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Using HTTP Link: headers for web linking non-hypertext   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #13049 of 14353 |
Re: [rest-discuss] Using HTTP Link: headers for web linking non-hypertext

> This looks just right for a one-many link (as in my #1 option --
> post to a
> cart "collection" resource) in which the "one" is obvious and easily
> discoverable (like a cart). But a common case I run into is a one
> in which
> a resource must be linked to any of a large number of possible related
> resources. (In my case it is a digital image library, in which we
> regularly
> need to create links between items, e.g., a link from a photo of an
> architect to an image of a building that she created.). We have
> needed to
> devise as general an operation as possible to *relate* two
> resources. In
> the case of a cart and a product, it is obvious what the
> relationship will
> be once it is created. We have need to create links between
> resources that
> may have any of a large number of relations (e.g., "created-by"). I
> wish to
> stay in the realm of Atom (avoiding complexities of RDF). I am
> reminded
> somewhat here by the work going on in activities streams....
> Anyway, I
> agree with Sam that it is currently an unsolved problem with wide
> applicability.
>

So, when you let clients establish links between resources, who
controls whether a link is valid or bogus?

What is the advantage of the client owning this problem?

Forgetting about HTTP and REST for a bit, would you still take the
same approach if you are building this application using a different
style? What I am getting at is, is the "link management" problem real,
or is it a manifestation of an implementation choice?

Subbu



Tue Jun 30, 2009 10:17 pm

sallamar
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Message #13049 of 14353 |
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... They (browsers) do not. But that is besides the point for this thread. The key question being debated is whether link management is a client concern or it...
Subbu Allamaraju
sallamar
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Jul 1, 2009
4:37 pm

... Ok so here's a separate but similar issue. I've just released an Internet-Draft...
Sam Johnston
sam.johnston...
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Jul 1, 2009
11:18 pm

... The point is you don't have to be able to create links to consume them and vice versa. Both servers and clients create links and there seems little point...
Sam Johnston
sam.johnston...
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Jul 1, 2009
4:35 pm

Hi Subbu- ... This looks just right for a one-many link (as in my #1 option -- post to a cart "collection" resource) in which the "one" is obvious and easily ...
Peter Keane
pkeane_littl...
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Jun 30, 2009
8:29 pm

Peter, ... This is a great use case - thanks a lot. ... I'm going one step further in eliminating the Atom for individual resources. That would allow you...
Sam Johnston
sam.johnston...
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Jun 30, 2009
8:50 pm

... So, when you let clients establish links between resources, who controls whether a link is valid or bogus? What is the advantage of the client owning this...
Subbu Allamaraju
sallamar
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Jun 30, 2009
10:26 pm

... Good questions. Certainly, it'll be the server that controls what's a valid "linkage", but the range of possibilities might be (nearly) infinite. And I ...
Peter Keane
pkeane_littl...
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Jul 1, 2009
1:33 am

FWIW, Link *Headers* make sense to me when the link are metadata about the resource. However, when the links are to be treated as first-class resources ...
mike amundsen
mamund
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Jul 1, 2009
3:02 am

I agree with mike. IMHO, it seems it is here a meta level problem w.r.t. the application vs. protocol POV. Taking the building/architect example, the architect...
Yannick Loiseau
pioupiougroups
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Jul 1, 2009
9:49 am

Yannick, Does this not strike you as far more complicated than necessary? Under your proposal I need to do a bunch of requests and understand a new language...
Sam Johnston
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Jul 1, 2009
1:46 pm

... Indeed, this is a little overhead since here I modeled a one-to-many (or many-to-many as suggested before) relationship, and added more semantic than...
Yannick Loiseau
pioupiougroups
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Jul 1, 2009
3:38 pm

... Do you mean like this? GET /cart "cart" : {... , "products": [], .... } adding products: PUT /cart "cart": {..., "products": [ "/products/143",...
Mike Kelly
pleb1985
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Jul 1, 2009
2:24 pm

... Mike- Yes, that's basically what I was proposing. (I was thinking specifically in terms of Atom, but the GET/EDIT/PUT pattern is exactly the approach I...
Peter Keane
pkeane_littl...
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Jul 1, 2009
4:28 pm

... Let's leave aside the issue on whether to introduce LINK and UNLINK. What about the value of Link headers themselves? I really like the idea of...
Bill Burke
patriot1burke
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Jul 1, 2009
12:26 pm

What is "polluting" about links? I suspect that you are talking about adding links to an object serialized into XML is polluting the representation. But is...
Subbu Allamaraju
sallamar
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Jul 1, 2009
1:09 pm

Subbu, I'm thinking more of the case where you have more generic services that need to know about certain relationships but don't understand the data format. ...
Bill Burke
patriot1burke
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Jul 1, 2009
1:41 pm

Exactly - it's about making non-hypertext resources first class citizens on the Internet in an intuitive, RESTful manner. Sure I could base64 encode them and...
Sam Johnston
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Jul 1, 2009
1:57 pm

I'm thinking even for hypertext-based resources you'd want link headers. Headers seem much much more simpler than requiring a envelope format like Atom. ... --...
Bill Burke
patriot1burke
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Jul 1, 2009
2:10 pm

Ah. That makes sense. (To fully take advantage of these headers and entity headers in general, client APIs will need to start including headers as part of...
Subbu Allamaraju
sallamar
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Jul 1, 2009
2:31 pm

... Ditto - the question was about devising a "means to manage the implied relationship". The designers of HTTP planned to do it with LINK and UNLINK, but I...
Sam Johnston
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Jun 26, 2009
1:29 pm

... Its not just about raw performance though. There's also a barrier to entry problem very similar to SOAP and CORBA. Before I heard about Atom, one of the...
Bill Burke
patriot1burke
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Jun 26, 2009
2:39 pm
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