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Marinescu on giving SOAP-bashing a REST   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #2019 of 13957 |
Re: [service-orientated-architecture] Marinescu on giving SOAP-bashing a REST


It's unfortunate that we're still reading articles like this, where the
author has clearly not followed the discussion very closely at all, and
as a result, continues to perpetuate common misunderstandings which only
take away from the important technical aspects of the discussion.

More in-line ...

On Mon, Apr 04, 2005 at 03:16:29PM -0000, Gervas Douglas wrote:
> So what really is the difference between the two approaches, and which
> should you use? What SOAP has that REST doesn't, is a set of standard
> meta data about the message being sent. This meta data is intended to
> be used by Web service tools and infrastructure. In the REST example,
> the message sent during a Web service invocation only consists of the
> application-specific XML. However, using SOAP, that same Web service
> invocation would contain both the XML message but also a special
> header section where standard metadata about the message would be
> stored.

HTTP messages contain headers too;

http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec4.html#sec4.2

> The SOAP vs. REST debate then should not be a discussion of WHICH, but
> rather, WHERE. Each has their place.

Now this, I largely agree with. IMO, the place for Web services is
behind the firewall, while the place for REST is both in front and
behind the firewall.

> REST is perfectly fine for simple
> request response exchanges between two partners, but once you start
> getting into enterprise level integration scenarios where you have
> multiple systems to integrate, security and choreography challenges to
> be aware of, SOAP is an essential standard that tools like integration
> servers, Enterprise Service Buses (ESBs), Business Process Management
> (BPM) systems and other integration solutions rely on.

Does the author have any technical evidence to back up the implicit
claim that REST is not suitable for use by those systems? State
transfer based styles (e.g. EDI) have been used for business integration
for many years.

Cheers,

Mark.
--
Mark Baker. Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA. http://www.markbaker.ca






Tue Apr 5, 2005 5:03 am

gonga_thrash
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Message #2019 of 13957 |
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Here is a brief article I received by e-mail: ===================================================================== Take a REST on all the SOAP Bashing! [Floyd...
Gervas Douglas
gervasdouglas
Offline Send Email
Apr 4, 2005
3:19 pm

Counter point... ... Sending 'design time' info at 'run time' is terminally bad for performance. ... Tools info should stay with the tools, not transmitted N...
John Pritchard
ecensity
Offline Send Email
Apr 4, 2005
4:28 pm

... That's pretty much the value proposition of XML in a nutshell -- labels (tags, attribute names, namespace information) is sent around along with the data....
Michael Champion
mcraigchampion
Offline Send Email
Apr 5, 2005
8:13 am

Another counter point... SOAP doesn't send "design time" metadata with messages. WSDL and XML Schema metadata is typically used by tools at development time to...
Anne Thomas Manes
annemanes
Offline Send Email
Apr 5, 2005
8:16 am

... Wow Anne, I'm totally blown away. Very nicely said ... I certainly agree that one can build enterprise-scale apps with SOA. Heck, I used to do it many...
Mark Baker
gonga_thrash
Online Now Send Email
Apr 5, 2005
3:33 pm

... <distobj@a...> ... extremely ... point you ... "Internet-scale" ... than ... spot ... to ... CORBA ... This is a pretty amazing agreement - great to see....
stilkov
Offline Send Email
Apr 5, 2005
5:01 pm

... Well at least :o) In REST context the description of some 'service' isn't an issue, because the service tells the client at run time what options there...
Jan Algermissen
algermissen1971
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Apr 5, 2005
5:19 pm

... That's a very good point, Stefan. But, WSDL can be used to describe uniform interfaces, so it isn't without its own flaws. I guess I prefer "REST vs....
Mark Baker
gonga_thrash
Online Now Send Email
Apr 6, 2005
12:39 pm

... As I've argued for a long time, SOA is not a new idea and indeed can involve interface constraints (but doesn't have to). There seems to be some argument ...
David Forslund
dwforslund
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Apr 6, 2005
5:25 pm

... I think that many businesses are creating such small, integrated SOAs that they really should capitalize on bandwidth reduction and development and...
Gregg Wonderly
w5ggw
Offline Send Email
Apr 5, 2005
4:29 pm

It's unfortunate that we're still reading articles like this, where the author has clearly not followed the discussion very closely at all, and as a result,...
Mark Baker
gonga_thrash
Online Now Send Email
Apr 5, 2005
8:15 am
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