This is a VTA post from Sat Dec 9, 2000 H W Jackson has a better way
of defining the B vs H relationship, which I will mention later HDN

Jim Uban <uban@w...> wrote:
> I'm taking the liberty to copy a few of Graham's
> posts on jlnlabs over
> here, which relate to self-oscillating or "buzzing"
> magnets...
>
> --- In jlnlabs@egroups.com, "Graham Gunderson"
> <infinitenergy@h...>
I have seeming differences with these definitions and
wanted to indicate the way elementary classical
physics was defined to me for those definitions, so
several comments are made here...
> There are two defined "fields" (vectors) in any
> permanent magnet. One
> is called the B-field, which is just the external
> field of the magnet.
> The other is called the "H-field", which is really
> not a field at all,
Units of a B vs H curve found in Sears Zemansky
University Physics indicate B expressed as flux
density as Webers/sq Meter, but the horizontal values
of H are noted in units as ampere/meter. I found that
H definition very bothersome, and went back to
ascertain the unit of Induction. Most know that in the
fifties a honorary unit was named the tesla after
Nikola T. by the IEEE, where in fact Tesla had been
vice president from 1892-1894. In fact the
standardization process of electrical terms have taken
quite some evolvement since Tesla. The American
Standard Definitions of Electrical Terms was not
published until 1941, preceeded by efforts from 1928
to establish standards. The first edition of the IEEE
Standard Dictionary of Electrical and Electronic Terms
did not appear until 1972.

The mks unit of magnetic induction B,(which is a
vector quantity) is one tesla= one newton per
ampere-meter, hence the unit of magnetic flux is one
newton-meter per ampere. The unit of 1 NM/A is named
after Wilhelm Weber(1804-1890). The magnetic
induction equals the flux per unit area across an area
at right angles to the magnetic field. Since the unit
of flux is 1 weber, the unit of induction,1 tesla, is
equal to 1 weber /square meter. The magnetic
induction B is often referred to as the flux density.
(Univ. Phys.-pg 428)
> and just indicates the nature and degree of magnetic
> *polarization*
> within the material. That is, H represents the
> overall domain
> alignment, which is really defined by the walls that
> form individual
> domains.
This is a subject that initially I thought easy to
make a distintion between B and H by the mere units
made to formulate them. However further inspection
reveals this is not an easy digression at all. What
seems to be the defining point is how we initially
equate a force with an amperage. In the mks system the
ampere is defined as follows from pg 453;
One ampere is that unvarying current which, if
present in each of two parallel conductors of infinite
length and one meter apart in empty space, causes each
conductor to experience a force of exactly 2*
10^(-7)newton per meter of length.
To decipher the meaning of the ampere-meter, this
seems to sum it up on pg.427;
The magnitude of the B vector at any point can be
defined by the equation F=qvB sin (phi),where q is the
magnitude of a moving charge at the point, v is the
magnitude of its velocity, and phi is the angle
between v and the direction of the field. The mks
unit of B is therefore one newton per (coulomb meter
per second). But one coulomb per second equals one
ampere, so the unit can be expressed as one newton per
ampere meter. This unit is called one tesla

Lastly I have the scribbles from a 1975 physics course
at Kent State from the old standard tattered physics
text, Sears & Zemansky, University Physics;

Magnemotive force (mmf) = total force that produces
magnetic flux. B is expressed as the magnetic
induction, or flux density. If we know the total flux,
the density must be that value divided by the interior
area or A. Thus this first method gives the magnetic
interaction with those first two dimensions to
determine the density. The English unit of mmf is the
Ampere-turn, the equivalent cgs (centimeter/gram
second) unit is named the Gilbert, where the
conversion ratio is shown by 1 Gilbert=.796 Amp turns,
and conversely 1 amp turn= 1.25 Gilbert.
The field intensity or H is the force per unit length
of flux path. We are simply now applying the
definition of B for 3 dimensional space, where in the
English system this is made as amp-turns/inch. The cgs
equivalent is the Gilbert/cm, named the Oersted. 1
Oersted= 2.02 amp-turns/inch. These definitions may be
simplistic as they were made for future reference back
then.

Around the early 80's I also attended Akron State Univ
after dropping out, but the different text from that
same Elementary Classical Physics course does not seem
to deal with H at all, as the other text did. In the
early 90's I purchased another Physics text,(Physics
for Scientists and Engineers) in which the following
is noted on pg 654;

We have named B the magnetic field and H the magnetic
intensity. These names are not universal. Sometimes B
is called the magnetic flux density and H is called
the magnetic field. Admittedly, the terminology is
confusing, and universal adoption of a single set of
terminology is unlikely in the near future.
Fortunately, the usage of the symbols B and H as we
have defined them is nearly universal. Thus the
calculation of a magnetic force on a moving charge or
a current nearly always involves B; similarly H is the
appropriate field in Ampere's Law.

It has cost me a bit of time to try and understand
that thing with Amperes law, as I did not pay
attention then, and integrals need that concept of
summation. I think it can be summed up by guessing
that a linear relationship is made between the amount
of magnetic field B obtained at a certain distance r
away from a conductor of i current. This becomes a
ratio, where a constant is derived. That constant is
known as the permeability of free space,mu(0) or k
determined by the equation (B)(2*pi*r)=k*i

What it seems to be is that B/H= the permeability
constant k, which of course also changes with core
material. To end this long post this is from pg 491
concerning ferromagnetics;
Iron,nickel,cobalt and gadolinium are the only
ferromagnetic materials at room temperature. Because
of the complicated relation between the flux density B
and the magnetic intensity H in a ferromagnetic
material, it is not possible to express B as an
analytical function of H.{Note; I assume the
analytical equation with k=1 then does always apply
with a non saturable air core inductor} Instead the
relation between these quantites is represented by a
graph of B vs H, called the magnetization curve of a
material. The permeability, equal to the B/H ratio {is
not constant for that material.}


For some 1913 references from Henry L Transtroms
"Electricity at High freq" towards how the fundamental
electrical units were formed see Transtrom Extraction
at my new message board, this was formed after inside
the web lost two years of former entrees! I have been
able to dimly light neons by allowing contact to a
hf/hv process to ceramic magnets of 4 X 6 X 1 inches,
where only 8 speaker wire winds were employed as
surrounding collector or secondary, the principle
seems sound for collecting this from oscillating
ferrites. I beleive the best approach to simply
resonate the magnets would be to incorporate
themselves as plated capacitors in the circuit, where
the magnets measured plated capacitance is calculated
to be the desired capacitance to be used in a hf
secondary action, most probably by an Oudin approach
where the secondary and primary are connected.
Applying this idea to an automotive alternator is
useful as higher frequency inputs can be used.
Successful tests have made where the AC modified
alternator sending in 19 volts @ 188 hz can make a
resonant air core voltage rise in two stages to
produce a 4 inch neon discharge between phases: known
to require over 300 volts for discharge. I would
suggest others to spend the time to make a simple AC
conversion of this type, but what becomes problematic
is the fact that everything must be done in 3 fold
expense. I expect next year to place magnets in the
circuit. For now the second stage larger voltage
amplication coils need to be fine tuned to try to get
all 3 neons to discharge between phases. Then another
3rd magnifier addition can be added to try to produce
the effects of a three phase tesla coil. It is
generally only a component at the higher frequency L
values that will have a C value high enough to
resonate with it. The magnetic C values I obtained
were only made by LCR meter measurement, generally
about 300 pf per wafer, so for typical arrangements
only a portion of the magnet could be used. Of course
a variac input supply is essential as to only trickle
the available input, as this is very out there as to
how much the magnets can take before damage. I can
report that I exposed them OUTSIDE the HF circuit by
24 square inch area contact to a 10,000 volt HF AC
process, and the 8 winds of speaker wire around 3
wafered magnets affected a 24 inch argon bulb in dim
disharge, the 7 inch bulbs should also do far better.

Sincerely HDN