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TagSoup and the (X)HTML(5) controversy   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #704 of 1386 |
Re: [tagsoup-friends] Re: TagSoup and the (X)HTML(5) controversy

henrysthompson scripsit:

> Understood. I guess what I am thinking about is not shipping some
> events straightaway, but stacking them for a bit until the right move
> is clear -- sort of a 'shift-ship' processor, c.f. 'shift-reduce'. . .

I stated the constraint badly: I can and do postpone SAX events,
but not character events, since they are unbounded in size. They
at least must be released to the application in real time.
Consequently, a start-tag can at most be postponed until the next
characters event, and in practice there is not much point in doing
even that.

HTML5, however, exposes the varying state of the tree throughout;
an application may examine a new element's parent pointer at one point,
find one value, and then examine it after new events have been processed
and find a different value. The very nature of SAX events prohibits
that degree of flexibility.

> I think that's at least a partial 'no' to my question. Contrast the
> tokeniser with the remedier, if I can call it that. The tokeniser is
> table-driven, and _also_ available to modify in the form of a
> finite-state transducer. The remedier is not available in quite the
> same way. . . I think I'll have a look at making it more so, along
> the lines of the 'shift-ship' idea -- anyone else interested?

I think the distinction is that you have a theory for tokenizers,
although mine is not quite a strict one -- there are some higher-level
interferences from the parser.

There is no theory for the rectifier yet, though there is a high-level
description of what it does in the TagSoup presentation at
http://tagsoup.info/tagsoup.odp (also .ppt and .pdf). Nevertheless,
the description of HTML is a declarative one.

> By which you mean, add some more decoration to keep <table> from
> auto-closing?

It wouldn't be specific to table elements -- nothing in the rectifier
knows anything at all about particular HTML elements. Rather, it's
a matter of when to check the closeMode attribute in the TSSL.

> Curious to know if the above-mooted change provokes any (bad)
> regressions therein. . .

So am I. The difficulty is that without a standard to go by, every
discrepancy has to be examined by hand to see if it is a regression
or a "progression".

--
There is / One art John Cowan <cowan@...>
No more / No less http://www.ccil.org/~cowan
To do / All things
With art- / Lessness -- Piet Hein



Sun Mar 4, 2007 7:26 pm

johnwcowan
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Message #704 of 1386 |
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The W3C Technical Architecture Group has an open issue (http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html?type=1#TagSoupIntegration-54) on the relationship of HTML, XHTML...
henrysthompson
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Mar 2, 2007
3:34 pm

... John Cowan has such a set in his personal possession. However since it's taken from real world web pages, distributing it would involve massive copyright...
Elliotte Harold
elharo@...
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Mar 2, 2007
4:17 pm

... AFAIK TagSoup and the HTML5 spec are the only contenders. TagSoup has the constraint "quod scripsit, scripsit": it cannot recall SAX events and issue new...
John Cowan
johnwcowan
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Mar 3, 2007
8:45 pm

... The HTML 5 spec. is not what I would call declarative -- discursive, more like it. ... Understood. I guess what I am thinking about is not shipping some ...
henrysthompson
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Mar 4, 2007
6:01 pm

... I stated the constraint badly: I can and do postpone SAX events, but not character events, since they are unbounded in size. They at least must be...
John Cowan
johnwcowan
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Mar 4, 2007
7:32 pm

It's been a long time for me, but doesn't the main verb need to be pluperfect, and the clause in the subjunctive? Quod scripserit, scripserat. ... From:...
Klotz, Leigh
leighklotz
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Mar 5, 2007
10:08 pm

... Well, in the Vulgate Pilate says "Quod scripsi, scripsi" = "What I have written, I have written", when the Jews ask him to take down the sign saying "Jesus...
John Cowan
johnwcowan
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Mar 5, 2007
10:49 pm

I guess attempting to correct the bible is pretty much a definition of hubris. Sorry for the distraction. ... From: tagsoup-friends@yahoogroups.com ...
Klotz, Leigh
leighklotz
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Mar 6, 2007
12:18 am
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