... There are a bunch of missing pieces. WSDL for HTTP resources needs to happen. Work on event models needs to get finished. Maybe store and forward (the...
... Agreed. I've seen way too many XML apps traipse through raw DOMs picking out their data. Getting the your data in readily consumable bits is a great...
1163
Jeff Bone
jbone@...
May 1, 2002 2:47 pm
... That's a failure of imagination. ;-) Seriously, the parallels are quite significant. In effect, URIs are generic functions that dispatch on message,...
1164
Mark Baker
distobj@...
May 1, 2002 2:55 pm
... Perhaps, but with nowhere near the urgency, and nowhere near the complexity of WSDL. WSDL exists, and is a necessary part of Web Services, because you...
1165
Paul Prescod
paul@...
May 1, 2002 4:39 pm
... What I meant was: a defining characteristic of functional programming is a lack of side-effects and mutation. In other words, if f(x,y) returns z today, it...
1166
Paul Prescod
paul@...
May 1, 2002 4:44 pm
... WSDL for HTTP is -- as far as I can tell -- exactly as functional as WSDL for SOAP. That doesn't mean that WSDL is REST-ful, but it does mean ... How does...
1167
Paul Prescod
paul@...
May 1, 2002 5:19 pm
... The "only machines will see it" argument is the typical of the approach of people who don't care about syntax. ;) ... Well yes, some of it is completely...
... Point taken. ... By allowing SOAP-RPC to be transported over event protocols such as JMS, and by having a more fleshed out model for intermediaries....
... Pretty much. Paul may consider optional parameters a simplification, but from a toolkit perspective it is a complexity. It also doesn't help that there...
... Which is exactly the subset that should use HTTP GET. It might be interesting to compare all REST features with the features of 'unpure' functional...
1171
Paul Prescod
paul@...
May 1, 2002 7:32 pm
... But GET is also good for fetching information that changes over time: like stock quotes. Paul Prescod...
... Yes, that's why languages like Haskell have some side-effect mechanisms. But they are designed very careful and maybe comparing those features with REST...
1173
Jeff Bone
jbone@...
May 1, 2002 7:47 pm
... The functional programming community realized, oh, circa the Miranda->Haskell transition that this interpretation of function restricted functional...
Paul already made the comment that comparing REST to programming language paradigms is like comparing apples to elephants. The Web is not a programming...
1175
Jeff Bone
jbone@...
May 1, 2002 8:30 pm
... Yes, but just because Paul (or anyone else) makes such a comment doesn't mean that it's true or useful. (I.e.: it may be that this is an apples and...
... I didn't mean to imply that (when it comes to REST) what Paul says, goes. That was just my way of saying that I thought that particular comment of his was...
1177
Jeff Bone
jbone@...
May 1, 2002 9:01 pm
... I don't actually agree with this. While it's true that any computationally complete facility can be used to express any other similar facility --- this is...
... whatever ... This is a very good point. ... OK, this is certainly reasonable. But I like to think of using REST as being something similiar to the using...
... Right, the Web is not a programming language; also the Web != REST. REST, specifics aside, is a computing paradigm (disclosure: I accept the notion of...
... Are you saying the processing style depends on the underlying protocol SOAP is carried over/through? I thought SOAP was supposed to be a protocol. Bill de...
I'm not Lucas. 8-) ... Those two things aren't inconsistent. WebDAV is both a protocol and an HTTP extension. SOAP can be used in the same way. Indeed, this...
... Rethinking problems in terms of resource modelling, I always think of the way that SQL forces you to collapse iterative algorithms into single statements. ...
... ? ... Maybe they're not exclusive, I'm not sure. A (network) protocol is interesting insofar as it's a useful abstraction (of the network). Having to think...
1185
Paul Prescod
paul@...
May 1, 2002 10:29 pm
... Absolutely! ... Key word: "was". Seriously, SOAP may meet some technical definition for "protocol" but I'd say it is really some kind of meta-protocol or...
Is there anything to accomplish via a BOF at ETCON? IE, a convincing agenda?...
1187
Paul Prescod
paul@...
May 1, 2002 10:48 pm
... But WebDAV is only designed to run over HTTP or perhaps over protocols with very HTTP-like characteristics. If you use a WebDAV library you know what to...
1188
Paul Prescod
paul@...
May 1, 2002 11:41 pm
One of the most striking advantages of SOAP over HTTP is the XML Headers with clear intermediary targeting and requirements on understanding. Some thoughts are...
1189
Paul Prescod
paul@...
May 2, 2002 12:37 am
I submitted a description for an ETCON BOF called "Alternative Web Services Architectures". I don't think that in one or two hours we can make huge progress...
... Well put. What are the missing pieces? - discovery (wsdl-style declarative formats, intellisense-tool friendly stuff, etc.) - clients (do we need to write...
