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#589 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Mon Nov 16, 2009 2:10 pm
Subject: Re: Re: Topic Requests and Wednesday's Meeting 		brian.donahue
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Argh! forgot the link, sorry for the double-post!

Map: http://is.gd/4OVGI



On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 9:09 AM, Brian Donahue <brian@...> wrote:
Hi Siva,

I marked this map with two lots I've seen down there, but I've also been told that street parking is not too difficult to come by at 6pm in that area.

See you then!

Brian




Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (4)
#588 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Mon Nov 16, 2009 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: Re: Topic Requests and Wednesday's Meeting 		brian.donahue
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
Hi Siva,

I marked this map with two lots I've seen down there, but I've also been told that street parking is not too difficult to come by at 6pm in that area.

See you then!

Brian

On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 12:57 PM, Siva <mateti@...> wrote:
Does anyone know about parking near this place?

-Siva

--- In phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com, Brian Donahue <brian@...> wrote:
>
> Hey folks,
>
> Thinking ahead to the next couple meetings, I wanted to remind everyone of
> our suggestion web site at
> *http://phillyaltnet.uservoice.com*<http://phillyaltnet.uservoice.com>.
> You can use that site to vote for topics you're interested in and suggest
> new ones if they aren't listed*.  You can do so anonymously, or register for
> free so we know who you are - either way, please let us know what you want
> to learn more about, it makes a huge difference in how we plan our events!
>
> Speaking of events - don't forget our next meeting on the concepts of
> functional programming is coming up on Wednesday.  Functional programming is
> an old concept that has been peaking again lately, and is something that all
> software developers should be familiar with, no matter what language you're
> using, but two very common languages that have functional programming
> capabilities are C# and javascript.  Our speaker, Aaron Feng, has a lot of
> experience in this area and will be talking about how a deeper understanding
> of FP has change the way he writes software.
>
> Details and free registration here:
> http://phillyaltnet-nov2009.eventbrite.com
>
> See you soon!
>
> Brian
>
> * The site can be a little confusing.  First, you type in the topic and hit
> "search" to see if there any similar topics already added.  If you see one
> that is similar, you can vote for it rather than create a duplicate.  If
> not, create a new one, add a description/comment, and add some votes to it.
> Save some votes to vote up other topics that you find interesting in the
> list!
>




------------------------------------

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Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (4)
#587 From: "Siva" <mateti@...>
Date: Sun Nov 15, 2009 5:57 pm
Subject: Re: Topic Requests and Wednesday's Meeting 		mateti...
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
  
Does anyone know about parking near this place?

-Siva

--- In phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com, Brian Donahue <brian@...> wrote:
>
> Hey folks,
>
> Thinking ahead to the next couple meetings, I wanted to remind everyone of
> our suggestion web site at
> *http://phillyaltnet.uservoice.com*<http://phillyaltnet.uservoice.com>.
> You can use that site to vote for topics you're interested in and suggest
> new ones if they aren't listed*.  You can do so anonymously, or register for
> free so we know who you are - either way, please let us know what you want
> to learn more about, it makes a huge difference in how we plan our events!
>
> Speaking of events - don't forget our next meeting on the concepts of
> functional programming is coming up on Wednesday.  Functional programming is
> an old concept that has been peaking again lately, and is something that all
> software developers should be familiar with, no matter what language you're
> using, but two very common languages that have functional programming
> capabilities are C# and javascript.  Our speaker, Aaron Feng, has a lot of
> experience in this area and will be talking about how a deeper understanding
> of FP has change the way he writes software.
>
> Details and free registration here:
> http://phillyaltnet-nov2009.eventbrite.com
>
> See you soon!
>
> Brian
>
> * The site can be a little confusing.  First, you type in the topic and hit
> "search" to see if there any similar topics already added.  If you see one
> that is similar, you can vote for it rather than create a duplicate.  If
> not, create a new one, add a description/comment, and add some votes to it.
> Save some votes to vote up other topics that you find interesting in the
> list!
>

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (4)
#586 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Fri Nov 13, 2009 8:31 pm
Subject: Topic Requests and Wednesday's Meeting 		brian.donahue
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
Hey folks,

Thinking ahead to the next couple meetings, I wanted to remind everyone of our suggestion web site at http://phillyaltnet.uservoice.com.  You can use that site to vote for topics you're interested in and suggest new ones if they aren't listed*.  You can do so anonymously, or register for free so we know who you are - either way, please let us know what you want to learn more about, it makes a huge difference in how we plan our events!

Speaking of events - don't forget our next meeting on the concepts of functional programming is coming up on Wednesday.  Functional programming is an old concept that has been peaking again lately, and is something that all software developers should be familiar with, no matter what language you're using, but two very common languages that have functional programming capabilities are C# and javascript.  Our speaker, Aaron Feng, has a lot of experience in this area and will be talking about how a deeper understanding of FP has change the way he writes software. 

Details and free registration here: http://phillyaltnet-nov2009.eventbrite.com

See you soon!

Brian

* The site can be a little confusing.  First, you type in the topic and hit "search" to see if there any similar topics already added.  If you see one that is similar, you can vote for it rather than create a duplicate.  If not, create a new one, add a description/comment, and add some votes to it.  Save some votes to vote up other topics that you find interesting in the list!


Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (4)
#585 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Sat Nov 7, 2009 5:18 pm
Subject: Next Meeting: November 18th 		brian.donahue
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
Howdy folks,

Our next meeting is on Wednesday, November 18th, when we will discuss the concepts of functional programming, and how they can change the way you think about and design software.  Our fantastic hosts from last meeting, Avencia, Inc, will be hosting this meeting as well.  (Our next meeting will likely be in the burbs, in Conshohocken).  Aaron Feng will be presenting, and his company, Algorithmics is our food sponsor.  They are hiring .NET developers in Philadelphia, so chat with Aaron after his talk to get more details!   Speaking of details, here they are: 

Registration:  http://phillyaltnet-nov2009.eventbrite.com


Concepts of Functional Programming

Avencia, Inc
340 N 12th Street, Suite 402
Philadelphia, PA 19107
Map

6:00 PM - Greetings and Eatings - Food sponsored by Algorithmics
6:30 - 7:30 PM - Aaron Feng - Concepts of Functional Programming
7:30 - 8:30 PM - Questions, discussions- bring an idea/question/show-and-tell if you want!

Concepts of Functional Programming: In Search of Purity
Functional Programming has gained a lot of momentum in recent years.
It has a long history dating back to the 1930s.  Many new functional
programming languages and features are popping up everywhere.  As
developers, we can no longer ignore it.

Learning the fundamentals of FP will transform the way you think, and
help you to build more scalable and robust software in any language.
This is an introductory presentation targeted to people that are
interested in learning about functional programming.  The focus will
be on the concepts of FP, which are language neutral.

Aaron Feng
Aaron Feng is a Principal Software Engineer at financial risk
management company, Algorithmics.  He is an experienced .NET
developer, and is currently working on a highly available and robust
financial messaging system using Clojure and Ruby.  He enjoys
experimenting with new technology and studying functional programming
languages in his spare time.  He also organizes the Philadelphia
functional programming group, Philly Lambda.

 


Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (1)
#584 From: Seth Soffer <sethsoffer@...>
Date: Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:28 pm
Subject: Re: Re: Parking For Tonight's Meeting 		sethsoffer
Online Now Online Now
Send Email Send Email
 
My wife used to work around there.  She says street parking is not too difficult.  Sorry for the late response.

On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:52 AM, Bob <bunson@...> wrote:
 

I don't have an inside scoop, but my expectation is that street parking should not be difficult to find.

Bob



--- In phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com, Brian Donahue <brian@...> wrote:
>
> Does anyone have the inside scoop on parking by Avencia for tonight's
> meeting?
>
> I know there is a lot right next door, which I've parked in in the past, but
> I don't know what hours or cost is like there, or if there are better
> options. I've marked the lot on this map:
>
> http://is.gd/4u5eA
>
> If anyone has any other suggestions, that would be fantastic.
>
> Thanks, see you this evening!
>
> Registration: https://brian-donahue.ticketleap.com/october09*
>
> Wednesday, October 21st, 2009*
> *6:00 - 9:00 PM**CouchDB and BDD Testing
> * *Avencia, Inc* <http://avencia.com>

> 340 N 12th Street, Suite 402
> Philadelphia, PA 19107
> Map <http://is.gd/4lBcc>
>
> *6:00 PM* - Greetings and Eatings - Sponsored by
> TicketLeap<http://ticketleap.com>
> !
> *6:30 - 7:30 PM* - Angel Pizarro - CouchDB : No SQL? No driver? No problem.

> *7:30 - 8:30 PM* - Erik Peterson -
> *Register Now! https://brian-donahue.ticketleap.com/october09
> *
> *CouchDB: No SQL? No Driver? No problem.*CouchDB is representative of a set
> of document-oriented database that have come to the fore of the collective
> geek consciousness. At it's heart it is a key-value store, but it can query
> into (and index) specific properties of the documents for fast performance.
> What makes CouchDB unique is it's MVCC transactional model and emphasis on
> using HTTP communication as the connection mechanism. In this talk we'll
> cover usage of CouchDB with a simple example, as well as look at when (and
> when not) such a database makes sense to use in favor of traditional
> relational databases.
>
> *Angel Pizarro leads a small team of developers in support of big-data
> biomedical research , with a focus on genomics and proteomics, at the
> University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine. *
>
> *(Almost) Frictionless BDD Testing*
> One of the biggest impediments to implementing Test Driven Design (TDD) is
> the difficulty in setting up tests. When you first get started, it can
> sometimes be a frustrating amount of work to write all of the code you need
> to set up the test, before you even write the test! In this talk, I will
> show you how to write some base classes for your tests that, once created,
> will make creating tests simple and "frictionless". This will be shown using
> a simple app written in a TDD manner, not just for unit tests but also for
> mapping/integration tests.
> *
> Erik Peterson has worked with .NET technologies for the past 5 years,
> primarily working with ASP.NET. He is an avid learner, and a bit
> test-obsessed. WIth a degree in Information Systems and a MBA, he is
> interested in both the development and the business sides of software. He
> currently works at VertMarkets in Horsham, and his blog can be found at
> http://erikbase.blogspot.com/*
>



Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (3)
#583 From: "Bob" <bunson@...>
Date: Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:52 pm
Subject: Re: Parking For Tonight's Meeting 		bobbunson
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
  
I don't have an inside scoop, but my expectation is that street parking should
not be difficult to find.

Bob

--- In phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com, Brian Donahue <brian@...> wrote:
>
> Does anyone have the inside scoop on parking by Avencia for tonight's
> meeting?
>
> I know there is a lot right next door, which I've parked in in the past, but
> I don't know what hours or cost is like there, or if there are better
> options.  I've marked the lot on this map:
>
> http://is.gd/4u5eA
>
> If anyone has any other suggestions, that would be fantastic.
>
> Thanks, see you this evening!
>
> Registration: https://brian-donahue.ticketleap.com/october09*
>
> Wednesday, October 21st, 2009*
> *6:00 - 9:00 PM**CouchDB and BDD Testing
> * *Avencia, Inc* <http://avencia.com>
> 340 N 12th Street, Suite 402
> Philadelphia, PA 19107
> Map <http://is.gd/4lBcc>
>
> *6:00 PM* - Greetings and Eatings - Sponsored by
> TicketLeap<http://ticketleap.com>
> !
> *6:30 - 7:30 PM* - Angel Pizarro - CouchDB : No SQL? No driver? No problem.
> *7:30 - 8:30 PM* - Erik Peterson -
> *Register Now!  https://brian-donahue.ticketleap.com/october09
> *
> *CouchDB: No SQL? No Driver? No problem.*CouchDB is representative of a set
> of document-oriented database that have come to the fore of the collective
> geek consciousness. At it's heart it is a key-value store, but it can query
> into (and index) specific properties of the documents for fast performance.
> What makes CouchDB unique is it's MVCC transactional model and emphasis on
> using HTTP communication as the connection mechanism. In this talk we'll
> cover usage of CouchDB with a simple example, as well as look at when (and
> when not) such a database makes sense to use in favor of traditional
> relational databases.
>
> *Angel Pizarro leads a small team of developers in support of big-data
> biomedical research , with a  focus on genomics and proteomics, at the
> University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine. *
>
> *(Almost) Frictionless BDD Testing*
> One of the biggest impediments to implementing Test Driven Design (TDD) is
> the difficulty in setting up tests. When you first get started, it can
> sometimes be a frustrating amount of work to write all of the code you need
> to set up the test, before you even write the test! In this talk, I will
> show you how to write some base classes for your tests that, once created,
> will make creating tests simple and "frictionless". This will be shown using
> a simple app written in a TDD manner, not just for unit tests but also for
> mapping/integration tests.
> *
> Erik Peterson has worked with .NET technologies for the past 5 years,
> primarily working with ASP.NET.  He is an avid learner, and a bit
> test-obsessed.  WIth a degree in Information Systems and a MBA, he is
> interested in both the development and the business sides of software.  He
> currently works at VertMarkets in Horsham, and his blog can be found at
> http://erikbase.blogspot.com/*
>

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (3)
#582 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:17 pm
Subject: Parking For Tonight's Meeting 		brian.donahue
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
Does anyone have the inside scoop on parking by Avencia for tonight's meeting?

I know there is a lot right next door, which I've parked in in the past, but I don't know what hours or cost is like there, or if there are better options.  I've marked the lot on this map:

http://is.gd/4u5eA

If anyone has any other suggestions, that would be fantastic.

Thanks, see you this evening!

Registration: https://brian-donahue.ticketleap.com/october09

Wednesday, October 21st, 2009
6:00 - 9:00 PM

CouchDB and BDD Testing

Avencia, Inc
340 N 12th Street, Suite 402
Philadelphia, PA 19107
Map

6:00 PM - Greetings and Eatings - Sponsored by TicketLeap!
6:30 - 7:30 PM - Angel Pizarro - CouchDB : No SQL? No driver? No problem.
7:30 - 8:30 PM - Erik Peterson -
Register Now!  https://brian-donahue.ticketleap.com/october09

CouchDB: No SQL? No Driver? No problem.
CouchDB is representative of a set of document-oriented database that have come to the fore of the collective geek consciousness. At it's heart it is a key-value store, but it can query into (and index) specific properties of the documents for fast performance. What makes CouchDB unique is it's MVCC transactional model and emphasis on using HTTP communication as the connection mechanism. In this talk we'll cover usage of CouchDB with a simple example, as well as look at when (and when not) such a database makes sense to use in favor of traditional relational databases.

Angel Pizarro leads a small team of developers in support of big-data biomedical research , with a  focus on genomics and proteomics, at the University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine.

(Almost) Frictionless BDD Testing
One of the biggest impediments to implementing Test Driven Design (TDD) is the difficulty in setting up tests. When you first get started, it can sometimes be a frustrating amount of work to write all of the code you need to set up the test, before you even write the test! In this talk, I will show you how to write some base classes for your tests that, once created, will make creating tests simple and "frictionless". This will be shown using a simple app written in a TDD manner, not just for unit tests but also for mapping/integration tests.

Erik Peterson has worked with .NET technologies for the past 5 years, primarily working with ASP.NET.  He is an avid learner, and a bit test-obsessed.  WIth a degree in Information Systems and a MBA, he is interested in both the development and the business sides of software.  He currently works at VertMarkets in Horsham, and his blog can be found at http://erikbase.blogspot.com/





Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (3)
#581 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Tue Oct 20, 2009 9:56 pm
Subject: Re: Phillies vs Philly ALT.NET! 		brian.donahue
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
Thanks to everyone who responded to the survey.  Since only a couple people said they would change their minds if we postponed the second session, we are going to go on as planned, and if you want to split after the first session, we will pretend we don't notice!

Still not too late to register!  Did I mention free pizza from TicketLeap.com??

Registration: http://brian-donahue.ticketleap.com/october09


Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (2)
#580 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Mon Oct 19, 2009 6:48 pm
Subject: Phillies vs Philly ALT.NET! 		brian.donahue
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
I realize that the Phillies game on Wednesday night might be causing some agita among many of our members.  I mean, CouchDB and BDD vs baseball would keep any software developer up at night.

So, I pose this question to you, my red-capped friends, would more of you come to our meeting if we postpone the second talk (BDD), and wrap up before 8pm?  Please take a moment to answer our poll here:

http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/phillyaltnet/surveys?id=12954285

And for registration and details on the meeting, go to http://brian-donahue.ticketleap.com/october09

Thanks!

Brian

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (2)
#579 From: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com
Date: Mon Oct 19, 2009 6:34 pm
Subject: New poll for phillyaltnet 		phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com
Send Email Send Email
  
Enter your vote today!  A new poll has been created for the
phillyaltnet group:

Should we postpone the second session of this Wednesday's (10/21/2009) Philly
ALT.NET meeting, so that attendees can watch the Phillies game?  We'd likely
wrap a little before 8pm, if so.

   o I will attend, and don't want to postpone the second session
   o I would attend if we can wrap up in time to watch the Phillies
   o I can't attend either way


To vote, please visit the following web page:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/phillyaltnet/surveys?id=12954285

Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are
not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the Yahoo! Groups
web site listed above.

Thanks!

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (11)
#578 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Fri Oct 16, 2009 2:09 am
Subject: Next Meeting: October 21st 		brian.donahue
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
Howdy all,

Our next meeting is Wednesday, October 21st, will be downtown, and we'll have two different topics: CouchDB and BDD Testing!  We have a new host, Avencia Inc, and food sponsor, TicketLeap!  We are using TicketLeap's site for registration (free, as always):
https://brian-donahue.ticketleap.com/october09

If anyone has parking tips for this location, feel free to share with the list.  The Market East SEPTA station is within easy walking distance as well.  See you there!

Wednesday, October 21st, 2009
6:00 - 9:00 PM

CouchDB and BDD Testing

Avencia, Inc
340 N 12th Street, Suite 402
Philadelphia, PA 19107
Map

6:00 PM - Greetings and Eatings - Sponsored by TicketLeap!
6:30 - 7:30 PM - Angel Pizarro - CouchDB : No SQL? No driver? No problem.
7:30 - 8:30 PM - Erik Peterson -
Register Now!  https://brian-donahue.ticketleap.com/october09

CouchDB: No SQL? No Driver? No problem.
CouchDB is representative of a set of document-oriented database that have come to the fore of the collective geek consciousness. At it's heart it is a key-value store, but it can query into (and index) specific properties of the documents for fast performance. What makes CouchDB unique is it's MVCC transactional model and emphasis on using HTTP communication as the connection mechanism. In this talk we'll cover usage of CouchDB with a simple example, as well as look at when (and when not) such a database makes sense to use in favor of traditional relational databases.

Angel Pizarro leads a small team of developers in support of big-data biomedical research , with a  focus on genomics and proteomics, at the University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine.

(Almost) Frictionless BDD Testing
One of the biggest impediments to implementing Test Driven Design (TDD) is the difficulty in setting up tests. When you first get started, it can sometimes be a frustrating amount of work to write all of the code you need to set up the test, before you even write the test! In this talk, I will show you how to write some base classes for your tests that, once created, will make creating tests simple and "frictionless". This will be shown using a simple app written in a TDD manner, not just for unit tests but also for mapping/integration tests.

Erik Peterson has worked with .NET technologies for the past 5 years, primarily working with ASP.NET.  He is an avid learner, and a bit test-obsessed.  WIth a degree in Information Systems and a MBA, he is interested in both the development and the business sides of software.  He currently works at VertMarkets in Horsham, and his blog can be found at http://erikbase.blogspot.com/




Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (1)
#577 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Mon Oct 5, 2009 3:43 pm
Subject: Fwd: Philly Lambda November Meeting 		brian.donahue
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
The Philly Lambda user group, is putting on an intro to Lisp talk and is taking votes on a date.  I thought some people on our list might be interested.  The organizer, Aaron, has invited any interested folks to vote in the poll below.

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Aaron Feng <aaron.feng@...>
Date: Sun, Oct 4, 2009 at 2:35 PM
Subject: Philly Lambda November Meeting
To: philly-lambda@googlegroups.com


I am in contact with Conrad Barski of http://www.lisperati.com/ and he is willing to come up from DC to speak at Philly Lambda in November.

He will be doing a beginner Lisp presentation based on his book: Land of Lisp: Learn to Program in Lisp, One Game at a Time! by No Starch press (http://nostarch.com/lisp.htm).  Here's the hacker news thread about the book: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=841117

Since he will be coming from out of town, so it is necessary that I schedule him on a date with the least amount of conflicts.

In order to figure out the best dates for people, I started a Doodle poll, http://www.doodle.com/nh78qzegpe7xy2fm
Please fill in your name and click ALL the dates you are available.  Your name will be used for RSVP purposes.  No account is required to use doodle, just use the link above.

Thanks,

Aaron


Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (1)
#576 From: David Gitlin <david.gitlin@...>
Date: Mon Oct 5, 2009 12:10 pm
Subject: RE: Re: MonoSpace Conference 		david.gitlin@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Perhaps we should spend a few minutes discussing this further at one of our next meetings.  It might be cool to create a small application and do some profiling on speed etc on both a windows and linux system under Mono.
 
Like everyone else I hope Mono becomes more of a main stream technology, but right now I am not very optimistic about it taking off. There are just too many factors working against it and not enough working for it.
 
dg
 
To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com
From: brian@...
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 2009 15:40:16 -0400
Subject: Re: [phillyaltnet] Re: MonoSpace Conference

 
I agree.  Obviously I am viewing it from the Microsoft side of the fence, having worked on .NET technologies for the vast majority of the past 7 years or so, but it *seems* like the hard-line linux folks are the ones really upset, and a lot of other audiences (Mac/iPhone developers and of course .NET devs) see it as a huge win, or at worst, and interesting curiosity that can only add to competition and improvement in that space. 

I'm interested in learning more at the MonoSpace conference and also at Dane Morgridge's code camp talk on the 17th!

-Brian

P.S.  Nice to see an actual-factual tech conversation amongst members on the list!  It's been too long!

On Sat, Oct 3, 2009 at 4:46 PM, Jeffrey McArthur <jeffmcarthur@comcast.net> wrote:
Here is my reading of the tea leaves:

Microsoft wants Silverlight to be available on every device. One way to get
Silverlight on Linux is Moonlight. Microsoft wants Mono to be complete
enough to support Moonlight. That way Silverlight can seriously take on
Flash.

I honestly hope Microsoft wins this one.

But, like a lot of things, the lawyers and digital rights management are
going to screw it all up. I like Silverlight. Expression Blend is a fun tool
to use. The one thing that Microsoft did not implement with Silverlight is
any form of digital rights management. This is where I am conflicted. I like
the way Silverlight leverages XML. I have some content I would like to use.
I can take the files and load them into Expression Blend and create a
Silverlight project. The problem is you can open up the XAML and pull out
the content. I have rights to use the content as long as someone cannot
recreate the original outlines. XAML allows anyone to open up the file and
cut out the XML. This means there is a lot of content people could legally
use with Flash but not with Silverlight.

There is an ugly way around the problem: Obfuscation and Packaging of .NET
Applications via Compressed Embedded Assemblies:

http://www.eggheadcafe.com/tutorials/aspnet/04aa7525-f153-4907-b0e8-10ac501f430a/obfuscation-and-packaging.aspx

Mono and Moonlight could also allow running Silverlight apps on Android
cellphones. Mono is already running on Android:

http://www.koushikdutta.com/2009/01/compiling-mono-under-android-build.html

Mono is a technology suffering from an abundance of lawyers.

Jeffrey McArthur
cell: 610-389-0734
home: 610-450-6115
email: jeffmcarthur@comcast.net
On Sat, 3 Oct 2009 13:54:37 -0400, you wrote:

>
>I know Novell is behind it. Microsoft seems rather ambivalent to me.  Are they putting any real resources behind the effort or just giving it lip service?  I don't think IBM or Oracle have any real interest in seeing this go forward. Novell isn't a major player anymore and doesn't really have the cache, cash or user base to push a new technology and get it adopted.
>
>dg
>
>
>
>To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com
>From: brian@pigeonmoon.com
>Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 11:21:30 -0400
>Subject: [phillyaltnet] Re: MonoSpace Conference
>
>
>
>
>
>Microsoft and Novell are behind it... But I guess you mean big Linux players?
>
>On Saturday, October 3, 2009, David Gitlin <david.gitlin@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I agree that .NET on Unix is a great idea, but I also agree that its unlikely to happen.  Mono does not have sufficient support from any of the big players, and without that its not going anywhere.  Ultimately, no one is going to make a career decision to use Mono in a greenfield project that really matters.  I would either go with the traditional Java/Unix stack or of course .NET/WinTel.  I just don't see there being enough industry need or support for Mono to really take off.
>>
>> Anyone disagree or have a different perspective?
>> dg
>>
>>
>> To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com');>
>> From: jeffmcarthur@comcast.net <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'jeffmcarthur@comcast.net');>
>> Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 03:58:26 -0400
>> Subject: Re: [phillyaltnet] MonoSpace Conference
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> My experience with Mono is minimal. I have done a little more than a "Hello
>> World" application.
>>
>> The biggest problem I see with Mono is not the technology, but the politics.
>> I have used Red Hat/Fedora for a long time. Fedora removed Mono from their
>> package list. Mono does not even list Red Hat or Fedora on this list of
>> supported versions of Linux.
>>
>> I was interested in running Mono on my Fedora 6 server. I managed to get
>> Mono installed and running. If you are running Fedora 10 or 11 installing
>> Mono is a bit easier.
>>
>> There is a whole website devoted to banning Mono from all Linux
>> distributions: http://boycottnovell.com <http://boycottnovell.com/>
>>
>> Personally, I like the idea of .Net on Linux.
>>
>> ''The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers,'' stated by Dick the
>> Butcher in ''Henry VI,'' Part II, act IV, Scene II, Line 73
>>
>> Jeffrey McArthur
>> cell: 610-389-0734
>> home: 610-450-6115
>> email: jeffmcarthur@comcast.net <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'jeffmcarthur@comcast.net');>
>> http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com <http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com/>
>> http://twitter.com/JeffreyMcArthur
>> http://jeffmcarthur.blogspot.com
>>
>> On Fri, 2 Oct 2009 16:32:13 -0400, you wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Has anyone deployed a .NET application on Mono and lived to tell the tale? What are people's experiences been with .NET on Unix?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>dg
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional
>> Change settings via the Web <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/phillyaltnet/join;_ylc=X3oDMTJnaDJmMWdhBF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwBGdycElkAzIwOTY4NDMwBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAwNjc2NARzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNzdG5ncwRzdGltZQMxMjU0NTc5MTQz> (Yahoo! ID required)
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Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (11)
#575 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Sun Oct 4, 2009 7:40 pm
Subject: Re: Re: MonoSpace Conference 		brian.donahue
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
I agree.  Obviously I am viewing it from the Microsoft side of the fence, having worked on .NET technologies for the vast majority of the past 7 years or so, but it *seems* like the hard-line linux folks are the ones really upset, and a lot of other audiences (Mac/iPhone developers and of course .NET devs) see it as a huge win, or at worst, and interesting curiosity that can only add to competition and improvement in that space. 

I'm interested in learning more at the MonoSpace conference and also at Dane Morgridge's code camp talk on the 17th!

-Brian

P.S.  Nice to see an actual-factual tech conversation amongst members on the list!  It's been too long!

On Sat, Oct 3, 2009 at 4:46 PM, Jeffrey McArthur <jeffmcarthur@...> wrote:
Here is my reading of the tea leaves:

Microsoft wants Silverlight to be available on every device. One way to get
Silverlight on Linux is Moonlight. Microsoft wants Mono to be complete
enough to support Moonlight. That way Silverlight can seriously take on
Flash.

I honestly hope Microsoft wins this one.

But, like a lot of things, the lawyers and digital rights management are
going to screw it all up. I like Silverlight. Expression Blend is a fun tool
to use. The one thing that Microsoft did not implement with Silverlight is
any form of digital rights management. This is where I am conflicted. I like
the way Silverlight leverages XML. I have some content I would like to use.
I can take the files and load them into Expression Blend and create a
Silverlight project. The problem is you can open up the XAML and pull out
the content. I have rights to use the content as long as someone cannot
recreate the original outlines. XAML allows anyone to open up the file and
cut out the XML. This means there is a lot of content people could legally
use with Flash but not with Silverlight.

There is an ugly way around the problem: Obfuscation and Packaging of .NET
Applications via Compressed Embedded Assemblies:

http://www.eggheadcafe.com/tutorials/aspnet/04aa7525-f153-4907-b0e8-10ac501f430a/obfuscation-and-packaging.aspx

Mono and Moonlight could also allow running Silverlight apps on Android
cellphones. Mono is already running on Android:

http://www.koushikdutta.com/2009/01/compiling-mono-under-android-build.html

Mono is a technology suffering from an abundance of lawyers.

Jeffrey McArthur
cell: 610-389-0734
home: 610-450-6115
email: jeffmcarthur@...
On Sat, 3 Oct 2009 13:54:37 -0400, you wrote:

>
>I know Novell is behind it. Microsoft seems rather ambivalent to me.  Are they putting any real resources behind the effort or just giving it lip service?  I don't think IBM or Oracle have any real interest in seeing this go forward. Novell isn't a major player anymore and doesn't really have the cache, cash or user base to push a new technology and get it adopted.
>
>dg
>
>
>
>To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com
>From: brian@...
>Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 11:21:30 -0400
>Subject: [phillyaltnet] Re: MonoSpace Conference
>
>
>
>
>
>Microsoft and Novell are behind it... But I guess you mean big Linux players?
>
>On Saturday, October 3, 2009, David Gitlin <david.gitlin@...> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I agree that .NET on Unix is a great idea, but I also agree that its unlikely to happen.  Mono does not have sufficient support from any of the big players, and without that its not going anywhere.  Ultimately, no one is going to make a career decision to use Mono in a greenfield project that really matters.  I would either go with the traditional Java/Unix stack or of course .NET/WinTel.  I just don't see there being enough industry need or support for Mono to really take off.
>>
>> Anyone disagree or have a different perspective?
>> dg
>>
>>
>> To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com');>
>> From: jeffmcarthur@... <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'jeffmcarthur@...');>
>> Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 03:58:26 -0400
>> Subject: Re: [phillyaltnet] MonoSpace Conference
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> My experience with Mono is minimal. I have done a little more than a "Hello
>> World" application.
>>
>> The biggest problem I see with Mono is not the technology, but the politics.
>> I have used Red Hat/Fedora for a long time. Fedora removed Mono from their
>> package list. Mono does not even list Red Hat or Fedora on this list of
>> supported versions of Linux.
>>
>> I was interested in running Mono on my Fedora 6 server. I managed to get
>> Mono installed and running. If you are running Fedora 10 or 11 installing
>> Mono is a bit easier.
>>
>> There is a whole website devoted to banning Mono from all Linux
>> distributions: http://boycottnovell.com <http://boycottnovell.com/>
>>
>> Personally, I like the idea of .Net on Linux.
>>
>> ''The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers,'' stated by Dick the
>> Butcher in ''Henry VI,'' Part II, act IV, Scene II, Line 73
>>
>> Jeffrey McArthur
>> cell: 610-389-0734
>> home: 610-450-6115
>> email: jeffmcarthur@... <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'jeffmcarthur@...');>
>> http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com <http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com/>
>> http://twitter.com/JeffreyMcArthur
>> http://jeffmcarthur.blogspot.com
>>
>> On Fri, 2 Oct 2009 16:32:13 -0400, you wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Has anyone deployed a .NET application on Mono and lived to tell the tale? What are people's experiences been with .NET on Unix?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>dg
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional
>> Change settings via the Web <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/phillyaltnet/join;_ylc=X3oDMTJnaDJmMWdhBF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwBGdycElkAzIwOTY4NDMwBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAwNjc2NARzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNzdG5ncwRzdGltZQMxMjU0NTc5MTQz> (Yahoo! ID required)
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Visit our wiki site for more info on Philly ALT.NET at http://phillyalt.net and follow us on Twitter for local .NET community updates and other nifty tidbits:  @phillyaltnet or http://twitter.com/phillyaltnetYahoo! Groups Links

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Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (11)
#574 From: Jeffrey McArthur <jeffmcarthur@...>
Date: Sat Oct 3, 2009 8:46 pm
Subject: Re: Re: MonoSpace Conference 		jeffmcarthur
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
  
Here is my reading of the tea leaves:

Microsoft wants Silverlight to be available on every device. One way to get
Silverlight on Linux is Moonlight. Microsoft wants Mono to be complete
enough to support Moonlight. That way Silverlight can seriously take on
Flash.

I honestly hope Microsoft wins this one.

But, like a lot of things, the lawyers and digital rights management are
going to screw it all up. I like Silverlight. Expression Blend is a fun tool
to use. The one thing that Microsoft did not implement with Silverlight is
any form of digital rights management. This is where I am conflicted. I like
the way Silverlight leverages XML. I have some content I would like to use.
I can take the files and load them into Expression Blend and create a
Silverlight project. The problem is you can open up the XAML and pull out
the content. I have rights to use the content as long as someone cannot
recreate the original outlines. XAML allows anyone to open up the file and
cut out the XML. This means there is a lot of content people could legally
use with Flash but not with Silverlight.

There is an ugly way around the problem: Obfuscation and Packaging of .NET
Applications via Compressed Embedded Assemblies:

http://www.eggheadcafe.com/tutorials/aspnet/04aa7525-f153-4907-b0e8-10ac501f430a\
/obfuscation-and-packaging.aspx

Mono and Moonlight could also allow running Silverlight apps on Android
cellphones. Mono is already running on Android:

http://www.koushikdutta.com/2009/01/compiling-mono-under-android-build.html

Mono is a technology suffering from an abundance of lawyers.

Jeffrey McArthur
cell: 610-389-0734
home: 610-450-6115
email: jeffmcarthur@...
http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com
http://twitter.com/JeffreyMcArthur
http://jeffmcarthur.blogspot.com

On Sat, 3 Oct 2009 13:54:37 -0400, you wrote:

>
>I know Novell is behind it. Microsoft seems rather ambivalent to me.  Are they
putting any real resources behind the effort or just giving it lip service?  I
don't think IBM or Oracle have any real interest in seeing this go forward.
Novell isn't a major player anymore and doesn't really have the cache, cash or
user base to push a new technology and get it adopted.
>
>dg
>
>
>
>To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com
>From: brian@...
>Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 11:21:30 -0400
>Subject: [phillyaltnet] Re: MonoSpace Conference
>
>
>
>
>
>Microsoft and Novell are behind it... But I guess you mean big Linux players?
>
>On Saturday, October 3, 2009, David Gitlin <david.gitlin@...> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I agree that .NET on Unix is a great idea, but I also agree that its unlikely
to happen.  Mono does not have sufficient support from any of the big players,
and without that its not going anywhere.  Ultimately, no one is going to make a
career decision to use Mono in a greenfield project that really matters.  I
would either go with the traditional Java/Unix stack or of course .NET/WinTel. 
I just don't see there being enough industry need or support for Mono to really
take off.
>>
>> Anyone disagree or have a different perspective?
>> dg
>>
>>
>> To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml',
'phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com');>
>> From: jeffmcarthur@... <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml',
'jeffmcarthur@...');>
>> Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 03:58:26 -0400
>> Subject: Re: [phillyaltnet] MonoSpace Conference
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> My experience with Mono is minimal. I have done a little more than a "Hello
>> World" application.
>>
>> The biggest problem I see with Mono is not the technology, but the politics.
>> I have used Red Hat/Fedora for a long time. Fedora removed Mono from their
>> package list. Mono does not even list Red Hat or Fedora on this list of
>> supported versions of Linux.
>>
>> I was interested in running Mono on my Fedora 6 server. I managed to get
>> Mono installed and running. If you are running Fedora 10 or 11 installing
>> Mono is a bit easier.
>>
>> There is a whole website devoted to banning Mono from all Linux
>> distributions: http://boycottnovell.com <http://boycottnovell.com/>
>>
>> Personally, I like the idea of .Net on Linux.
>>
>> ''The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers,'' stated by Dick the
>> Butcher in ''Henry VI,'' Part II, act IV, Scene II, Line 73
>>
>> Jeffrey McArthur
>> cell: 610-389-0734
>> home: 610-450-6115
>> email: jeffmcarthur@... <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml',
'jeffmcarthur@...');>
>> http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com <http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com/>
>> http://twitter.com/JeffreyMcArthur
>> http://jeffmcarthur.blogspot.com
>>
>> On Fri, 2 Oct 2009 16:32:13 -0400, you wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Has anyone deployed a .NET application on Mono and lived to tell the tale?
What are people's experiences been with .NET on Unix?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>dg
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional
>> Change settings via the Web
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Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (11)
#573 From: Jeffrey Fritz <jeffreytfritz@...>
Date: Sat Oct 3, 2009 7:46 pm
Subject: Re: Re: MonoSpace Conference 		jtfritz
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
Agreed that Novell has the resources to move it forward, but it should also be pointed out that the CodePlex foundation was put together so that Microsoft employees COULD contribute to projects like Mono, AND Microsoft as a corporation could indirectly support this kind of a project.

Do you really think Microsoft WOULDN'T want their hordes of developers to be able to develop and use their technology on other platforms?  Mono is a terrific assimilation play by the boys in Seattle.  "If you like this app running on your Unix box, wait until you see it run on Windows Server 20xx!"



Jeff


On Sat, Oct 3, 2009 at 3:37 PM, JP Toto <james.p.toto@...> wrote:
 

Regardless of the cache or cash behind Mono, it a legitamate technology that has found a niche in a few markets. Monotouch is significant for C# iPhone developers and Mono is actually used on game platforms like the Wii to help port games. Mono can do other interesting things too like compile down to static binaries.  

I don't think Mono is going away anytime soon and certainly, Novell has the resources to move it forward. 

JP Toto


On Oct 3, 2009, at 1:54 PM, David Gitlin <david.gitlin@...> wrote:

 

I know Novell is behind it. Microsoft seems rather ambivalent to me.  Are they putting any real resources behind the effort or just giving it lip service?  I don't think IBM or Oracle have any real interest in seeing this go forward. Novell isn't a major player anymore and doesn't really have the cache, cash or user base to push a new technology and get it adopted.
dg
 

To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com
From: brian@...
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 11:21:30 -0400
Subject: [phillyaltnet] Re: MonoSpace Conference

 
Microsoft and Novell are behind it... But I guess you mean big Linux players?

On Saturday, October 3, 2009, David Gitlin <david.gitlin@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I agree that .NET on Unix is a great idea, but I also agree that its unlikely to happen.  Mono does not have sufficient support from any of the big players, and without that its not going anywhere.  Ultimately, no one is going to make a career decision to use Mono in a greenfield project that really matters.  I would either go with the traditional Java/Unix stack or of course .NET/WinTel.  I just don't see there being enough industry need or support for Mono to really take off.
>
> Anyone disagree or have a different perspective?
> dg
>
>
> To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com');>
> From: jeffmcarthur@comcast.net <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'jeffmcarthur@comcast.net');>
> Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 03:58:26 -0400
> Subject: Re: [phillyaltnet] MonoSpace Conference
>
>
>
>
>
> My experience with Mono is minimal. I have done a little more than a "Hello
> World" application.
>
> The biggest problem I see with Mono is not the technology, but the politics.
> I have used Red Hat/Fedora for a long time. Fedora removed Mono from their
> package list. Mono does not even list Red Hat or Fedora on this list of
> supported versions of Linux.
>
> I was interested in running Mono on my Fedora 6 server. I managed to get
> Mono installed and running. If you are running Fedora 10 or 11 installing
> Mono is a bit easier.
>
> There is a whole website devoted to banning Mono from all Linux
> distributions: http://boycottnovell.com <http://boycottnovell.com/>
>
> Personally, I like the idea of .Net on Linux.
>
> ''The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers,'' stated by Dick the
> Butcher in ''Henry VI,'' Part II, act IV, Scene II, Line 73
>
> Jeffrey McArthur
> cell: 610-389-0734
> home: 610-450-6115
> email: jeffmcarthur@comcast.net <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'jeffmcarthur@comcast.net');>
> http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com <http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com/>
> http://twitter.com/JeffreyMcArthur
> http://jeffmcarthur.blogspot.com
>
> On Fri, 2 Oct 2009 16:32:13 -0400, you wrote:
>
>>
>> Has anyone deployed a .NET application on Mono and lived to tell the tale? What are people's experiences been with .NET on Unix?
>>
>>
>>
>>dg
>
>
>
>
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>
>
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Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (11)
#572 From: JP Toto <james.p.toto@...>
Date: Sat Oct 3, 2009 7:37 pm
Subject: Re: Re: MonoSpace Conference 		viceclown
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
Regardless of the cache or cash behind Mono, it a legitamate technology that has found a niche in a few markets. Monotouch is significant for C# iPhone developers and Mono is actually used on game platforms like the Wii to help port games. Mono can do other interesting things too like compile down to static binaries.  

I don't think Mono is going away anytime soon and certainly, Novell has the resources to move it forward. 

JP Toto


On Oct 3, 2009, at 1:54 PM, David Gitlin <david.gitlin@...> wrote:

 

I know Novell is behind it. Microsoft seems rather ambivalent to me.  Are they putting any real resources behind the effort or just giving it lip service?  I don't think IBM or Oracle have any real interest in seeing this go forward. Novell isn't a major player anymore and doesn't really have the cache, cash or user base to push a new technology and get it adopted.
dg
 

To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com
From: brian@pigeonmoon.com
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 11:21:30 -0400
Subject: [phillyaltnet] Re: MonoSpace Conference

 
Microsoft and Novell are behind it... But I guess you mean big Linux players?

On Saturday, October 3, 2009, David Gitlin <david.gitlin@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I agree that .NET on Unix is a great idea, but I also agree that its unlikely to happen.  Mono does not have sufficient support from any of the big players, and without that its not going anywhere.  Ultimately, no one is going to make a career decision to use Mono in a greenfield project that really matters.  I would either go with the traditional Java/Unix stack or of course .NET/WinTel.  I just don't see there being enough industry need or support for Mono to really take off.
>
> Anyone disagree or have a different perspective?
> dg
>
>
> To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com');>
> From: jeffmcarthur@comcast.net <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'jeffmcarthur@comcast.net');>
> Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 03:58:26 -0400
> Subject: Re: [phillyaltnet] MonoSpace Conference
>
>
>
>
>
> My experience with Mono is minimal. I have done a little more than a "Hello
> World" application.
>
> The biggest problem I see with Mono is not the technology, but the politics.
> I have used Red Hat/Fedora for a long time. Fedora removed Mono from their
> package list. Mono does not even list Red Hat or Fedora on this list of
> supported versions of Linux.
>
> I was interested in running Mono on my Fedora 6 server. I managed to get
> Mono installed and running. If you are running Fedora 10 or 11 installing
> Mono is a bit easier.
>
> There is a whole website devoted to banning Mono from all Linux
> distributions: http://boycottnovell.com <http://boycottnovell.com/>
>
> Personally, I like the idea of .Net on Linux.
>
> ''The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers,'' stated by Dick the
> Butcher in ''Henry VI,'' Part II, act IV, Scene II, Line 73
>
> Jeffrey McArthur
> cell: 610-389-0734
> home: 610-450-6115
> email: jeffmcarthur@comcast.net <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'jeffmcarthur@comcast.net');>
> http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com <http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com/>
> http://twitter.com/JeffreyMcArthur
> http://jeffmcarthur.blogspot.com
>
> On Fri, 2 Oct 2009 16:32:13 -0400, you wrote:
>
>>
>> Has anyone deployed a .NET application on Mono and lived to tell the tale? What are people's experiences been with .NET on Unix?
>>
>>
>>
>>dg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional
> Change settings via the Web <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/phillyaltnet/join;_ylc=X3oDMTJnaDJmMWdhBF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwBGdycElkAzIwOTY4NDMwBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAwNjc2NARzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNzdG5ncwRzdGltZQMxMjU0NTc5MTQz> (Yahoo! ID required)
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Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (11)
#571 From: David Gitlin <david.gitlin@...>
Date: Sat Oct 3, 2009 5:54 pm
Subject: RE: Re: MonoSpace Conference 		david.gitlin@...
Send Email Send Email
 
I know Novell is behind it. Microsoft seems rather ambivalent to me.  Are they putting any real resources behind the effort or just giving it lip service?  I don't think IBM or Oracle have any real interest in seeing this go forward. Novell isn't a major player anymore and doesn't really have the cache, cash or user base to push a new technology and get it adopted.
dg
 
To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com
From: brian@...
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 11:21:30 -0400
Subject: [phillyaltnet] Re: MonoSpace Conference

 
Microsoft and Novell are behind it... But I guess you mean big Linux players?

On Saturday, October 3, 2009, David Gitlin <david.gitlin@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I agree that .NET on Unix is a great idea, but I also agree that its unlikely to happen.  Mono does not have sufficient support from any of the big players, and without that its not going anywhere.  Ultimately, no one is going to make a career decision to use Mono in a greenfield project that really matters.  I would either go with the traditional Java/Unix stack or of course .NET/WinTel.  I just don't see there being enough industry need or support for Mono to really take off.
>
> Anyone disagree or have a different perspective?
> dg
>
>
> To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com');>
> From: jeffmcarthur@comcast.net <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'jeffmcarthur@comcast.net');>
> Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 03:58:26 -0400
> Subject: Re: [phillyaltnet] MonoSpace Conference
>
>
>
>
>
> My experience with Mono is minimal. I have done a little more than a "Hello
> World" application.
>
> The biggest problem I see with Mono is not the technology, but the politics.
> I have used Red Hat/Fedora for a long time. Fedora removed Mono from their
> package list. Mono does not even list Red Hat or Fedora on this list of
> supported versions of Linux.
>
> I was interested in running Mono on my Fedora 6 server. I managed to get
> Mono installed and running. If you are running Fedora 10 or 11 installing
> Mono is a bit easier.
>
> There is a whole website devoted to banning Mono from all Linux
> distributions: http://boycottnovell.com <http://boycottnovell.com/>
>
> Personally, I like the idea of .Net on Linux.
>
> ''The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers,'' stated by Dick the
> Butcher in ''Henry VI,'' Part II, act IV, Scene II, Line 73
>
> Jeffrey McArthur
> cell: 610-389-0734
> home: 610-450-6115
> email: jeffmcarthur@comcast.net <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 'jeffmcarthur@comcast.net');>
> http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com <http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com/>
> http://twitter.com/JeffreyMcArthur
> http://jeffmcarthur.blogspot.com
>
> On Fri, 2 Oct 2009 16:32:13 -0400, you wrote:
>
>>
>> Has anyone deployed a .NET application on Mono and lived to tell the tale? What are people's experiences been with .NET on Unix?
>>
>>
>>
>>dg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional
> Change settings via the Web <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/phillyaltnet/join;_ylc=X3oDMTJnaDJmMWdhBF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwBGdycElkAzIwOTY4NDMwBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAwNjc2NARzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNzdG5ncwRzdGltZQMxMjU0NTc5MTQz> (Yahoo! ID required)
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Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (11)
#570 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Sat Oct 3, 2009 3:21 pm
Subject: Re: MonoSpace Conference 		brian.donahue
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
  
Microsoft and Novell are behind it...  But I guess you mean big Linux players?


On Saturday, October 3, 2009, David Gitlin <david.gitlin@...> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I agree that .NET on Unix is a great idea, but I also agree that its unlikely
to happen.  Mono does not have sufficient support from any of the big players,
and without that its not going anywhere.  Ultimately, no one is going to make a
career decision to use Mono in a greenfield project that really matters.  I
would either go with the traditional Java/Unix stack or of course .NET/WinTel. 
I just don't see there being enough industry need or support for Mono to really
take off.
>
> Anyone disagree or have a different perspective?
> dg
>
>
> To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml',
'phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com');>
> From: jeffmcarthur@... <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml',
'jeffmcarthur@...');>
> Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 03:58:26 -0400
> Subject: Re: [phillyaltnet] MonoSpace Conference
>
>
>
>
>
> My experience with Mono is minimal. I have done a little more than a "Hello
> World" application.
>
> The biggest problem I see with Mono is not the technology, but the politics.
> I have used Red Hat/Fedora for a long time. Fedora removed Mono from their
> package list. Mono does not even list Red Hat or Fedora on this list of
> supported versions of Linux.
>
> I was interested in running Mono on my Fedora 6 server. I managed to get
> Mono installed and running. If you are running Fedora 10 or 11 installing
> Mono is a bit easier.
>
> There is a whole website devoted to banning Mono from all Linux
> distributions: http://boycottnovell.com <http://boycottnovell.com/>
>
> Personally, I like the idea of .Net on Linux.
>
> ''The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers,'' stated by Dick the
> Butcher in ''Henry VI,'' Part II, act IV, Scene II, Line 73
>
> Jeffrey McArthur
> cell: 610-389-0734
> home: 610-450-6115
> email: jeffmcarthur@... <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml',
'jeffmcarthur@...');>
> http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com <http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com/>
> http://twitter.com/JeffreyMcArthur
> http://jeffmcarthur.blogspot.com
>
> On Fri, 2 Oct 2009 16:32:13 -0400, you wrote:
>
>>
>> Has anyone deployed a .NET application on Mono and lived to tell the tale?
What are people's experiences been with .NET on Unix?
>>
>>
>>
>>dg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>       Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional
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Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (11)
#569 From: David Gitlin <david.gitlin@...>
Date: Sat Oct 3, 2009 2:10 pm
Subject: RE: MonoSpace Conference 		david.gitlin@...
Send Email Send Email
 
I agree that .NET on Unix is a great idea, but I also agree that its unlikely to happen.  Mono does not have sufficient support from any of the big players, and without that its not going anywhere.  Ultimately, no one is going to make a career decision to use Mono in a greenfield project that really matters.  I would either go with the traditional Java/Unix stack or of course .NET/WinTel.  I just don't see there being enough industry need or support for Mono to really take off.
 
Anyone disagree or have a different perspective?
dg
 
To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com
From: jeffmcarthur@...
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 2009 03:58:26 -0400
Subject: Re: [phillyaltnet] MonoSpace Conference

 
My experience with Mono is minimal. I have done a little more than a "Hello
World" application.

The biggest problem I see with Mono is not the technology, but the politics.
I have used Red Hat/Fedora for a long time. Fedora removed Mono from their
package list. Mono does not even list Red Hat or Fedora on this list of
supported versions of Linux.

I was interested in running Mono on my Fedora 6 server. I managed to get
Mono installed and running. If you are running Fedora 10 or 11 installing
Mono is a bit easier.

There is a whole website devoted to banning Mono from all Linux
distributions: http://boycottnovell.com

Personally, I like the idea of .Net on Linux.

''The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers,'' stated by Dick the
Butcher in ''Henry VI,'' Part II, act IV, Scene II, Line 73

Jeffrey McArthur
cell: 610-389-0734
home: 610-450-6115
email: jeffmcarthur@comcast.net
http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com
http://twitter.com/JeffreyMcArthur
http://jeffmcarthur.blogspot.com

On Fri, 2 Oct 2009 16:32:13 -0400, you wrote:

>
> Has anyone deployed a .NET application on Mono and lived to tell the tale? What are people's experiences been with .NET on Unix?
>
>
>
>dg


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Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (11)
#568 From: Jeffrey McArthur <jeffmcarthur@...>
Date: Sat Oct 3, 2009 7:58 am
Subject: Re: MonoSpace Conference 		jeffmcarthur
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
  
My experience with Mono is minimal. I have done a little more than a "Hello
World" application.

The biggest problem I see with Mono is not the technology, but the politics.
I have used Red Hat/Fedora for a long time. Fedora removed Mono from their
package list. Mono does not even list Red Hat or Fedora on this list of
supported versions of Linux.

I was interested in running Mono on my Fedora 6 server. I managed to get
Mono installed and running. If you are running Fedora 10 or 11 installing
Mono is a bit easier.

There is a whole website devoted to banning Mono from all Linux
distributions: http://boycottnovell.com

Personally, I like the idea of .Net on Linux.

''The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers,'' stated by Dick the
Butcher in ''Henry VI,'' Part II, act IV, Scene II, Line 73

Jeffrey McArthur
cell: 610-389-0734
home: 610-450-6115
email: jeffmcarthur@...
http://www.jeffreymcarthur.com
http://twitter.com/JeffreyMcArthur
http://jeffmcarthur.blogspot.com

On Fri, 2 Oct 2009 16:32:13 -0400, you wrote:

>
> Has anyone deployed a .NET application on Mono and lived to tell the tale? 
What are people's experiences been with .NET on Unix?
>
>
>
>dg

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (11)
#567 From: David Gitlin <david.gitlin@...>
Date: Fri Oct 2, 2009 8:32 pm
Subject: RE: MonoSpace Conference 		david.gitlin@...
Send Email Send Email
 
 Has anyone deployed a .NET application on Mono and lived to tell the tale?  What are people's experiences been with .NET on Unix?
 
dg
 
To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com
From: brian@...
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 11:28:21 -0400
Subject: [phillyaltnet] MonoSpace Conference

 
Hi everyone,

I believe I mentioned it in the past, but the MonoSpace conference is coming up fast, and is going to be an awesome learning experience and an opportunity to learn how to leverage your .NET skillset across many new platforms, from Linux to iPhone Apps (with the new, very cool dev platform MonoTouch).  Mono and MonoTouch will be discussed in our track at code camp, and this conference gives you a deeper dive, a chance to talk to the people behind Mono, MonoTouch, and even the new CodePlex Foundation open source initiative that Microsoft has created.  The momentum in the direction of cross platform and open source .NET development is really growing and I think it will take off in the next few  years.

The conference is includes two days of workshops (including Ayende Rahien's highly acclaimed Advanced NHibernate workshop) and two days of Open Space sessions, where the curriculum is decided by attendees.  I have been to several open space conferences (BarCamp Philly is another one coming up on November 14th that you should check out!) and they are unparalleled opportunities to learn from an incredible group of innovators, teachers, and technologists.  Very often, people request sessions on topics and end up with an industry leader talking personally to them about their questions.  You don't get that opportunity many places!

Aside from the Mono content, there will be industry leaders in the cloud computing space, open source, and tons of other leading edge technologies that converge in the .NET space.  I have been to other open space conferences organized by Scott Bellware, the organizer of Monospace, and they have hands down been some of the best learning and networking experiences of my life.  I owe it to Scott and other leaders I met at the original AltNetConf that Philly ALT.NET has been so successful.

So consider it!  I'll be there, as will several other Philly ALT.NET members, so let the group know if you are going, so we can organize a Philly dinner!

http://monospace.us


-Brian Donahue



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Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (11)
#566 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Fri Sep 25, 2009 3:28 pm
Subject: MonoSpace Conference 		brian.donahue
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email
 
Hi everyone,

I believe I mentioned it in the past, but the MonoSpace conference is coming up fast, and is going to be an awesome learning experience and an opportunity to learn how to leverage your .NET skillset across many new platforms, from Linux to iPhone Apps (with the new, very cool dev platform MonoTouch).  Mono and MonoTouch will be discussed in our track at code camp, and this conference gives you a deeper dive, a chance to talk to the people behind Mono, MonoTouch, and even the new CodePlex Foundation open source initiative that Microsoft has created.  The momentum in the direction of cross platform and open source .NET development is really growing and I think it will take off in the next few  years.

The conference is includes two days of workshops (including Ayende Rahien's highly acclaimed Advanced NHibernate workshop) and two days of Open Space sessions, where the curriculum is decided by attendees.  I have been to several open space conferences (BarCamp Philly is another one coming up on November 14th that you should check out!) and they are unparalleled opportunities to learn from an incredible group of innovators, teachers, and technologists.  Very often, people request sessions on topics and end up with an industry leader talking personally to them about their questions.  You don't get that opportunity many places!

Aside from the Mono content, there will be industry leaders in the cloud computing space, open source, and tons of other leading edge technologies that converge in the .NET space.  I have been to other open space conferences organized by Scott Bellware, the organizer of Monospace, and they have hands down been some of the best learning and networking experiences of my life.  I owe it to Scott and other leaders I met at the original AltNetConf that Philly ALT.NET has been so successful.

So consider it!  I'll be there, as will several other Philly ALT.NET members, so let the group know if you are going, so we can organize a Philly dinner!

http://monospace.us


-Brian Donahue


Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (11)
#565 From: David Gitlin <david.gitlin@...>
Date: Thu Sep 24, 2009 1:56 pm
Subject: RE: Code Camp (10/17) Registration Is Open 		david.gitlin@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Thanks for the reminder.
 
dg
 
To: phillyaltnet@yahoogroups.com
From: brian@...
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 09:18:29 -0400
Subject: [phillyaltnet] Code Camp (10/17) Registration Is Open

 
I think I may be a little late to announce this, but registration is officially open for Philly.NET Code Camp 2009.2.  Code camp is an all-day .NET conference with 60 sessions in 12 different tracks!  Our group organizes the ALT.NET track, and I'm pretty excited about our lineup:

8:30 Sean Carpenter - Escape XML-Hell! Love Your Builds Again with Rake and TeamCity!
10:00 Stephen Bohlen - Refactoring to a S.O.L.I.D. Foundation
12:30 Dane Morgridge - Crossing the Chasm: Develop, Build, and Deploy .NET Apps Cross-Platform with Mono
2:00 Brian Donahue - The TDD On-Ramp
3:30 John Feminella - Ruby for C#/.NET Developers 

For full track listings and registration:

http://www.phillydotnet.org/Default.aspx?tabid=805

How much does it cost for all this great content?  NOTHING!  It's free, brought to you by the community, for the community!  The guys at Philly.NET do a great job of getting sponsorships and organizing this huge event twice a year, and Philly ALT.NET is glad to be a part of it.  It's always a lot of fun, and we always get to meet some new friends.

Hope to see you there!

Brian




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#564 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Thu Sep 24, 2009 1:18 pm
Subject: Code Camp (10/17) Registration Is Open 		brian.donahue
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I think I may be a little late to announce this, but registration is officially open for Philly.NET Code Camp 2009.2.  Code camp is an all-day .NET conference with 60 sessions in 12 different tracks!  Our group organizes the ALT.NET track, and I'm pretty excited about our lineup:

8:30 Sean Carpenter - Escape XML-Hell! Love Your Builds Again with Rake and TeamCity!
10:00 Stephen Bohlen - Refactoring to a S.O.L.I.D. Foundation
12:30 Dane Morgridge - Crossing the Chasm: Develop, Build, and Deploy .NET Apps Cross-Platform with Mono
2:00 Brian Donahue - The TDD On-Ramp
3:30 John Feminella - Ruby for C#/.NET Developers 

For full track listings and registration:

http://www.phillydotnet.org/Default.aspx?tabid=805

How much does it cost for all this great content?  NOTHING!  It's free, brought to you by the community, for the community!  The guys at Philly.NET do a great job of getting sponsorships and organizing this huge event twice a year, and Philly ALT.NET is glad to be a part of it.  It's always a lot of fun, and we always get to meet some new friends.

Hope to see you there!

Brian



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#563 From: "MBeckius" <MBeckius@...>
Date: Tue Sep 22, 2009 3:35 pm
Subject: Job Opportunities 		MBeckius
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Hi, I am in need of two full-time C# developers- one Senior, one Junior. We
practice continuous integration, and many other modern development techniques. 
Are software is a commercial product, so we often spend much more time
designing/coding/testing than you would get in departmental or enterprise
application. If this sounds intriguing, check out the following:

http://philadelphia.craigslist.org/sof/1386591452.html
http://www.pyramed-health.com/

Sincerely,
Matt Beckius
mbeckius@...

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#562 From: Brian Donahue <brian@...>
Date: Tue Sep 22, 2009 3:02 pm
Subject: Re: Posting Policy 		brian.donahue
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Hi Matt,

Thanks for asking.  I know you've attended meetings and probably have a good understanding of the group, but since you posted to the list, I thought I'd give a more general answer.  Maybe I'll post it on the group homepage as well, as we get these requests fairly often.

My goal is to keep the signal to noise ratio very high (high signal, that is!) on this list, so I do not allow companies and recruiters to post jobs on our list.  That said, I don't want to discourage networking and news-sharing among our group.  So some general guidelines for referring job openings are:
  • You are an active member of the group (attend at least a few meetings a year)
  • You are not a recruiter or a company (if you are an owner/principal/hiring manager but attend meetings, then that's fine, but I don't want HR dept's, etc)
  • The email is brief, has a personal tone, with links/contact info for more details (not a dump of your job listings)
  • Finally, this one is a little harder to measure, but the jobs should be applicable to members of this group and have some attributes that are aligned with our values, for example:
    • Interested in finding/using best of breed tools/software, including open source
    • Quality-minded, open to or already using things like Test Driven Development, Code Reviews, etc
The first point sort of reinforces the last point - I assume that anyone has come to more than one or two meetings gets the jist of what our group is about and will know what they are looking for when they post to this group.

Thanks!

Brian


On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 10:27 AM, MBeckius <MBeckius@...> wrote:
Brian,

I am hiring two developers, what is the job posting policy on this board.

Thanks,

Matt Beckius



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#561 From: "MBeckius" <MBeckius@...>
Date: Tue Sep 22, 2009 2:27 pm
Subject: Posting Policy 		MBeckius
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Brian,

I am hiring two developers, what is the job posting policy on this board.

Thanks,

Matt Beckius

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#560 From: D. André Dhondt <d.andre.dhondt@...>
Date: Tue Sep 22, 2009 6:36 am
Subject: ANN: FREE conference--Agile Tour Philadelphia 		wile_e_kycodey
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The upcoming Agile Philly event is a jam-packed FREE conference, intended to help you, your team, and even old colleagues get revved up about agile (at least leaving work early should get you energized)!  We'll be hearing from a great lineup of speakers, who have presented in front of international audiences as well as locally. 

Tuesday, October 6, 4-7:30pm
Merck 1684 S. Broad Street, West Point, PA 19486

There are two tracks to this event--if you don't bring a friend with you to compare notes, you'll miss out.  So, don't just ask to get out of work early--ask your boss to come with you!  This is the equivalent of a 1-day course in agility, all at no cost to you (thanks, organizers)! 

Advance registration IS REQUIRED--sign up now at http://www.agiletour.com/en/at2009_philadelphia_registration.html

The current schedule, copied from http://www.agiletour.com/en/at2009_philadelphia.html is below:

TimeTrack One--IntroductoryTrack Two--Practitioners
4:00pm
Welcome
4:15pmKey Concepts of Agile
Ahmed Sidky, Program Director Agile 2009, aka Doctor Agile		Planning without Estimates
Bonnie Aumann, Presenter at Agile 2007-2009
5:00pm
PAUSE/icebreaker
5:30pmA Lightning-Fast Intro to Agile for Beginners
David Bulkin, CST		Agility: Getting The Right Product
Mike Bria, Agile Coach, Editor at InfoQ
6:30pm
An Open Space for All
7:15pm
What's next?


If you read this far, please forward this note to someone else who'd be interested.  Thanks!

--
D. André Dhondt
http://dhondtsayitsagile.blogspot.com/

Support low-cost conferences -- http://agiletour.org/
If you're in the area, join Agile Philly http://www.AgilePhilly.com


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