of these minutes. One exposure was made every thirty seconds. Although the moving shadows of my fence attest to the passage of time, I could not see any migration of the algae. Niether was there any evidence of clumping. The neon lingt on board remained lit for the entire time, and while packing things up, (after disconnectting it from the mains) the device gave me a minor shock. So, it seems that the device was functioning property. I'm not sure where to go from here.

---rsb

Ron Brown

21NOV2012

Attachment(s) from Ron Brown

3 of 3 Photo(s)

front.JPG

back.JPG

electrostatics.gif

1 of 1 File(s)

#14579

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Date: Thu Nov 22, 2012 7:13 pm
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting [1 Attachment]

aliendave2525

Keep in mind that the water is probably around 750 ohms and that HV device probably has 3.3Meg ohms x 3

Ref voltage divider calculation: http://www.raltron.com/cust/tools/voltage_divider.asp

V = 3000

R1 = 9900000

R2 = 750

= .227 volts on the water.

Oh that is what you are doing, then per that pdf document that is in a capacitive reaction in a vaccum.

Per that being applied to what you are testing out, then you want the 2 leads attached to 2 isolated and flat metal areas not in contact with the water. Also preferably having the water in a square container and in such configuration that the flat metal areas are close together but far enough to part so the voltage does not spark across the distance between the flat metal areas.

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2012 8:59 AM
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting [1 Attachment]

[Attachment(s) from Ron Brown included below]

--- On Thu, 11/22/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, November 22, 2012, 6:26 AM

Dave,

>>I see, so were both leads in contact with the liquid? If so the it was >>shotring out.

     OK. The pin farm output was connected to one of the terminals, and the ground wire was connected to the other. Both were in the liquid.

     Here is a quote from the article:

"The circular black foam disk is the NEGATIVE power supply terminal. The other terminal, the

POSITIVE one, is invisibly connected to ground through the AC cord."

     I had to look it up to make sure I wasn't making this up.

     What you suggest is really counter-intuitive, but I will try it.

     I have attached a .PDF that relates to the issue, as well.

---rsb

Ron Brown

22NOV2012

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 10:50 PM
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting

--- On Wed, 11/21/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Wednesday, November 21, 2012, 9:50 PM

>>Did you put 2 leads in or just one, if 2 leads then maybe it shorted out and did not make any ions, I would do the high voltage 1 lead only that has the meg ohm resistors, the high voltage itself will product ions by stripping electrons away from the air or other conductiver or semi conductive material, the other lead completes the circuit through the environment. Just and idea.

     Yes, I used two leads. One was attached to the pin farm, and the other went to ground.   This was the recommendation of the water cannon guys, who suggested the use of an ion generator as an electrostatic power supply.

---rsb

Ron Brown

21NOV2012

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 5:59 PM
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting [3 Attachments]

[Attachment(s) from Ron Brown included below]

     Hello, All.

     I ordered an Ion Generator Kit from Alltronics.com for $18.95. The kit was very well laid out, one feature being that it can be set up either as a negative or positive Ion Generator. I chose to set it up as a positive ion generator. It is based on the Cockroft-Walton circuit, and uses 30 diodes and 30 capacitors, as well as a handful of resistors. It took me a couple of days to populate the board. The attached "Front.jpg" and "Back.jpg" show how it turned out. I hooked it up to the terminals in what's left of my French Press coffeemaker, and turned it on for a half-hour. The attached "Electrostatics.gif" is a time-lapse record of fifteen of these minutes. One exposure was made every thirty seconds. Although the moving shadows of my fence attest to the passage of time, I could not see any migration of the algae. Niether was there any evidence of clumping. The neon lingt on board remained lit for the entire time, and while packing things up, (after disconnectting it from the mains) the device gave me a minor shock. So, it seems that the device was functioning property. I'm not sure where to go from here.

---rsb

Ron Brown

21NOV2012

Attachment(s) from Ron Brown

3 of 3 Photo(s)

front.JPG

back.JPG

electrostatics.gif

d-i-y-250-kv-high-voltage-.pdf

1 of 1 File(s)

#14580

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
Date: Thu Nov 22, 2012 9:21 pm
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting

potrzebie44

--- On Thu, 11/22/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, November 22, 2012, 11:13 AM

Dave,

>>...you want the 2 leads attached to 2 isolated and flat metal areas not in contact with the water.

     I don't understand how that could possibly work. How does the electricity get into the water if the terminals do not contact the wwater? The Wimshurst Machine gave me some promising results when I routed its sparks through the water.

     I tried it with the pin farm output connected to one of the terminals, and the other one disconnected. Nothing at all happened, except the neon light stayed on.

     Maybe I should go back to making sparks...

---rsb

Ron Brown

22NOV2012

#14581

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 1:42 am
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting

aliendave2525

the neon light going out means it was shorted.

Yes going back to spark gap will put the HV on the water. You can use the ion generator with a small spark gap, when the charge reached air gap break down potential it will spark to cross the gap.

The force in the PDF doc was not a current it was the charge force, similar to magnetic field lines.

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2012 1:21 PM
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting

--- On Thu, 11/22/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, November 22, 2012, 11:13 AM

Dave,

>>...you want the 2 leads attached to 2 isolated and flat metal areas not in contact with the water.

     I don't understand how that could possibly work. How does the electricity get into the water if the terminals do not contact the wwater? The Wimshurst Machine gave me some promising results when I routed its sparks through the water.

     I tried it with the pin farm output connected to one of the terminals, and the other one disconnected. Nothing at all happened, except the neon light stayed on.

     Maybe I should go back to making sparks...

---rsb

Ron Brown

22NOV2012

#14582

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 2:21 am
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting

potrzebie44

--- On Thu, 11/22/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, November 22, 2012, 5:42 PM

Dave,

>>the neon light going out means it was shorted.

     Yes, that is what it would mean, but it hasn't gone out. It's all clear to me, now. I made the same wiring mistake this tim as I did with the Wimshurst Machine. Rather than discharging in a spark, tghe charge kept dribbling away.

>>Yes going back to spark gap will put the HV on the water. You can use the ion generator with a small spark gap, when the charge reached air gap break down potential it will spark to cross the gap.

     OK, that's the key! I need to make another spark distributor.

>>The force in the PDF doc was not a current it was the charge force, similar to magnetic field lines.

     It just gets curioser and curiouser, doesn't it?

---rsb

Ron Brown

22NOV2012

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2012 1:21 PM
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting

--- On Thu, 11/22/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, November 22, 2012, 11:13 AM

Dave,

>>...you want the 2 leads attached to 2 isolated and flat metal areas not in contact with the water.

     I don't understand how that could possibly work. How does the electricity get into the water if the terminals do not contact the wwater? The Wimshurst Machine gave me some promising results when I routed its sparks through the water.

     I tried it with the pin farm output connected to one of the terminals, and the other one disconnected. Nothing at all happened, except the neon light stayed on.

     Maybe I should go back to making sparks...

---rsb

Ron Brown

22NOV2012

#14583

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 2:52 am
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting

aliendave2525

nothing fancy for the spark gap, an old spark plug will do fine.

or just 2 wires 1/8" a part.

that ion generator will jump 1/8" to maybe 1/4" gap.

you can also take the output off the 1st output resistor on the side to the 2nd resistor that will give you more current as well.

the other 2 resistors are mainly for safety, the 1st resistor after the capacitor network is mainly to save the diodes from over current and human electric shock otherwise it would be like sticking a fork in a wall outlet.

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2012 6:21 PM
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting

--- On Thu, 11/22/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, November 22, 2012, 5:42 PM

Dave,

>>the neon light going out means it was shorted.

     Yes, that is what it would mean, but it hasn't gone out. It's all clear to me, now. I made the same wiring mistake this tim as I did with the Wimshurst Machine. Rather than discharging in a spark, tghe charge kept dribbling away.

>>Yes going back to spark gap will put the HV on the water. You can use the ion generator with a small spark gap, when the charge reached air gap break down potential it will spark to cross the gap.

     OK, that's the key! I need to make another spark distributor.

>>The force in the PDF doc was not a current it was the charge force, similar to magnetic field lines.

     It just gets curioser and curiouser, doesn't it?

---rsb

Ron Brown

22NOV2012

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2012 1:21 PM
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting

--- On Thu, 11/22/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, November 22, 2012, 11:13 AM

Dave,

>>...you want the 2 leads attached to 2 isolated and flat metal areas not in contact with the water.

     I don't understand how that could possibly work. How does the electricity get into the water if the terminals do not contact the wwater? The Wimshurst Machine gave me some promising results when I routed its sparks through the water.

     I tried it with the pin farm output connected to one of the terminals, and the other one disconnected. Nothing at all happened, except the neon light stayed on.

     Maybe I should go back to making sparks...

---rsb

Ron Brown

22NOV2012

#14584

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 3:32 am
Subject: Re: Electrostatic Harvesting

aliendave2525

This is something similar to what I was suggestion:

http://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/2011/10/17/essential-guide-to-the-eu-chapter-2/candle_flame_plasma_in_e-field_450x337/

Think of an electrical capacitor where there are two separated, oppositely charged plates or layers, similar to the two charged plates “B” in the diagram above. There will be an electric field between the layers. Any charged particle moving or placed between the layers will be accelerated towards the oppositely charged layer. Electrons (which are negatively charged) accelerate toward the positively charged layer, and positive ions and protons toward the negatively charged layer.

According to Newton’s Laws, force results in acceleration. Therefore electric fields will result in charged particles’ acquiring velocity. Oppositely charged particles will move in opposite directions. An electric current is, by definition, movement of charge past a point. Electric fields therefore cause electric currents by giving charged particles a velocity.

If an electric field is strong enough, then charged particles will be accelerated to very high velocities by the field

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2012 6:21 PM
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting

--- On Thu, 11/22/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, November 22, 2012, 5:42 PM

Dave,

>>the neon light going out means it was shorted.

     Yes, that is what it would mean, but it hasn't gone out. It's all clear to me, now. I made the same wiring mistake this tim as I did with the Wimshurst Machine. Rather than discharging in a spark, tghe charge kept dribbling away.

>>Yes going back to spark gap will put the HV on the water. You can use the ion generator with a small spark gap, when the charge reached air gap break down potential it will spark to cross the gap.

     OK, that's the key! I need to make another spark distributor.

>>The force in the PDF doc was not a current it was the charge force, similar to magnetic field lines.

     It just gets curioser and curiouser, doesn't it?

---rsb

Ron Brown

22NOV2012

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2012 1:21 PM
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting

--- On Thu, 11/22/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] Electrostatic Harvesting
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, November 22, 2012, 11:13 AM

Dave,

>>...you want the 2 leads attached to 2 isolated and flat metal areas not in contact with the water.

     I don't understand how that could possibly work. How does the electricity get into the water if the terminals do not contact the wwater? The Wimshurst Machine gave me some promising results when I routed its sparks through the water.

     I tried it with the pin farm output connected to one of the terminals, and the other one disconnected. Nothing at all happened, except the neon light stayed on.

     Maybe I should go back to making sparks...

---rsb

Ron Brown

22NOV2012

#14585

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Date: Sat Nov 24, 2012 3:40 am
Subject: Some good information about a technique to measure algae density

aliendave2525

This link has some good information about a technique to measure algae density

http://www.biotek.com/resources/articles/monitoring-of-algal-growth-using-intrinsic-properties.html

#14586

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
Date: Sat Nov 24, 2012 6:07 pm
Subject: Re: technique to measure algae density

potrzebie44

--- On Fri, 11/23/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Some good information about a technique to measure algae density
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Friday, November 23, 2012, 7:40 PM

Dave,

>>This link has some good information about a technique to measure algae >>density

Yes, that was a good article. Of course, using a hemocytometer is the gold standard for determining cell density. The approaches used in the article are somewhat quicker and easier. The approach I use is the following:

I take a 244.5 ml sample of algae culture and weigh it on an OHAUS triple-beam balance scale. The difference in the weight, when compared to distilled water is grams per sample of suspended solids. I divide this by 244.5 to get grams per milliliter, then multiply by 1000 to get grams per liter. This measurement tells me nothing about the composition of the suspended solids, but gives me a good idea of how heavy they are. My assumption has been that most of the added weight comes from the algae.

I realize that this is not 100% accurate, but it has been close enough for daily operations. Having a close approximation of algae density, in grams per liter, is very useful.

---rsb

Ron Brown

24NOV2012

#14587

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Date: Sat Nov 24, 2012 11:23 pm
Subject: Re: technique to measure algae density

aliendave2525

In that article for some of us that might be something for DIY'er to build for themselves to monitor real time the growth rates having a continuous loop in and out through the device in a dark container.

Basically if apears by doing a short 400nm UV LED pulse the algae will then emit a fluorescence in the red spectrum around 600nm then by having a photosensor with a UV blocker or 600nm passthrough filter the level of fluorescence detected would relate to the density of algae better then other light scattering techniques and not be interfered by other things that may have light scatter effects in the solution.

I might try to build that in the future some day and have it wired to my dream algae process controller using the arduino MCU along with the TEN's unit and other stuff.

If anyone is interested just to share here are some parts I found at lowest cost I can find to get for doing some stuff like that:

Parts List:

Low cost - UV LEDs (10 for $3.00):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-5mm-2-Pin-UV-Purple-LED-Light-Lamp-Bright-5000-Mcd-/130796305679?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e74113d0f

Low cost - Optical glass led lens (for solution and electronics isolation) (2 for $2.95):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-pc-High-Power-LED-18mm-convex-lens-optical-glass-led-lens-/170868821608?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27c8934e68

To reduce lens cleaning from solution deposit build up over time, I plan to design the device so that the solution does not make contact with it. Where as one port the light shine down on it with an air gap in between and another port with an air gap in between for the photosensor looking down to pick up the fluorescence emission.

Low cost - Digital Light intensity Sensor Module For AVR Arduino ($4.47):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/370683780557?ssPageName=STRK:MESINDXX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1436.l2649

Can also use in another application to measure amount of light for the algae is exposed to.

Low cost - UV filter for Light intensity Sensor (for 2 but only need one $1.78):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2pcs-3-6-Inch-LCD-Screen-UV-Protector-Film-Cover-Guard-for-Apple-iPhone-4-4G-4th-/120832503414?pt=PDA_Accessories&hash=item1c222dae76

Will cut out a piece from that for what is needed.

Another option instead could be to use this:

Color Recognition Sensor Detector Module For Arduino (maybe use as is or change out the white LEDs to UV LEDs and add a UV filter to the photosensor) ($6.68):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/TCS230-TCS3200-Color-Recognition-Sensor-Detector-Module-For-MCU-Arduino-3V-5V-/280934574743?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4169016a97

Low cost - Arduino (clone - Funduino Mega 2560) ($17.83):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/251143019741?ssPageName=STRK:MESINDXX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1436.l2649

I plan to program that to be an I/O slave and use a RS232 port with it to an old PC/Laptop using FreeDOS7 and simple serial COM I/O functions for the main software to read and write data to and from it and control devices and display monitor. This way I not have to keep changing and adjusting the Arduino software as I experiement so I can do it quicker with the old PC/Laptop.

Low cost - RS232 module for Arduino ($2.35):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/181006995656?ssPageName=STRK:MESINDXX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1436.l2649

If using a newer PC with USB ports then do not need this part. I just want to put some old PC/laptops to good use, and the old stuff uses less energy, so that is why I am using old stuff.

Of course the device containment will need to be darkness, so possibly will also use some black tubing in a short coil shape on inlet and outlet to reduce any outside light, along with a small recirculation pump in and out of the grow system.

Some other goodies to add to my dream algae process controller are:

Monitor Temperature - Contactless Infrared Temperature Measurement Module for arduino ($18.85):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/TMP006-Contactless-Infrared-Temperature-Measurement-Module-for-arduino-MLX90614-/110897073299?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19d1fb0c93

Monitor Temperature - Waterproof Temperature Measurement Module for arduino ($9.90):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261121636566?ssPageName=STRK:MESINDXX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1436.l2649

Control Other Devices - 8 Channel Relay Module Board for Arduino ($8.84):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/270984095956?ssPageName=STRK:MESINDXX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1436.l2649

Control Other Devices - 16 Channel Relay Module Board for Arduino ($22.45):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-16-Channel-12V-Relay-Module-Interface-Board-For-Arduino-PIC-ARM-DSP-PLC-/170745300786?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27c1368732

Control Other Devices - 8 Channel OMRON SSR G3MB-202P Solid State Relay Module For Arduino ($22.99)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1pcs-250V-2A-8-Channel-OMRON-SSR-G3MB-202P-Solid-State-Relay-Module-For-Arduino-/300820514677?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item460a4cc775

Control Other Devices - MOSFET Switch Module for Arduino (to control another device as a PWM for H2 O2 electrolsys for easy algae water seperation device) ($21.99):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261125619383?ssPageName=STRK:MESINDXX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1436.l2649

Additionally for this application needs a 1.25-3.5 volt power supply or DC-DC step down converter for improved energy efficiency that can handle the desired current.

For home use since H2 O2 electrolsys is too dangerousfor this stage, I am trying to figure out another very cheap easy algae water seperation, that is being work on.

I am not sure yet, but if this module can handle frequencies around 200-300Khz then another one can be used for algae cracking.

For home use since H2 O2 electrolsys is too dangerous for this stage, I am trying to figure out another very cheap easy algae water seperation, that is being work on.

Also can use for other custom devices that a relay is not the right thing for some device, such as pulsed LED controlling.

Control Other Devices - Ultrasonic Distance Range Sensor Module For Arduino (for tank fill level controlling) ($8.69).

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SRF-06-Ultrasonic-Distance-Range-Sensor-Module-For-Arduino-/150933208581?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item232451fe05

Control Other Devices - H-bridge Stepper Motor Dual DC motor Driver Controller Board for Arduino (with a few extra parts this can be the signal driver for the TENs unit application on algae for increased growth rate) ($4.28):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/L9110S-H-bridge-Stepper-Motor-Dual-DC-motor-Driver-Controller-Board-for-Arduino-/181029766482?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a26370552

Control Other Devices - Signal Generator Module 0-40MHz 2 Sine Wave And 2 Square Wave Output (for algae resonance cracking, or other devices using frequency signals) ($5.34):
http://www.ebay.com/itm/AD9850-DDS-Signal-Generator-Module-0-40MHz-2-Sine-Wave-And-2-Square-Wave-Output-/170910337597?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27cb0cca3d

Monitor pH - pH Circuit (Sensor for Arduino, pH electrode and pH connector not included) ($28.00):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/pH-Circuit-Sensor-for-Arduino-/200779624796?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ebf65f15c

Full kit here with probe and calibration material ($112.45):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/pH-Kit-Sensor-for-Arduino-Solutions-Circuit-and-Sensor-/190693458379?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c663741cb

Monitor pH - Arduino pH Transmitter (pH electrode not included) ($32.65):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Arduino-pH-Transmitter-/130807777683?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e74c04993

Monitor Flow Rate - FLO-30 Flow Meter Circuit (I high quality sensor circuit for Arduino, Flow sensor not included) ($29.50):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/FLO-30-Flow-Meter-Circuit-Sensor-for-Arduino-/200794176400?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ec043fb90

Full kits here:

Small flow kit ($149.45):

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200794171170&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT#ht_1320wt_900

Medium flow kit ($168.45):

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190704330975&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT#ht_1320wt_900

Large flow kit ($256.45):

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190704329954&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT#ht_1320wt_900

If not need the high quaility but a general idea of the flow one can do a simple DIY pulse count circuit and there are some cheaper lower quality flow rate sensors out there.

Monitor Conductivity - Conductivity Circuit (Sensor for Arduino, Conductivity probe not included) ($50.50):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Conductivity-Circuit-Sensor-for-Arduino-/200779531430?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ebf6484a6

Full kit here with probe and calibration material ($166.45):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Conductivity-Kit-Sensor-for-Arduino-Solutions-Circuit-and-Sensor-/200779540715?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ebf64a8eb

If not need the high quaility but a general idea of the Conductivity one can do a simple DIY conductivity circuit.

There are a lot of digital and analog ports so one can add in lots of other gadgets. However too many gadgets that may need high processing usage communication bandwith then they may slow down the ability for the MCU to keep up. So if that happens will have to use a 2nd or 3rd MPU on another COM/USB port.

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, November 24, 2012 10:07 AM
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] technique to measure algae density

--- On Fri, 11/23/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Some good information about a technique to measure algae density
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Friday, November 23, 2012, 7:40 PM

Dave,

>>This link has some good information about a technique to measure algae >>density

Yes, that was a good article. Of course, using a hemocytometer is the gold standard for determining cell density. The approaches used in the article are somewhat quicker and easier. The approach I use is the following:

I take a 244.5 ml sample of algae culture and weigh it on an OHAUS triple-beam balance scale. The difference in the weight, when compared to distilled water is grams per sample of suspended solids. I divide this by 244.5 to get grams per milliliter, then multiply by 1000 to get grams per liter. This measurement tells me nothing about the composition of the suspended solids, but gives me a good idea of how heavy they are. My assumption has been that most of the added weight comes from the algae.

I realize that this is not 100% accurate, but it has been close enough for daily operations. Having a close approximation of algae density, in grams per liter, is very useful.

---rsb

Ron Brown

24NOV2012

#14588

From: "Mitchell Heldt" <mitch@...>
Date: Sun Nov 25, 2012 6:12 am
Subject: RE: technique to measure algae density

snorky2k

Would a ping pong ball with a dab of wax and lines drawn on it work? Would the after density of the water drop as the percentage of algae increases? If so wouldn’t the ping pong ball drop proportionally? The ball could be rinsed after measuring to prevent slime build-up.

From: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com [mailto:oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ron Brown
Sent: Saturday, November 24, 2012 12:08 PM
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] technique to measure algae density

--- On Fri, 11/23/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: [oil_from_algae] Some good information about a technique to measure algae density
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Friday, November 23, 2012, 7:40 PM

Dave,

>>This link has some good information about a technique to measure algae >>density

Yes, that was a good article. Of course, using a hemocytometer is the gold standard for determining cell density. The approaches used in the article are somewhat quicker and easier. The approach I use is the following:

I take a 244.5 ml sample of algae culture and weigh it on an OHAUS triple-beam balance scale. The difference in the weight, when compared to distilled water is grams per sample of suspended solids. I divide this by 244.5 to get grams per milliliter, then multiply by 1000 to get grams per liter. This measurement tells me nothing about the composition of the suspended solids, but gives me a good idea of how heavy they are. My assumption has been that most of the added weight comes from the algae.

I realize that this is not 100% accurate, but it has been close enough for daily operations. Having a close approximation of algae density, in grams per liter, is very useful.

---rsb

Ron Brown

24NOV2012

#14589

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
Date: Sun Nov 25, 2012 7:32 pm
Subject: RE: technique to measure algae density

potrzebie44

--- On Sat, 11/24/12, Mitchell Heldt <mitch@...> wrote:

From: Mitchell Heldt <mitch@...>
Subject: RE: [oil_from_algae] technique to measure algae density
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, November 24, 2012, 10:12 PM

Mitchell,

>>Would a ping pong ball with a dab of wax and lines drawn on it work? Would the after density of the water drop as the percentage of algae increases? If so wouldn’t the ping pong ball drop proportionally?

     What you describe sounds a lot like a battery hydrometer to me.

You are proposing that we use specific gravity to measure the density of algae culture. Specific gravity is the ratio of the density of a substance to the density of a reference substance.

     Yes, this should work. It is quick cheap, easy, but I'm not sure how useful it would be. Specific gravity is dimensionless. The main benefit of my weighing procedure is that it gives results in grams per liter, allowing me to calculate the total weight of algae in a batch. Armed with this figure, I can know how much alum to add to flocculate it.

     There _may_ be a way to relate the dimensionless specific gravity to cell counts. I will think about it.

---rsb

Ron Brown

25NOV2012

#14590

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Date: Sun Nov 25, 2012 9:13 pm
Subject: Re: technique to measure algae density

aliendave2525

I would think the fertilizer and salts in the algae system would vary the measurement too much, but if those other factors are known then some interpitation may be able to be made.

Here is link to a cheap Hydrometer Specific Gravity if somone wants to try that out:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fish-Pond-Aquaculture-Hydrometer-Specific-Gravity-Marine-seawater-Aquarium-bxj-/321015782895?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4abe081def

But the cost is so close to the light scattering way plus I do want a PC intereface so I can log data and control things in real time automatically, for the end goal to be for an automated simple to use and cost effective home algae to bio-fuel system.

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2012 11:32 AM
Subject: RE: [oil_from_algae] technique to measure algae density

--- On Sat, 11/24/12, Mitchell Heldt <mitch@...> wrote:

From: Mitchell Heldt <mitch@...>
Subject: RE: [oil_from_algae] technique to measure algae density
To: oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, November 24, 2012, 10:12 PM

Mitchell,

>>Would a ping pong ball with a dab of wax and lines drawn on it work? Would the after density of the water drop as the percentage of algae increases? If so wouldn’t the ping pong ball drop proportionally?

     What you describe sounds a lot like a battery hydrometer to me.

You are proposing that we use specific gravity to measure the density of algae culture. Specific gravity is the ratio of the density of a substance to the density of a reference substance.

     Yes, this should work. It is quick cheap, easy, but I'm not sure how useful it would be. Specific gravity is dimensionless. The main benefit of my weighing procedure is that it gives results in grams per liter, allowing me to calculate the total weight of algae in a batch. Armed with this figure, I can know how much alum to add to flocculate it.

     There _may_ be a way to relate the dimensionless specific gravity to cell counts. I will think about it.

---rsb

Ron Brown

25NOV2012

#14591

From: Ron Brown <potrzebie44@...>
Date: Mon Nov 26, 2012 7:17 pm
Subject: Re: technique to measure algae density

potrzebie44

--- On Sat, 11/24/12, aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...> wrote:

From: aliendave2525 <aliendave2525@...>
Subject: Re: [oil_from_algae] technique to measure algae density
To: "oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com" <oil_from_algae@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Saturday, November 24, 2012, 3:23 PM

Dave,

>>In that article for some of us that might be something for DIY'er to build for themselves to monitor real time the growth rates having a continuous loop in and out through the device in a dark container.

Basically if apears by doing a short 400nm UV LED pulse the algae will then emit a fluorescence in the red spectrum around 600nm then by having a photosensor with a UV blocker or 600nm passthrough filter the level of fluorescence detected would relate to the density of algae better then other light scattering techniques and not be interfered by other things that may have light scatter effects in the solution.

This design has a big advantage over others: It promises to ber quite accurate.

>>I might try to build that in the future some day and have it wired to my dream algae process controller using the arduino MCU along with the TEN's unit and other stuff.

You know, that has prospects for becoming a sucessful product. If Backyard Biomass takes off the way I expect it to, there will be 100,000 people clamoring for a data logger/process controller. You have an instant advantage, too, since such applications constitute an area of strength for you.

---rsb

Ron Brown
26NOV2012