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New Photo: Chicago Tribune cartoon from 1934   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #14421 of 14802 |
Re: Probably a Japanese car with a hydrogen fuel cell | RE: [Skeptics Forum] Re: Discussion topics, politics, etc.



On 7/1/2009 12:02 AM, James Scott Taylor wrote:
>
>
>
> * Here's something I am skeptical about http://tinyurl.com/452dmu
> <http://tinyurl.com/452dmu>
>
> This car probably uses water derived hydrogen created by a chemical reaction
> in the form of a hydrogen fuel cell in order to convert the input water
> eventually into electrical current.

They aren't saying how it's done, so it's basically impossible to tell
which version of nonsense it is.


> Nothing new there or to be skeptical
> about really

They claim that the range is limited only by how much water you have.
That's something to be skeptical about, since whatever they are doing
must be consuming something else, perhaps some other chemical onboard.

They admit that the car is not cheap, but they imply (almost certainly
incorrectly) that nothing is consumed except water.

[snip]

> I always thought a hydrogen gas powered car would be interesting. You'd
> plug your car into a home plug for an electrical source at night during off
> peak hours and use the electrolysis method to convert some water into
> hydrogen gas for fuel the next day. Then burn that hydrogen gas in the car
> pistons for short there and back again trips. But I don't know how
> expensive the electrolysis process would be (along with the electrolysis
> support chemicals and hydrogen collection mechanism).

My impression is that this isn't efficient. You are starting with
electricity, making hydrogen, and then using that hydrogen to move the
car. You could more easily (and more efficiently) simply charge up your
electric car. Electric cars have limited range, but so do present day
hydrogen cars, so there isn't any clear advantage of a hydrogen car over
an electric car. With likely improvements in the next couple of decades
. . . electric cars still win.

Eric Carlson




Wed Jul 1, 2009 1:03 pm

ecarlson2002
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Message #14421 of 14802 |
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I added a new photo to the forum under miscellaneous. Is history repeating? Murray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]...
Murray Voight
wmvoight
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Jun 21, 2009
5:14 am

Dear Murray, This is not the forum to simply make bald political statements without any tie-in to true skepticism. Are you trying to say this cartoon deserves...
Lloyd Davidson
Ldavids100
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Jun 21, 2009
3:08 pm

I am very skeptical that govt. spending is going to help America. I don't care what party is doing the spending. Shoveling money out the back of the wagon is...
Murray Voight
wmvoight
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Jun 21, 2009
6:55 pm

Dear Murray, Sorry, as much as I would love to debate you, this is not a political discussion group and I won't be suckered into countering such absurdly...
Lloyd Davidson
Ldavids100
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Jun 21, 2009
8:11 pm

Economics is a bit outside this forum. As I assume you are aware, money is essentially a construct, and therefore there is effectively no limit on it. You...
Eric Carlson
ecarlson2002
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Jun 21, 2009
8:14 pm

Erick Carlson wrote: Economics is a bit outside this forum. As I assume you are aware, money is essentially a construct, and therefore there is effectively no...
Murray Voight
wmvoight
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Jun 22, 2009
3:18 am

I'm way behind in emails, but I had to comment. When I saw the cartoon, I assumed that you were making fun of the cartoonist. Heh, heh. It's hard to imagine...
William C. Garthright
billg4
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Jun 29, 2009
3:10 am

I didn't say political discussions were OK on this Skeptics Group. I said political discussions were NOT OK. If I want left-wing crap I'll watch MSNBC. If I...
Joe Needham
jneedham
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Jun 29, 2009
3:32 am

Dear Joe, Your peculiar diatribe, below, certainly calls out for some sort of moderating response. I don't listen much to MSNBC, since I get most of my news...
Lloyd Davidson
Ldavids100
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Jun 30, 2009
12:25 pm

... OK. You might have noted that when this was first posted, then. I wouldn't have replied. Bill -- I'm learning real skills that I can apply throughout the...
William C. Garthright
billg4
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Jun 30, 2009
2:02 pm

We should just skip the posting of political cartoon stuff, period. There is no point in it since that type of cartoon is tripe due to its very overt ...
James Scott Taylor
tennisstarstuff
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Jul 1, 2009
7:55 am

... Absolutely right. So what? You're not really claiming that all debt is bad, are you? Have you never borrowed money yourself? Debt can be good or bad....
William C. Garthright
billg4
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Jun 29, 2009
3:27 am

Dr. Davidson, I choose not to take offence to your personal attacks and wrong assumptions. This discussion has pleaded the need to discuss paradigms. I will...
Murray Voight
wmvoight
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Jun 22, 2009
6:40 am

Fellows, ... I have been unable to find any personal attacks in Dr. Davidson's last email. Although there is a fragment where he uses strong words (e.g. ...
WorldScientific
forma_y_fondo
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Jun 22, 2009
9:14 pm

I used the dictionary definition of paradigm: 2. *model that forms basis of something: *an example that serves as a pattern or model for something, especially...
Murray Voight
wmvoight
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Jun 22, 2009
10:33 pm

Fellows, Murray, ... 1) Which dictionary is that? 2) According to the Merrian Webster dictionary: paradigm 1: example, pattern; especially: an outstandingly...
WorldScientific
forma_y_fondo
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Jun 23, 2009
12:34 am

Dear Murray, My email program, Thunderbird, notified me, with a flame stamp as well, that it "thinks this (i.e. your) message is junk." I'll keep my own view ...
Lloyd Davidson
Ldavids100
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Jun 23, 2009
1:39 am

Cynics don't think people are lying, they're just think people are motivated by selfishness or are bitter and pessimistic about certain subjects. Why are you...
Anne
brownzig152
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Jun 30, 2009
12:54 pm

Hi Anne, Being a cynic on a particular topic, e.g. I'm cynical about the honesty of many hedge fund managers, is not the same as being cynical about ALL news...
Lloyd Davidson
Ldavids100
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Jun 30, 2009
1:12 pm

Hi Lloyd, To me, it seems obvious he was having a bad moment and did use MSNBC and FIX news in a blanket statement and really...do we need to pick it apart?...
Anne
brownzig152
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Jun 30, 2009
1:20 pm

Joe is the owner of the list, and gets to make the rules for the list. As I've said before, skepticism naturally overlaps with politics, but this list is...
Eric Carlson
ecarlson2002
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Jun 30, 2009
1:52 pm

"Please keep the political messages to a minimum" is understood by several members of the group as "post all the political messages you like". Sometimes...
Joe Needham
jneedham
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Jun 30, 2009
2:29 pm

... You have to strip the period off the end to get the link to work: http://tinyurl.com/452dmu From wikipedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water-fueled_car ...
Eric Carlson
ecarlson2002
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Jun 30, 2009
2:58 pm

* Here's something I am skeptical about http://tinyurl.com/452dmu This car probably uses water derived hydrogen created by a chemical reaction in the form...
James Scott Taylor
tennisstarstuff
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Jul 1, 2009
7:56 am

... They aren't saying how it's done, so it's basically impossible to tell which version of nonsense it is. ... They claim that the range is limited only by...
Eric Carlson
ecarlson2002
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Jul 1, 2009
1:06 pm
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