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#328

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:57 pm
Subject: changes to 'honor' words; a new pair of words

lojbaner

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I noticed that "honor" and "reputation, esteem" shared the same word form, so I modified the words for "honor" and related terms:
xetloprofondat honor.
xe'atloprofok dishonorable, disreputable, ignoble.
xe'atloprofondat dishonor.

And a couple of new words:
xezak fair, fair-minded, unbiased.
xe'azak unfair, biased.

stevo

#327

From: "stevo" <MorphemeAddict@...>
Date: Mon Oct 12, 2009 11:46 pm
Subject: changes to classifiers xe- and xe'a-

lojbaner

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The word for "violent" used to be "xetrok". Now it's "sutrok". The opposite has
also changed from "xe'atrok" to "su'atrok".

The reason for the change is that violence is not always associated with living
entities (classifiers "xe-/xe'a-"), as in "violent storms," "violent
collisions". With classifiers "su-/su'a-" it's a performance attribute.

The derived words also changed, of course.
"Violence (process)" is "sutrondet", "violence (event)" is "sutrondot".

A bigger change to classifiers "xe-" and "xe'a-" is that I split each one into
three related classifiers.
"Xe-" used to be 'living entity attribute', and "xe'a-" was 'opposite of living
entity attribute'. Here are the new classifications:

xe: sentient entity attribute [BN]
xe'a: opposite of sentient entity attribute [BN]
xi: attribute of nonsentient creature [BN]
xi'a: opposite of attribute of nonsentient creature [BN]
xo: attribute of other living things [BN]
xo'a: opposite of attribute of other living things [BN]

In general, "xe('a)-" has attributes attributible only to sentient entities,
usually people, but also can be large mammals in general, as well as certain
intelligent other animals such as octopuses and squids. It would also apply to
anything else of comparable brain power, such as aliens and robots.

"Xi('a)-" applies to other living or quasi-living entities/creatures. My typical
example is an insect.

"Xo('a)-" applies to all other forms of life. My typical example is a tree.

The affected words are:

xik sensitive, able to sense, having feeling, not numb.
xigripruk instinctive, inborn.
xigruk able to see colors, not colorblind.
xiguk asleep, sleeping, slumbering.
xigup sleep, slumber, doze, snooze, be asleep.
xigunzap fall asleep, go to sleep, drop off, doze off, drowse off.
xihak seeing, sighted, not blind.
xihandat sight, vision.
xihadrak one-eyed, having only one seeing eye, having only partial vision.
xihasik alert, attentive, on the alert.
xihek (capable of) hearing/not deaf.
xihep hear, be able to hear.
xihik able to smell.
xihok able to taste.
xihuk able to feel, touch.
ximlek uncrippled, not lame.
xipiglek drunk, intoxicated, inebriated.
xisek agile, nimble, spry, fleet.
xislik pregnant, with child, expecting, gravid, in the family way.
xitroflak aggressive, combative, offensive, pugnacious.
xitroxlik fierce, ferocious, vicious, savage.
xixlik invigorated, energized, refreshed, fresh.
xixlinzop invigorate, energize, refresh, freshen.
xi'agripruk learned, acquired, not instinctive, not inborn.
xi'agruk colorblind, unable to see (certain) colors.
xi'aguk awake, up, conscious.
xi'agunzap wake (up), awake(n).
xi'ahak blind, unsighted, unseeing.
xi'ahasik inattentive, heedless, unmindful, unalert, unwary, unwatchful,
unvigilant.
xi'ahek deaf, unhearing.
xi'ahik unable to smell.
xi'ahok unable to taste.
xi'ahuk unable to feel, touch.
xi'amek bald, without hair.
xi'amlek crippled, lame.
xi'amrek prone, lying down, recumbent, prostrate, supine.
xi'amrep lie, be lying/prone/recumbent.
xi'amrenzip lie down, recline, cause oneself to become prone/recumbent.
xi'amreklup lie on one's side, neither prone nor supine.
xi'amrekrup lie face down, lie prone, lie on one's stomach.
xi'amrekup lie face up, lie supine, lie on one's back.
xi'apiglek sober, not intoxicated or inebriated.
xi'asek clumsy, maladroit, bungling, all thumbs.
xi'asenvok awkward, unwieldy, cumbersome, clumsy.
xi'atroflak protective, on guard, defensive, guarding.
xi'axlik tired, weary, fatigued.
xi'axlindat fatigue, exhaustion, weariness, tiredness.
xi'axlinzop tire (out), fatigue, exhaust, weary, make tired.
xokak female.
xokandak feminine.
xoklak gendered, sexual.
xoklandat sex, gender.
xokrak male.
xokrandak masculine.
xopak alive, living.
xopap live, be alive.
xopandat life, vitality, aliveness.
xoplak wild, feral, undomesticated, untamed.
xoprak mortal.
xopuk mature, full-grown, grown-up, developed, [adult].
xopunzap grow (up), develop, mature, ripen, wax.
xosik healthy, hale, robust, in good health.
xosindat health, fitness, well-being [physical].
xosinzop heal, cure, restore to health.
xosliflak fertile, fruitful, able to reproduce.
xotloplak native, indigenous.
xoxlek active, lively, energetic, animated, vivacious, spry, peppy.
xo'ak numb, unfeeling, deadened, insensitive.
xo'aklak asexual, not gendered.
xo'apak dead, lifeless, no longer alive.
xo'apandot death, passing.
xo'apanzap die, pass away/on, expire, lose one's life, meet one's death.
xo'apanzip commit suicide, kill oneself, take one's own life.
xo'apanzop kill, put to death, slay, take the life of, do away with, fell,
strike dead.
xo'aplak tame, domesticated, not feral or wild.
xo'aprak immortal.
xo'apuk immature, undeveloped, in an undeveloped state.
xo'asik sick, ill, unhealthy, ailing, unwell, not healthy.
xo'asliflak sterile, barren, infertile, unable to reproduce.
xo'axlek inactive, lifeless.

stevo

#326

From: "matchejqgfriends" <matchejqgfriends@...>
Date: Sat Sep 19, 2009 4:59 am
Subject: Click here to check out my new photos!

matchejqgfri...

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Click here to check out my new photos!
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#325

From: "matchejqgfriends" <matchejqgfriends@...>
Date: Mon Aug 10, 2009 6:16 pm
Subject: You're Invited!

matchejqgfri...

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You're Invited to join my friends network, check my profile here:
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#324

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Fri Jul 17, 2009 12:48 pm
Subject: Re: New saweli member

lojbaner

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williamtbranch@...:

Yen tapim yarat yasat rat yarik!

stevo

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#323

From: "lojbaner" <MorphemeAddict@...>
Date: Sun Jul 5, 2009 8:30 pm
Subject: yasus sesac zer yarus sesac

lojbaner

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Tuvof yasus sesac yarat fati zok zibik zer gemliti vu'abek zok.
Tu'afruf yarus sesac yarat et wi'aboz mumebot wikug metut yarik.

  tuvof = cut, slash
  yasus sesac = yesterday
  yarat = I
  fat = tree
   zok = a, an, some
  zer = and
  gemlit = branch, limb
  vu'abek = small

  tu'afruf = pull
  yarus sesac = today
  mumebot = street
  wikuz = in front of; wikug = open adjective of "wikuz"
  et = them (from "zer", meaning the things joined by "zer", i.e., fati zok zer
gemliti vu'abek zok"). "at zer et" would work too.
  wi'aboz = near, close to
  metut = house
  yarik = my

Putting "yasus sesac" and "yarus sesac" ahead of the subject 'fronts' them,
giving them more emphasis, just as putting "yesterday" and "today" at the
beginning of a sentence emphasizes them.

stevo

#322

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Mon Jun 22, 2009 5:17 pm
Subject: change in some part-of-speech endings

lojbaner

Offline

I've switched the noun and adverb/case tag endings. Since nouns ended in "s" and were followed by words beginning with "z" (conjunctions and numbers and "zo-" words), it was hard to keep the "s" from merging with the "z".

Nouns now end in "t" (closed) and "d" (open), and adverbs in "s" and case tags in "z".
I expect this change to make it easier to keep the words from merging.

Separating adverbs and case tags may be new here, but it's been in the air a long time.

stevo

#321

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Fri Apr 17, 2009 7:38 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions: if

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/17/2009 07:23:56 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

> zefler = if and only if (Lojban .o)
> zejror = if, logical implication.
> zeslir = if, as long as, provided (that), in the event, on condition, if it
> should happen that, etc.
> zetrur = if, in the possible world that….[Lojban].
> zezor = if, in the alternate world (not this one) that….

I have yet to study Lojban. Could you explain them?

It'll take me a while to track these all down, but I will.

stevo

#320

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Fri Apr 17, 2009 7:37 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/17/2009 07:37:29 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

(Shouldn't "bavasu" be synonymous to "resu bavak", since
human beings are persons?)

In general "resu bavak" ('human person' [generic]) is indeed synonymous with "bavasu" ('human being' [generic]), but in the former there is still an emphasis on personhood, whereas in the latter the emphasis is on the 'primateness'. Thus both terms are valid. "Resu bavak" is a phrase consisting of two words, the meaning of which is just the sum of the meanings of the individual words, so there is no need to include it in the Saweli-English dictionary, although both terms could be given in an English-Saweli dictionary.

stevo

#319

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Fri Apr 17, 2009 7:27 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions: collective groups

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/17/2009 07:49:02 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

stevo wrote:
> Ah, yes, it is strictly members of Carnivora, not just any collection that
> English calls a pack. Each classifier can have this kind of group word. I
> don't really like it, but it's inherited from Latejami, and I haven't
> changed it (yet).

Yes. If the classifier is supposed to always be semantically precise
then it doesn't make sense, since a group of carnivores isn't a kind
of carnivore. What about having "pack/herd/swarm/school of" as a
productive affix? Then it will also be possible to make "pack (of
wolves)" and such words.

--
Veoler

Here's what ram says in section 3.6 of _The Lexical Semantics of a MachineTranslation Interlingua_
http://www.eskimo.com/~ram/lexical_semantics.html

3.6 Mass, Count, and Group Distinctions

Many nouns have separate forms that differentiate between homogeneous entities, individuals, and groups of individuals. These are referred to, respectively, as mass nouns, count nouns, and group nouns. Here are some English examples:

Mass            Count                   Group
---------       -----                   -----
mutton          sheep                   flock
grass           blade of grass          lawn
   ship                    fleet
foliage         leaf
beef            steer                   herd/cattle
hair            hair, strand of hair    wig
rice            grain of rice
guts/flesh      organ                   body
wood            tree                    grove, wood
   map                     atlas
water           drop                    shower

Note that English mass nouns are never used in the plural (*muttons, *beefs), while count and group nouns have both singular and plural versions. (However, some English nouns can have more than one sense; e.g. "hair" and "wood".)

Incidentally, do not confuse group nouns discussed in this section with the abstract noun group class discussed in the previous section. Here, we are referring to natural groupings of any basic noun. The separate group class, however, refers to groups of diverse, sentient elements (typically human, although they could also include or consist of members of intelligent alien species) linked by one or more activities specifically associated with the group. The groups discussed in this section do not imply any specific type of activity. These are physical groupings that describe what a group is - not what it does.

In the noun derivation scheme discussed earlier, some classes contained only count nouns while others contained only mass nouns. Specifically, in the 'matter, non-living' classes, 'substances' are inherently mass nouns, while 'locatives' and 'others' are inherently count nouns.

...

Now, the classificational system provides a mass/count distinction, but it does not provide a group concept. In the interlingua, we will use the modifier morpheme "ku" for this purpose. Also, when creating a group sense from a basic noun concept, "ku" should always be applied to the count derivation, not the mass derivation, so that its class is correctly provided by the classifier.

...

Here are some examples of group nouns:

  kutigi = herd or flock (of mammals such as horses and sheep,
            but not of birds, "-tig" =
            'grazing mammal' classifier)
  kudami = flock (of birds, "-dam" = 'bird' classifier)
  kukagi = swarm (of insects, "-kag" = 'insect' classifier)
  kutimi = fleet ("-tim" = 'vehicle' classifier)kubomi = school (of fish) (, "-bom" = 'fish' classifier)

Note that, unlike English "flock", "kudami" can only be used with birds. For example, we cannot use "kudami" in 'flock of sheep'. Instead, we must use "kutigi".

Group derivations are not semantically precise, even though they may appear so in the above examples. For example, the group noun "atlas" will be formed from "ku" plus the word meaning 'map', even though an atlas can contain much more than just maps.

I suspect that a suffix would be better for this meaning than a modifier, since, as you pointed out, a group of things isn't a kind of one of those things. A separate word (a noun) might be better still, having the general meaning of this kind of homogeneous group. For the time being, though, I shall stick with this modifier.

stevo

#318

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:54 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/17/2009 07:37:29 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

"resu bavak" then? My impression of NSM is that it is a generic noun,
not plural. (Shouldn't "bavasu" be synonymous to "resu bavak", since
human beings are persons?)

It's possible that NSM PEOPLE is generic, rather than plural. I've always had doubts about ram's translation of "humanity" as Latejami "lubecami" (Saweli "bavasu"). Perhaps this difficulty with translating "people" is a symptom.

"People", to me, can include more than humans, although in reality, such non-human people are rare, if they exist. But aliens can be called people, robots and androids can be artificial people. "Data" on Star Trek is a person, although also a machine. So no term with "bavas/bavak" as a component would be broad enough to encompass the meaning of "people", whereas "res" is specifically "person, individual, someone, anyone, sentient being", i.e., not dependent on being human, or even humanoid.
You are right that (all) human beings are persons, but not all persons are human beings.

For now, I still think bare "resu" is best for NSM PEOPLE.

"Nobility" is "resubosi", in the plural, so perhaps "bavasi" would be better for 'humanity'.

stevo

#317

From: Veoler <veoler@...>
Date: Fri Apr 17, 2009 11:47 am
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

veoler@...

stevo wrote:
> Ah, yes, it is strictly members of Carnivora, not just any collection that
> English calls a pack.  Each classifier can have this kind of group word.  I
> don't really like it, but it's inherited from Latejami, and I haven't
> changed it (yet).

Yes. If the classifier is supposed to always be semantically precise
then it doesn't make sense, since a group of carnivores isn't a kind
of carnivore. What about having "pack/herd/swarm/school of" as a
productive affix? Then it will also be possible to make "pack (of
wolves)" and such words.

--
Veoler

#316

From: Veoler <veoler@...>
Date: Fri Apr 17, 2009 11:36 am
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

veoler@...

stevo wrote:
> Okay, then maybe "bavasi zok" (plural) is better for "people".  "Bavasu"
> (generic) means "humanity", which isn't the same as "people".
>
> stevo

"resu bavak" then? My impression of NSM is that it is a generic noun,
not plural. (Shouldn't "bavasu" be synonymous to "resu bavak", since
human beings are persons?)

--
Veoler

#315

From: Veoler <veoler@...>
Date: Fri Apr 17, 2009 11:22 am
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

veoler@...

MorphemeAddict wrote:
> I based these words for "if" on Lojban equivalents.  The Latejami basic word
> for "if" is "citesye" (zeslir) ("if, as long as, provided (that), in the
> event, on condition, if it should happen that, etc.").
>
> zefler = if and only if (Lojban .o)
> zejror = if, logical implication.
> zeslir = if, as long as, provided (that), in the event, on condition, if it
> should happen that, etc.
> zetrur = if, in the possible world that….[Lojban].
> zezor = if, in the alternate world (not this one) that….

I have yet to study Lojban. Could you explain them?

--
Veoler

#314

From: Veoler <veoler@...>
Date: Fri Apr 17, 2009 11:18 am
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

veoler@...

MorphemeAddict wrote:
> (What's "AIUI"?)

"As I Understand/Understood It"

#313

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Fri Apr 10, 2009 2:39 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions: small vs. big

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/10/2009 09:00:51 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

MorphemeAddict wrote:
>> big = vubek.
>> small = vo'amik, vo'amlok, vu'abek.
>
> So "small" is hypernymous to the opposite of "big" in NSM?
>
> I don't understand your question. Could you rephrase it?
> Saweli has several words that translate to "small" (or "little") in English.
> The pair "vubek/vu'abek" seems closest to the NSM to me.

Well, since you put vo'amik, vo'amlok, and vu'abek as translations of
"small", but only vubek as "big", and not vomik and vomlok, which
parallel your translations of "small".

vomik = extensive, sizable, vast, large, big, considerable [in area].
vomlok = capacious, voluminous, roomy, commodious, spacious [in volume].
vubek = big, large, having great size.

So BIG = vubek, and SMALL = vu'abek.

stevo

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#312

From: Veoler <veoler@...>
Date: Fri Apr 10, 2009 12:59 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions: small vs. big

veoler@...

MorphemeAddict wrote:
>> big = vubek.
>> small = vo'amik, vo'amlok, vu'abek.
>
> So "small" is hypernymous to the opposite of "big" in NSM?
>
> I don't understand your question.  Could you rephrase it?
> Saweli has several words that translate to "small" (or "little") in English.
>  The pair "vubek/vu'abek" seems closest to the NSM to me.

Well, since you put vo'amik, vo'amlok, and vu'abek as translations of
"small", but only vubek as "big", and not vomik and vomlok, which
parallel your translations of "small".

--
Veoler

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#311

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Thu Apr 9, 2009 11:31 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/9/2009 22:18:35 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

MorphemeAddict wrote:
>> becis = pack, group of carnivorous animals, especially canines.
>
> Is that explicitly the order Carnivora?
>
>
> No, it's just a pack of animals, all of the same kind, that would be named
> with this classifier.
> Any member of "Carnivora" is "bes", which is now defined as "carnivore,
> member of order Carnivora". "Carnivora" itself is "besu".

I meant, could it refer to a group of sharks or another "pack" where
the individuals were not members of Carnivora, or just for packs of
members of Carnivora?

--
Veoler

Ah, yes, it is strictly members of Carnivora, not just any collection that English calls a pack. Each classifier can have this kind of group word. I don't really like it, but it's inherited from Latejami, and I haven't changed it (yet).

stevo

#310

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Thu Apr 9, 2009 11:29 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/9/2009 22:14:49 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

MorphemeAddict:
> "Bavasu" refers explicitly to people as human animals and means 'humanity',
> not just 'people'.. It is less appropriate than "resu", although it's not
> very different in meaning.

Well, on page 40 in 'Semantics Primes and Universals' it says "all
languages appear to distinguish, in one way or another, between a more
general notion of SOMEONE, or BEING (human or non-human), and a notion
of PEOPLE (necessarily human)." (and you have the book to read the
rest?) So I think it should be included.

--
Veoler

Okay, then maybe "bavasi zok" (plural) is better for "people". "Bavasu" (generic) means "humanity", which isn't the same as "people".

stevo

#309

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Thu Apr 9, 2009 11:22 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions: be

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/9/2009 20:55:01 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

> "Long" is in parentheses because its status as a primitive is still tentative.
> I haven't included "be" above. It is on a list I saw recently, but it's new, and I don't > know what the precise meaning intended for it is.

If I'm not mistaken, "be" in NSM corresponds to "dapa" in Latejami,
well, at least "be (someone/something)" which is on the list, and
"zoga" for "be (somewhere)". But this is guesses.

I don't see "long" on the list anymore.
http://www.une.edu.au/bcss/linguistics/nsm/semantics-in-brief.php
NSM does now have two forms of "be":
be (somewhere) = wib (Latejami "zoga")
be (someone/something) = ?wugib (Latejami ?"dapa")

Latejami "dapa" (Saweli "wugib") [P/F-s] - be, be equal to, be the same as.

I'm not sure that "dapa/wugib" is a good equivalent for "be (someone/something)", but I don't see anything better either.

stevo

#308

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Thu Apr 9, 2009 11:08 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/9/2009 20:55:01 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

> the same = wugik.
> other = wu'agig.

Is -g an adjective suffix?

Yes, it's the open adjective suffix, equivalent to Latejami "yu". I have some concerns about the words above not have the same adjective ending. In any case, wu'agik (the closed adjective form) would also be correct, perhaps better, since it doesn't imply an object.

stevo

#307

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Thu Apr 9, 2009 11:06 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions: this = yarik

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/9/2009 20:55:01 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

> this = yarik.

And yaris? Today before I saw your post I thought to ask you about if
NSM "this" corresponds to yarstik/yarstis, yarik/yaris, yarsik/yarsis,
or yartik/yartis. What do you think? I guess yarik/yaris since you
wrote that.

Actually, "yaris" is the noun form of "yarik", but the NSM form seems to be more adjective than noun.
In any case, I think both "yarik" and "yaris" match NSM "this". The part of speech isn't that important in NSM.

stevo

#306

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Thu Apr 9, 2009 11:02 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions: a long time

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/9/2009 20:55:01 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

> (long) = vomek, vosak.

If "vosak" were part of the NSM, wouldn't then "a long time" be
reduced to long+time?

Not according to Wierzbicka (_Semantics: Primes and Universals_, pp. 97-99).
Same for "a short time".

stevo

#305

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Thu Apr 9, 2009 10:58 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions: small vs. big

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/9/2009 20:55:01 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

> big = vubek.
> small = vo'amik, vo'amlok, vu'abek.

So "small" is hypernymous to the opposite of "big" in NSM?

I don't understand your question. Could you rephrase it?
Saweli has several words that translate to "small" (or "little") in English. The pair "vubek/vu'abek" seems closest to the NSM to me.

stevo

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#304

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Thu Apr 9, 2009 10:55 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions: zik

lojbaner

Offline

In a message dated 4/9/2009 20:55:01 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

> some = zik, zibik, zok.

I don't find "zik" in the lexicon.

"Zik" is the first word beginning with "zi-". Part-of-speech endings are ignored in ordering the words alphabetically.

zik = any, some, an unspecified quantity or amount.

stevo

#303

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Thu Apr 9, 2009 10:54 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

lojbaner

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In a message dated 4/9/2009 20:55:01 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

> if = zefler, zejror, zeslir, zetrur, zezor.

Isn't "zefler" to specific? And "zezor" is the negative version(?).

Could you explain the meaning and usage of zejror, zeslir and zetrur?

I based these words for "if" on Lojban equivalents. The Latejami basic word for "if" is "citesye" (zeslir) ("if, as long as, provided (that), in the event, on condition, if it should happen that, etc.").

zefler = if and only if (Lojban .o)
zejror = if, logical implication.
zeslir = if, as long as, provided (that), in the event, on condition, if it should happen that, etc.
zetrur = if, in the possible world that….[Lojban].
zezor = if, in the alternate world (not this one) that….

stevo

#302

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Thu Apr 9, 2009 10:49 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

lojbaner

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In a message dated 4/9/2009 20:55:01 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

> touching = wifud, wimid.

Is "wimid" also above? Or what's the difference?

"Above" is "wikod". "Wimid" is "on (the surface of), upon, in contact with and supported by", which is a limited subset of 'touching'.
The same applies to "wifud" (against, resting or up against, in contact with).

I couldn't find a simple equivalent of "touching", and I may have to invent a word just for it.

stevo

#301

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Thu Apr 9, 2009 10:45 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

lojbaner

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In a message dated 4/9/2009 20:55:01 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

> go = tisep.

"go/proceed", so does it mean to "walk" minus the means to travel, as
"went" in "I went home"? Or as in "it goes on and on"?

'Walk' is "timep". Neither "tisep" nor "timep" could normally be used in "it goes on and on", which would likely be a form of "continue" ("ye'unyab" - continue (on), remain ongoing).

In "I went home" either "tisep" or "timep" would work, but "timep" specifically means 'walk', so it would be inaccurate if you went home any way but on foot.

stevo

#300

From: MorphemeAddict@...
Date: Thu Apr 9, 2009 10:41 pm
Subject: Re: NSM and other questions

lojbaner

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In a message dated 4/9/2009 20:55:01 Eastern Daylight Time, veoler@... writes:

> move = winzob, winzyob (tr.), xusep (intr.).

AIUI, "move" in NSM means "xusep". But that's mostly a guess.

I wasn't sure what the NSM term meant, so I included both the transitive and intransitive.
In _Semantics: Primes and Universals_, p. 83, Wierzbicka says:
"The prototypical examples of MOVE in the intended sense can be found in sentences such as the following ones:

      I see something is moving (in this place).
      I can't move.
      Something moved inside me."

These are all intransitive, so "xusep" would be the only equivalent, but I still have doubts whether it's the best (or only) word, since "xusep" is 'move, be in motion'.
(What's "AIUI"?)

stevo