Hi,

I'm new to this group, so I wanted to introduce myself with a
translation that I made from LotR. It is the hymn to Elbereth
Gilthoniel starting with "Snow-white! Snow-white! O Lady clear!"

It is a first attempt at Quenya, so please correct any mistakes you
may find.

---
Niwispan! Niwispan! A Kher anpoy!
    A tâ telés i ayári ndûiva!
A Kál emmin ranir
    Ëässen galadiva lanna!

Gilthoniel! A Elbereth!
    Nir anpoyi khedily, nir ansil swesilya!
Niwispan! Niwispan! Glinamma elyen.
    Nonna teles ayar.

A eleni Gûnarra Coranarissë
    Sil manen erenen eredië
Pelessë waiwava nár sil-poy.
    Thetammë lotha telepva wana.

A Elbereth! Gilthoniel!
    Si nowommë, nor ndorla
Teles ndorssë unu galasse,
    Sil-elenva teles Ayari Nduiva.
---

Alak.

>From: alak_leafblower@...
>Subject: [quenya] A first try a Quenya
>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 18:28:03 -0000

**you might do better by sending this to the elfling list.  This list
(Quenya) is for speaking *in* Quenya.

>Hi,
>
>I'm new to this group, so I wanted to introduce myself with a
>translation that I made from LotR. It is the hymn to Elbereth
>Gilthoniel starting with "Snow-white! Snow-white! O Lady clear!"
>
>It is a first attempt at Quenya, so please correct any mistakes you
>may find.
>
>---
>Niwispan! Niwispan! A Kher anpoy!
>    A tâ telés i ayári ndûiva!
>A Kál emmin ranir
>    Ëässen galadiva lanna!

**Um, words that begin with g and nd don't normally occur in Quenya.  The
word for lady in Quenya is just heeri.  (the double e marks an e with an
accent, this convention is used on email lists because many people will see
your diacrits as a jumble).


>Gilthoniel! A Elbereth!

**these names are attested as Tintalle Varda in Quenya.  I think I'll just
stop. I don't know where you got anpoy.

** Lisa Star
** LisaStar@...
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Aiya nildor ar nilder,

aiquen sinome? Firne men sina? Sii iire haryalme Ainondo alta carma
Quenya tengwesto (*)? Coirea Quenya var vanwa Quenya?

(*) Aiquen ista malda quetta tan? Ainon, isiitielye Quenya
esseo carmalyan?

Ai, quettar, polilye quete men ammelda Quenya quettalya?

Inya naa _laurea_; ammelde hlonyar nar 'l', 'r' ar 'a', ar ohlon
'au' -- yee, melin Namaarie ar yesserya: _Ai laurie lantar lassi
suurinen_! Ar elye?


Alda (manan ilquen halda?)

at. Aiquen ahlaarie vinya linde Rindanen estaina 'Alassea cilya
(Mine naa faarea)'? Vanima linde, anwa? Yee, yee, sina lelya
Quenderin lambellon pella nan...
A tyave yando lindesse 'An hehtanyel' Taltaron!

--
**Merin melme var qualme, tana ta. (Matilda, _Leon: Canta Quenta_)


*****


Hello my friends [mas. + fem.],

[is] anyone here? This place died? Now when we have Helge's
great [covering both sences] work about Quenya grammar (*)?
Living Quenya or dead Quenya?
[*_carma_ "work, something made", cf. _parma_ "book, something
composed"; _var_ "or", from Qenyaqetsa, might be invalid]

(*) [Does] anyone know better word for it [sc. for 'course']?
Helge, have you thought about a Quenya name for your work?
[_malda_ "better", see last Tyalie Tyelellieeva; *_isiitie_
"have known"]

Hm, words, can you tell us your most beloved [sc. 'favorite']
Quenya word?

Mine is _laurea_ [= 'golden']; my most beloved sounds are 'l'
and 'a', and diphtong 'au' -- yeah, I like Namaarie and its
beginning: _Ai laurie lantar lassi suurinen_! And you?
[*_inya_ "mine"]


Ales (why [is] everyone hidden?)
[*_manan_ "why, for what [reason]"]

ps. Has anyone heard the new song by Orbital called 'Funny break
(One is enough)'? A beautiful song, is it not? Ok, ok, this goes
from beyond the Elvish languages but...
Taste/try also the album 'Since I left you' by The Avalanches!
[at. = _apa tecina_ "post scriptum"; I used _Rinda_ "circular",
no better word; _yando_ "also" from QQ, might be invalid;
*_lindesse_ "album, collection of songs"; I used nominalized
_talta_ "slide down" for "avalanche"]

--
**I want love or death, that's it. (Mathilda, _Léon: Version Intégrale_)

>From: Ales Bican <bican@...>

>Aiya nildor ar nilder,
>
>aiquen sinome? Firne men sina? Sii iire haryalme Ainondo alta carma
>Quenya tengwesto (*)? Coirea Quenya var vanwa Quenya?

**Sorry, this isn't in quenya, but I'm here and would like to see this list
revived.  I'll sit down with the texts and try to say something intelligent
--in quenya-- in my next post!

** Lisa Star

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Ales Bican wrote:

> [is] anyone here? This place died? Now when we have Helge's
> great [covering both sences] work about Quenya grammar?
> Living Quenya or dead Quenya?

** Revived Quenya, I hope... The problem of keeping alive a list devoted to
actually writing in Quenya for its own sake is of course that the people
who can readily put together a Quenya text, don't really have much to say
to one another. Obviously, the more people who actually know Quenya, the
easier would it be to maintain an all-Quenya list. So our problem is
educational, and I hope the course I am working out will be helpful.

> (*) [Does] anyone know better word for it [sc. for 'course']?

You used _tengwesta_ "grammar". No, I can't think of any better word. I
wish we had any Quenya words (or at least primitive roots) meaning "teach"
or "learn".

> Hm, words, can you tell us your most beloved [sc. 'favorite']
> Quenya word?
> Mine is _laurea_ [= 'golden']; my most beloved sounds are 'l'
> and 'a', and diphtong 'au' -- yeah, I like Namaarie and its
> beginning: _Ai laurie lantar lassi suurinen_!

I, too, tend to think of A as the most beautiful vowel; I also regard L as
the most beautiful consonant. On the other hand, I tend to think of U as
the ugliest vowel. The diphthong _au_ contains a strange tension...but yes,
the overall effect is pleasing. (But _ai_ is more attractive.)

> ps. Has anyone heard the new song by Orbital called 'Funny break
> (One is enough)'? A beautiful song, is it not? Ok, ok, this goes
> from beyond the Elvish languages but...

Ai! úmien hlaritas!
("Alas! I haven't heard it!" - just to have at least one fragment of Quenya
in this posting!)

- Ainon

Ainon tence:

> > [is] anyone here? This place died? Now when we have Helge's
> > great [covering both sences] work about Quenya grammar?
> > Living Quenya or dead Quenya?
>
> ** Revived Quenya, I hope...

**Merin sa men sina termaruva Tolkíno alcar enyalien. (To paraphrase
the Merin sentence and Cirion's Oath. *smile*)

> The problem of keeping alive a list devoted to
> actually writing in Quenya for its own sake is of course that the people
> who can readily put together a Quenya text, don't really have much to say
> to one another.

**Yes, I know this is the main problem. Had we enough words we could
talk at least about Quenya in Quenya. But I do not want to believe that
we do not have anything to tell to anyone.

> Obviously, the more people who actually know Quenya, the
> easier would it be to maintain an all-Quenya list. So our problem is
> educational, and I hope the course I am working out will be helpful.

**I believe it will help. But practice is also a very important thing!

> > (*) [Does] anyone know better word for it [sc. for 'course']?
>
> You used _tengwesta_ "grammar". No, I can't think of any better word. I
> wish we had any Quenya words (or at least primitive roots) meaning "teach"
> or "learn".

**I think you once suggested *_saita-_ "teach", lit. "make know,
understand" (SAY). But it is not genuine Tolkien.

> > Hm, words, can you tell us your most beloved [sc. 'favorite']
> > Quenya word?
> > Mine is _laurea_ [= 'golden']; my most beloved sounds are 'l'
> > and 'a', and diphtong 'au' -- yeah, I like Namaarie and its
> > beginning: _Ai laurie lantar lassi suurinen_!
>
> I, too, tend to think of A as the most beautiful vowel; I also regard L as
> the most beautiful consonant. On the other hand, I tend to think of U as
> the ugliest vowel. The diphthong _au_ contains a strange tension...but yes,
> the overall effect is pleasing. (But _ai_ is more attractive.)

**I do not like U, either. Seems that Tolkien thought alike: Quenya is
full of a's and the words containing u's are usually bad (like _úmea_,
_urko_, _ulundo_). And if lots of a's is a mark of beautiful language,
then Primitive Quendian must have been even more beautiful -- y'know
those syncopes and reductions of a's. (Oh no, it cannot have been more
beautiful, all those aspirated stops, phew, I do not like them,
especially kh.)
AI is also a very nice sound: I prefer _laire_ to _laure_, but _laurea_
is above all. : )

I think this can be written in Quenya, too -- it is not so difficult!

Umin mele U yando. Séya sa Tolkín sinte ve me: Quenya ná quanta
a-hlonion ar i quettar i haryar u-hloni nar sanyave saure (ve _úmea_,
_urko_, _ulundo_). Ar intyala sa úve a-hlonion ná tengwe vanima
lambeo, Quenderin né vanimalda -- istal tane racine ar vanwe hloni.
(Ai lá, úmes pole vanimalda, ilye tane hwesta-patacar, ai, umin melitat,
hérave kh.)
AI ná vanima hlon yando: laitan _laire_ or _laure_, nan _laurea_ ná
or ilya.

[*_séya-_ "look, seem, appear"; *_sanyave_ "normally, usually";
_intyala sa_ "supposing that"; *_vanimalda_ "more beautiful";
_úmes pole vanimalda_ "it could not [be] more beautiful"; *_hlon_
"sound"; *_hérave_ "chiefly, mainly"; _yando_ "also"]

> > ps. Has anyone heard the new song by Orbital called 'Funny break
> > (One is enough)'? A beautiful song, is it not? Ok, ok, this goes
> > from beyond the Elvish languages but...
>
> Ai! úmien hlaritas!
> ("Alas! I haven't heard it!" - just to have at least one fragment of Quenya
> in this posting!)

**Vanya linde!


Alda

ps. Ainon, úmielye quete men ammelda Quenya quettalya!
[Helge, you have not told us your favorite Quenya word!]

--
**I want love or death, that's it. (Mathilda, _Léon: Version Intégrale_)

----------------------------------------------------

vinya yoquetien!

aiya! naan vinya sina 1yoquetien.
essenya naa Seo Sanghyeon. naan 2Corea.

sii hiiran quettar ho Quettaparma Quenyanna.
ma naas voronda? ma istalye 3malda quettaparma?

epesse, eldarinwa essenya naa Earraame.
melin i ear, raamar, ar ciryar! ma nas faarea
4tyarwe essecilmeon? nas ata maara laamatyaavenyan.

neen Eldaquetesse ar hirne sina yoquetie
noo uulimbe reer. sii naan anwave alassea!

Aldan:

inye 4larta cenie linwenyo(Firinnor) ELM-esse.
ma lartuvan tenna Ambar-metta? ^^
(ve tencen mi Nainie Lambengolmoin...)

1 "yoquetie" naa vinyacaarienya. ma naas maara?
2 carnen quetta "Corea" ve {adjective} "Core"on.
   "Core" naa Korea. naan 5naira, nan uumin pole
   hire quetta {adjective}...
3 cenin sina quetta sinome minya. mallo nas?
4 hoo Parma Penyane Quettaron.
5 Alda nyarne nin quetta "naira" mi Eldaquete #5244.

elya Earraamello.

----------------------------------------------------

New to the list!

Hello! I am new to this 1list.
My name is Seo Sanghyeon. I am 2Korean.

Now I am finding words from Quettaparma Quenyanna.
Is it reliable? Do you know 3better wordlist?

Nickname, my Elvish name is Earraame.
I like the sea, wings, and ships! Isn't it enough
4reason of name-choosing? It is also nice to my sound-taste.

I was in Elfling and found this list
before not-many days. Now I am really happy!

To Ales Bican:

I 4wait to see my poem(Firinnor) at ELM.
Should I wait until the end of the world? ^^
(as I wrote in Lament for Loremasters of Tounges...)

1 "yoquetie" is my coining. Is it fit?
2 I made word "Corea" as adjective of "Core".
   "Core" is Korea. I am sorry, but I couldn't
   find word "adjective"...
3 I see this word here first. Where is it from?
4 From Parma Penyane Quettaron.
5 Ales Bican told me word "naira" in Elfling #5244.

From your Earraame.

----------------------------------------------------

tencen: [I wrote:]

> Aldan:
> inye 4larta cenie linwenyo(Firinnor) ELM-esse.
> ma lartuvan tenna Ambar-metta? ^^

neen raica! sii polin cene linwenya nastemenelyasse.
[I was wrong! Now I can see my poem at your website.]

elya Earraamello

Earraame tence:

> vinya yoquetien!
>
> aiya! naan vinya sina 1yoquetien.
> essenya naa Seo Sanghyeon. naan 2Corea.

**Aiya Earraame! Vanya cenie vinya Quenya-queto sinome imbe me.
[Hi Earraame! Nice to see a new Quenya-speaker here among us.]
[*_queto_ "speaker", actually _quende_ would be "speaker", but we
are not elves.]

> sii hiiran quettar ho Quettaparma Quenyanna.
> ma naas voronda? ma istalye 3malda quettaparma?

**Laa, umin ista malda quettaparma. Ainon ontane ta, naas
maara tengwe voronweo.
[No, I do not know better wordlist. Helge created it, that is
a good mark of reliability.]

> epesse, eldarinwa essenya naa Earraame.
> melin i ear, raamar, ar ciryar! ma nas faarea
> 4tyarwe essecilmeon? nas ata maara laamatyaavenyan.

**Maara len.
[Good for you.]

> neen Eldaquetesse ar hirne sina yoquetie
> noo uulimbe reer. sii naan anwave alassea!

**Maybe better and more elegant way would be _reeli yaa_
"some days ago", hm?

> Aldan:
>
> inye 4larta cenie linwenyo(Firinnor) ELM-esse.
> ma lartuvan tenna Ambar-metta? ^^
> (ve tencen mi Nainie Lambengolmoin...)

**Nees tanome. Polilye yuhta _alalme_ ve Quenya esse yando.
[It is there. You can use _alalme_ (sc. "elm-tree") ve the Quenya
name.] [*_yuhta_ "use"]
I applogize it took so long. But the site is not mine, it belongs to a
friend of mine, and I do not have a direct access to it (I have never
asked for it, I would get it, but I have no need of it), so every time
I want to add something there, I must send it to my friend and he will
upload it. And he was not at home for some time and then I was not
at home for some time. But it is there, so everyone can look there.
http://www.inf.upol.cz/~mullerr/theresa/
I admit I could have chosen a better way, I could have chosen my
own place for my website, but I do not like popping up windows
and ads.

> 1 "yoquetie" naa vinyacaarienya. ma naas maara?

**Might be. Btw, _vinyacaarie_ should probably be rather _vinyacarie_.
Note _enyalien_, not **_enyaalien_.

> 2 carnen quetta "Corea" ve {adjective} "Core"on.
>   "Core" naa Korea. naan 5naira, nan uumin pole
>   hire quetta {adjective}...

**I would like more _Corea_ for _Korea_, but as you like. : )

> 3 cenin sina quetta sinome minya. mallo nas?

**I will lower to using English... *smile* Some time ago Lisa Star
published a new issue of her journal Tyalie Tyelellieeva. In this
issue, she brought an article on comparatives in Quenya. The material
she used for this article was called CB Grammar. Briefly: the
comparative is formed from the positive by adding _-lda_, the
superlative from the comparative by adding _-n_ (or from the positive
by adding _-ldan_, which is the same). So
_malina_ "yellow"
*_malinalda_ "more yellow"
*_malinaldan_ "most yellow"
(These examples are just examples based on the information provided.)
As for _malda_ "better", this is probably an 'irregular' form,
and it is found in the phrase _malda la muntar_ "better than
nothing".
You might have heard about this matter on Elfling recently. It
was Candon McLean who brought more light on the CB Grammar. It is
implying from his words that the reliability of the Grammar is
*very* questionable. We cannot be sure whether it is really as
Tolkien meant it, so everything from the CB Grammar may be wrong.
So the word _malda_ may be nonsense and cannot be relied on. On the
other hand, we have not been provided with any better word for
"better".

> 2 I made word "Corea" as adjective of "Core".
>   "Core" is Korea. I am sorry, but I couldn't
>   find word "adjective"...

**There is none as far as I am aware.


Alda

--
**I want love or death, that's it. (Mathilda, _Léon: Version Intégrale_)

aiya aiquen cuina sinome! ^^

apa anda loar lartieva, enquiet yaa, nelde-rasta(?)
reesse Cermieva, Corea {translate}-ie 1Heru Million-wa
2latyane Corelienna vanimave. sii haryas ilye
{appendix}-i. teli uumir ea men an sii -- D,E ar F.
parmacaaro Laurea-olwa carne sina maara carme.

Coresse 3aaye {translate}-ie Yemun-o, i naa uuvoorima
ar {prologue}, {appendix}-i pena. car i quen cenuva
Curumollo taltieryasse, laa taapollor Nuumello!

1 Eldaquet #4598, EJK tence sa Tolciin {translate}-ne
   esse parmaryo ve "Heru Million".
2 cennen sina quetta er mi 4"Gwaith-i-Phethdain". mallo
   nas? ar manen 4"Gwaith-i-Phethdain" tana te -lle, laa
   -lye? (mi quentele "merin sa harya[lle] alasse!")
3 hoo enwina talma AYA... 5cendanen sin hoo Appleyard-o
   "Quenya Grammar Reexamined".
4 man nuuva "Gwaith-i-Phethdain" Quenyanen?
5 Eldaquet #2996, Ainon tence, "Vinyar Tengwar" 41 antane
   sina quetta.

* ma istalye Eldarin quettar,
   {translate, appendix, prologue}?

elya Earraamello

------------------------------------------------------

Hello, whoever alive here! ^^

After long years of waiting, a couple of weeks ago, at 15th
day of July, Korean translation of 1the Lord of the Rings
2opened to the Korean people appropriately. Now it has
all appendicies. Some of them were not with us till now -- D,E and F.
Book-maker Goldenbough did this nice job.

In Korea, there 3has been a Yemun's translation, which is unfaithful
and without a prologue and appendicies. Act that one would see
from Saruman in his collapse, not from blockers from the West!

1 Elfling #4598, EJK wrote that Tolkien translated
   name of his book as Heru Million.
2 I saw this word only in 4Gwaith-i-Phethdain. Where is
   it from? And why 4Gwaith-i-Phethdain shows us -lle, not
   -lye? (in the sentence "merin sa harya[lle] alasse!")
3 From old root AYA... I 5read this from Appleyard's
   Quenya Grammar Reexamined.
4 What would be "Gwaith-i-Phethdain" in Quenya?
5 Elfling #2296, Helge wrote, Vinyar Tengwar 41 gave
   this word.

* Do you know Elvish words,
   translate, appendix, prologue?

From your Earraame

------------------------------------------------------

+ I didn't mention words from QQ and PPQ.

+ Some comments on paraphrasing...

1 It was two weeks ago, so I used a dual, perhaps not
   appropriate.
2 I couldn't find 15th (cardinal), so I just used 15
   (ordinal).
3 I wrote opened to people, instead of "published".
4 I used -li plural _teli_ for "some of them".
5 What can be Quenya equivalent of "D,E and F"?
6 As you might notice, book-maker for "publisher".
7 Word "unfaithful" means "piracy" indeed.
8 I translated "Goldenbough" to _Laurea-olwa_, but left
   "Yemun". "Yemun" is a Korean word formed from Kanji
   (Chinese Letters), and can be translated literally as
   "literal writing(s)".
9 Last sentence, as you might find, is a Quenya translation
   of Tolkien's own word: "Dealings one might expect of
   Saruman in his decay rather than from the defenders of
   the West".

+ Some requests...

Does Appleyard have a Quenya name? How about his essay "Quenya
Grammar Reexamined"? Does EJK have his Elvish name? Are there any
lists which contain "national terms"? (Such as America, England,
France, Norway, Finland, Hungary...) Are there any sort of
"Quenya thesaurus"? Yes, I know of "Quenya Botany" and "Taste of
Elvish" in Ardalambion...

--- In quenya@y..., SKC8563@h... wrote:

> "Quenya thesaurus"? Yes, I know of "Quenya Botany" and "Taste of
> Elvish" in Ardalambion...

Well, there's Parma Eldalamberon No. 12, Qenyaqetsa, but most
unfortunately it is out of stock.

For Quenya, the mature version, I'm not aware of such a lexicon,
although there are several lists floating around on the web, some
better than others.  I'm currently studying these intermittedly . . .

Lola

Aiya, Nildonyar!

Earrame wrote:

>   And why 4Gwaith-i-Phethdain shows us -lle, not
>   -lye? (in the sentence "merin sa harya[lle] alasse!")

In my opinion 2nd pers. has many different endings in Quenya (see my article
on Elvish pronouns at Gwaith-i-Phethdain):

sg

reverential _-lye_, _-l_ (< CE *_-lje_, *_-l_)
familiar _-tye_, _-t_ (< CE *_-kje_, *_-k_)

pl

reverential _-lle_ (< *_-lle_)
familiar _-cce_ (< *_kke_)

The ending _-lle_ is attested in early versions of Namárie (see the HoMe).

> 4 What would be "Gwaith-i-Phethdain" in Quenya?

Maybe _Heren Quettanon_? [*_quettano_ < _quetta_ + _tano_)

Namárie,

Ryszard Derdzinski
(Alyanorno)

maggot@... or galadhorn@...

"Gwaith-i-Phethdain" http://www.elvish.org/gwaith
"Polish Tolkien Society" http://www.parmadili.w.pl
"Silesian Homeland" http://www.kki.net.pl/~derdzinscy

*********************************************************************
"Pent Fangorn Onod: Thinna i ardhon: han mathon ne nen, han mathon ne chef,
han noston ne gwilith." - 'Said Fangorn the Ent: The world is changing: I
feel it in the water, I feel it in the earth, and I smell it in the air'.

John Ronald Reuel Tolkien "Many Partings" in "The Return of the King"

*********************************************************************

Let's do some Borges.

I started with the last paragraph of Ulrike. Here I would continue
with The Circular Ruins, which is one of my favorites.

Translation is somewhat rough and contains some over-used or
obsolete words. Suggestions would be truly welcomed.

--------------------------------------------------

[ Original ]

The Circular Ruins

by Jorge Luis Borges

For what had happened many centuries before was repeating itself.
The ruins of the sanctuary of the god of Fire was destroyed by fire.
In a dawn without birds, the wizard saw the concentric fire licking
the walls. For a moment, he thought of taking refuge in the water,
but then he understood that death was coming to crown his old age
and absolve him from his labors. He walked toward the sheets of
flame. They did not bite his flesh, they caressed him and flooded
him without heat or combustion. With relief, with humiliation, with
terror, he understood that he also was an illusion, that someone
else was dreaming him.

--------------------------------------------------

[ Translation ]

I Rinde Atalantier

Horhe Luis Borhesenen

Ya amartie noo linyeeni tatyane ata. I hehtaina uur-ainuva yaana
raacina uurnen. Aarasse aiwevilte, sairon cenne uur austa rambar.
Sinta lusse, sananes varna meno mi neen, nan sintes sa faireo tulie
naa antien son rie linyeeniryaren ar lehtien son mootaryallor. Vantas
naurnna. Naur uume nace hraaverya, nan orsirne sonna laa yo uure var
ustie. Yo lehtie, yo ilalcar, yo osse, sintes sa naas olos, oolane
monen.

--------------------------------------------------

[ Translation of Translation ]

The Circular Down-falls

by Horhe Luis Borhes

What has happened before many-years repeated again. The forsaken
Fire-god's sanctuary was broken by fire. In a dawn birdless, the
wizard saw the fire licking the walls. In a short time, he thought
of safe place in the water, but he knew that death's coming is for
giving him a crown for his long-years and for releasing him from his
toils. He walked to the flame. The flame did not bite his flesh, but
over-flowed upon him not with heat or burning. With relief, with
dis-glory, with terror, he knew that he was an image, dreamed by
someone.

--------------------------------------------------

Earraamello.

I looked up these words from three glossaries: Quettaparma Quenyanna,
Parma Penyane Quettaron, Quenys Corpus Wordlist. I used the following
also: Taste of Elvish, Quenya Affixes.

Oron Halla (laamatyalie)

Aiya, ilye Quenyaquetor sinome!
(Var Quenyatecor...?)

Lenden Tol Jeju, Tol Olostanna. Vanima Loona!
Naas Hyarmenearesse, hyarmen Coreo. Tolo endesse
ea Oron Halla, Coreo orontion anhalla - minya
Halla Corelambe, telda halla Eldalambe. :-)
maara laamatyalie!

Iluuve siiren. Elya Earraamello.

---

Mt. Halla (pun)

Hail, all Quenya-speakers here!
(Or Quenya-writers...?)

I went to Jeju, the dreamy isle. Beautiful island!
It is at the South Sea, the south of Korea.
There is Mt. Halla at the center of the isle,
the tallest(anhalla) of mountains of Korea -
the first Halla is Korean, the last _halla_ is Elvish. :-)
Good sound-play!

All for today. From your Earraame.

> maara laamatyalie!

Yee.. Auri sine hlarilme vinyar Pacistanello, ar noore tanasse (laa haira i
reenallo, sanan) ea osto estaina _Quetta_!

Inye oi sana i Quenya quetto "quetta" iire hlarin esse tana...

- Ainon




[Yeah... These days we hear news from Pakistan, and in that country (not
far from the border, I think) there is a city called _Quetta_!

I always think of the Quenya word "quetta" when I hear that name...

- Helge]

Ainon tenke:

> > maara laamatyalie!
>
> Yee.. Auri sine hlarilme vinyar Pacistanello, ar noore tanasse (laa haira i
> reenallo, sanan) ea osto estaina _Quetta_!
>
> Inye oi sana i Quenya quetto "quetta" iire hlarin esse tana...

**Var i esse _Marquette_ -- maar quettaron? IIrima laaamatyalie.
Nan laa naan i minya i sin quente, hlarnenyes Eruuve Elenello.


Alda

[**Or the name _Marquette_ -- home of words? Lovable pun.
But I am not the first who said this/thus, I heard it from
Lisa Star.]

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Liireli

Earraamenen

Beoulph 1159b-1162b

lirilla telen',
i lindo linde.
alma ortane,
calyan' alasse;
colindor calpa
yulmallor limpe.

Maldon 312-313

sanwe nauva verya
ar oore laice
indo nauva tulca
tuomma piicalasse.

----

Parts of Songs

by Earraame

Beowulf 1159b-1162b

Leoth waes asungen,
gleomannes gyd.
Gamen eft astah,
beorhtode bencsweg;
byrelas sealdon
win of wunderfatum.

  The lay was finished,
  the gleeman's song.
  Then glad rose the revel;
  bench-joy brightened.
  Bearers draw
  from their wonder-vats wine.

Maldon 312-313

Hige sceal the heardra,
heorte the cenre,
mod sceal the mare
the ure maegen lytlath.

  Thought shall be harder,
  heart keener,
  mood shall be more [resolved],
  as our main [strength] lessens.

Meeran hlare noalyar teecaleo sina.

An sin Eru melle Ambar: Antaneero minnostaina yondorya, ta ilye queni arwa
estelo mi so uvar fire, nan haryuvar coire tennoio.

Poolalye quete nin i ammaara tie ahya ta? Noan quettanyar taanala 'so' ar
'that' umar pasta. Queen eteecie sin? Hantanyel.


I (would) like to hear your thoughts on this writing.

For thus God loved the World: He gave his only-born son, that all people
having faith in him will not die, but will possess life eternally.

Can you tell me the best way to say it? I think my words indicating 'so' and
'that' are not smooth. Has someone (already) written this? Thanks.


Cuiviendil

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Nathan Roy tence:

> Meeran hlare noalyar teecaleo sina.

_tengwe_ ve "writing" laa _teecale_?
Sanan sa _noa_ naa maara quetta sinome. Hantanyel!

> An sin Eru melle Ambar: Antaneero minnostaina yondorya,
> ta ilye queni arwa estelo mi so uvar fire, nan haryuvar
> coire tennoio.

_An Eru melle Ambar antanes mine ar erya yondorya, ar aiquen
voronda son uuvar fire nan haryuvar oira cuile._

_-s_ ve _-ro_, _cuile_ ve _coire_. Ma _uva_ raica _uuva_?
Sanan sa _aiquen_ maara sinome. Ma sanat, _voronda son_
laa _arwa estelo mi so_? Mallo _minnostaina_? "one and only"
nauva _mine ar erya_. Sanan _oira cuile_.

> Poolalye quete nin i ammaara tie ahya ta? Noan quettanyar
> taanala 'so' ar 'that' umar pasta. Queen eteecie sin? Hantanyel.

> Cuiviendil

Earraame

Crime and Punishment
Part II Chapter VI

Fyodor Dostoevskii
(Constance Garnett)

----

Raskolnikov describes Peterburg... One of my favorites.

----

Ma melil malle-lindale? Melin sa hlare nandelle-liire, morne
ringe quelle-anduunissen -- nauvante ringe -- iire ilye ranyar
haryar helwe laiwe antar, var iire mixe nieninqui lantear teerave
laa suuresse -- ma hanyalyen? -- ar malle-calmar calir ter te...

----

Do you like street music? I love to hear singing to a street
organ, I like it on cold, dark, damp autumn evenings -- they
must be damp -- when all the passers-by have pale green, sickly
faces, or better still when wet snow is falling straight down,
when there's no wind -- you know what I mean? -- and street
lamps shine through it...

----

Earraamello.

Hi, he says in common speech! Uh, sorry, I'm just a beginner,
although I would love to see someone translate this little ditty:

                   Tigre, tigre,
                   brile brule,
                   in arborum
                   nox obscura

be that as it may, and I hope someone tries it, but what I need is
info on a man in Victoria, B.C., Canada, Robert Noyes, I think, who
many years ago invented  NUQUENYA, which greatly simplifed the
writing of the Lorien and Sindarin tongues, but in fact, ANYTHING, in
ANY LANGUGE, could be written. My "Googling" turned up nothing, so
I've joined this group to see what I shall see.
  I met this fellow in 1981, and had many a lovely fire-side chat (in
English!) he had prepared a small card with the runes for each
letter, some additional non-English runes, and all I can remember is
he used J.R.R.T's runic languge, but he had the majority of  the
diacritics carried on the preceding vowel. Any help here?
Write to : mikalhuber@...
Or post reply here.

Hi, he says in common speech! Uh, sorry, I'm just a beginner,
although I would love to see someone translate this little ditty:

                   Tigre, tigre,
                   brile brule,
                   in arborum
                   nox obscura

be that as it may, and I hope someone tries it, but what I need is
info on a man in Victoria, B.C., Canada, Robert Noyes, I think, who
many years ago invented  NUQUENYA, which greatly simplifed the
writing of the Lorien and Sindarin tongues, but in fact, ANYTHING, in
ANY LANGUAGE, could be written, hence my example in esperanto.
  My "Googling" turned up nothing, so I've joined this group to see
what I shall see.
  I met this fellow in 1981, and had many a lovely fire-side chat (in
English!) he had prepared a small card with the runes for each
letter, some additional non-English runes, and all I can remember is
he used J.R.R.T's runic languge, but he had the majority of  the
diacritics carried on the preceding vowel. Any help here?
Write to : mikalhuber@...
Or post reply here.

Hi!
I was wondering if anyone could help me with writing to Quenyan...
I'd like to write my name "Kirsi" with "Tengwar Quenya" font...
So please help me!!!

*Kirsi*

Merry Christmas :)

hello everyone im a new member i cannot write quenya using the words
but i can write it using the font if that makes sense so ill have to
post in english

Aiya Lambengolmor !

First I'd like to apologize to post in English, but it would be VERY
difficult to reply to newbies in Quenya !

Kirsi wrote :

> I was wondering if anyone could help me with writing to Quenyan...
> I'd like to write my name "Kirsi" with "Tengwar Quenya" font...
> So please help me!!!

Perhaps you should go to the Elfscript list, a mailing list dedicaced to the
use of Tengwar and runes.

xelanotlob wrote :

> hello everyone im a new member i cannot write quenya using the words
> but i can write it using the font if that makes sense so ill have to
> post in english

The goal of the Quenya list is to post in Quenya ! You should not confuse
_languages_ (like Quenya or Sindarin) and _alphabets_ (Tengwar or runes).
Quenya is not a translation of English in another alphabet, it's a language
of its own, with its history (internal and external, its phonology, its
grammar, ...).

If you want to learn Quenya, you should go to the Elfling mailing list and
to Ardalambion (http://www.uib.no/People/hnohf/), this great site contain a
very good Quenya course.

Namárie !

i have been to ardalambion and got the course but i am only interested in the
runes i would like to learn how to speak it but that is not tolkien wanted to
happen with with his languages, people forming cults and only speaking his
languages that is not what he intended.
thanks for the tip anyway
Alex Bolton

namarie
i cannot be bothered with accutes

where did you al find the words for quenya, and how long did i take
for all of you to learn to spak it aswell as you all can????????????

Alex Bolton
(xelanotlob2@...) send all mail here please
namarie

Alex Bolton wrote :

> i have been to ardalambion and got the course but i am only interested in
the
> runes i would like to learn how to speak it but that is not tolkien wanted
to
> happen with with his languages, people forming cults and only speaking his
> languages that is not what he intended.

You can't speak runes, because runes are just an _alphabet_ (i.e. a system
of writing) used to transcribe _languages_. You can't say "I'd like to speak
cyrillic", but you can say "I'd like to speak greek".
  You should not confuse _alphabets_ and _languages_ !

I don't think that people etrying to speak Tolkien's invented languages are
"cults" ! They are just people involved in a linguistic research about the
invented tongues of a dead writter.

I don't know if Tolkien didn't want to learn his elvish tongues. On the
contrary, I think that it was perhaps his intention to give people the
desire to study them, else he would'nt have used them in his stories and
would have kept them for himself only.

> namarie
> i cannot be bothered with accutes

The accutes accents mark a long vowel and long vowels are written
differently from normal vowels in Tolkien's invented alphabets.

> where did you al find the words for quenya, and how long did i take
for all of you to learn to spak it aswell as you all can????????????

There only sources for quenya words are Tolkien's writtings ! There are some
internet ressources where these words are collected :

Quettaparma Quenyanna (http://www.elvenlords.subnet.dk/xtra/wordlist.html) :
"The wordbook to quenya", an English-Quenya wordlist.

Parma Penyane Quettaron (http://www.elvish.org/gwaith/ppq_intro.htm) : "The
book of missing words", a wordlist of reconstructed or newly published
words.

But I though you were only interested in runes !

Namárie !

Sébastien Bertho, A.K.A. Toko

true u raise some good points, and i know the difference between runes and
spoken language but my first intention was to learn the runes then maybe
ascend to the spoken language itself later. i would appreciate your help as
you seem to be knowledgeable in the ways of quenya

namarie
i would write accutes but i cannot be bothered to find the symbol is what i
meant to say.
Alex Bolton

Aiya !

Alex Bolton wrote :

> true u raise some good points, and i know the difference between runes and
> spoken language but my first intention was to learn the runes then maybe
> ascend to the spoken language itself later. i would appreciate your help
as
> you seem to be knowledgeable in the ways of quenya

For the runes and writting systems, you should look at the Elfscript mailing
list : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/elfscript/

To learn more about quenya and others languages of Pr. Tolkien, you should
go to the Elfling mailing list : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/elfling

Ardalambion is a great site you should look at :
http://www.uib.no/People/hnohf/

When you will know enough to make some sentences in quenya, you'll be able
to come back to this list and post in this tongue.

> please may you send me a list of common helpful words i could use to
start to build simple words and sentances so i may begin to post in
quenya thankyou

There is a good wordlist to start with at Ardalambion :
http://www.uib.no/People/hnohf/qlist.htm

But to write in quenya you'll have to learn the grammar also and I advice
you to read Helge's very good quenya course :
http://www.uib.no/People/hnohf/qcourse.htm

> namarie
> i would write accutes but i cannot be bothered to find the symbol is what
i
> meant to say.

OK. If you don't know how to write the accents, you can type _aa_ instead of
_á_ (some people can't see correctly the accents and it's an accepted
spelling ).

Namaarie !

Toko