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massive infringement (was: Veoh Transcoding Feeds...)   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #38018 of 76347 |
The thing with Veoh is only the latest example of something that has
been pretty rampant and very troubling with many of the new "Flickrs
of video" -- and that's the institutional disregard for copyright and
the massive amount of infringement that is tolerated.

Veoh just set up an automated infringement process that seems targeted
towards videobloggers since it utilizes RSS. But many of these other
services include a lot of infringing content pulled from TV and other
places on the web. They do not automate this process, but instead they
hide behind their terms of use and say they are not liable for what
users happen to post. I've heard as much as 65% of the content on
YouTube comes from TV. This is very different from Flickr where over
90% of the images are uploaded by original creators.

So, I'm calling bullshit on this. Infringement is not a viable
business practice, and it is not possible to continue claiming
ignorance and paying lip service to "respecting copyright."

If you are getting millions of views to a clip owned and produced by
NBC-Universal, then you know you are infringing the rights of another
entity and benefitting from such actions. Its the same for NBC as it
is for any videoblogger.

Moreover, I would bet that much of the infringing content comes from a
relatively small proportion of users who can be easily tracked... take
HH32 for example on vSocial:
<http://www.vsocial.com/user/?d=451#pagekeep::p,new::b,NewContext::g,1>

Here's a user who's uploaded over 800 clips and generated over 3
million remote views. Over 95% of this user's uploaded content comes
from television. Some of it is clips from TV news, but most of it is
the Simpsons, Family Guy, South Park, Daily Show, and Colbert Report.
How is it possible that this user continues to have an account at
vSocial? Shouldn't this user be banned from the service as s/he is
repeatedly using vSocial for infringing purposes?

If you're vSocial, you probably sit back and smile at the amount of
views this one user is generating, which is obviously a benefit to
your service and pumping up your Alexa rankings. Who knows when this
user is going to uncover the next viral "Lazy Sunday" video? Oh, if
only we had more users like HH32! Heck, I don't put it past YouTube
and some others to be paying or specifically rewarding/encouraging
users to engage in this type of activity. Maybe they could win a free
iPod!

Now, I'm happy to watch South Park as much as the next 27 year old
guy. But that doesn't make it right for these companies to host and
distribute content for which they do not have permission... maybe they
should talk to South Park's syndicate and I'm sure they'd be happy to
cut a deal, though it might cost a pretty penny.

So, the argument is not simply limited to Veoh and the videoblogging
community. But I think something needs to be done about businesses
(some well-funded, I might add) who regularly engage in these
practices. It gives us all a bad name.

-Josh



Sat Apr 8, 2006 5:28 pm

joshkinberg
Online Now Online Now
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Message #38018 of 76347 |
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The thing with Veoh is only the latest example of something that has been pretty rampant and very troubling with many of the new "Flickrs of video" -- and...
Joshua Kinberg
joshkinberg
Online Now Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
5:28 pm

And just to hammer home the point at how easy it is to track down these infringing uses... look at HH32 on vSocial, and then check out that user's network of ...
Joshua Kinberg
joshkinberg
Online Now Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
5:39 pm

So what is the answer? More RIAA and MPAA lawsuits? I'm not excusing it, but if these people are banned on vSocial, they'll just move somewhere else. The genie...
T.Whid
twhid
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
5:47 pm

typing too fast.. in my last email I meant to say in the last line: Maybe the US judicial system will ban Flash since it's allowing all this infringement ;-) ...
T.Whid
twhid
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
5:49 pm

Hello, I remember that there was talk of banning all P2P technology,... and then they realized that the underlying Internet itself was a P2P technology :-) See...
Charles Iliya Krempeaux
supercanadian@...
Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
6:33 pm

News of privacies death has been exaggerated; it's alive and well. -- Enric ... <http://www.vsocial.com/user/?d=1397#pagekeep::p,new::b,NewContext::g,1> ... ...
Enric
iragilac
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
5:53 pm

And living in a cabin in Montanna. ... On Apr 8, 2006, at 1:52 PM, Enric wrote: News of privacies death has been exaggerated; it's alive and well. -- Enric ......
Michael Meiser
mmeiser8
Offline Send Email
Apr 9, 2006
9:10 pm

I don't think looking the other way is a good solution. Yes, a user could get a new email address and start again, or move on to another service and do the...
Joshua Kinberg
joshkinberg
Online Now Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
5:58 pm

But it may be these web sites only option if they are going to provide tools to allow users to upload videos. Once one institutes a policy of policing every...
T.Whid
twhid
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
6:10 pm

Please, its dead easy to recognize where most of the infringement occurs and to cut it down. Simply banning the accounts of those users would likely eliminate...
Joshua Kinberg
joshkinberg
Online Now Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
6:23 pm

Not only is it in their interest not to remove an infringing video because of the traffic it gives them, but it's also probably legally ass-covering not to...
T.Whid
twhid
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
6:31 pm

... If Fox thought it should be removed, wouldn't they have requested it? Could it be that Family Guy or Fox hasn't requested them to take it down maybe...
Adam Quirk
cassiusbulle...
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
6:36 pm

It could be that Fox (or whomever owns the rights to Family Guy) is deliberately looking the other way too. Or it could be that in fact vSocial has a specific...
Joshua Kinberg
joshkinberg
Online Now Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
6:56 pm

This is a strange argument and my feelings on copyrights are still developing but have changed alot over the last year while watching everything that is going...
andrew michael baron
hamletphase
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
8:40 pm

For me, the problem is that the videos of mine that Veoh has are videos that I made to advertise my wifes business. On the original posts on my site, I put a...
David Howell
taoofdavid65
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
8:51 pm

Ok, fair enough. Instead of rejecting the sytem though, why not use the system to be more creative and effective in advertising? For instance, if you made an...
andrew michael baron
hamletphase
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
8:57 pm

Coulds, shoulds, and woulds. The fact is that I didnt. The fact is that the videos are my property. The fact is that Veoh is using my content to make money. If...
David Howell
taoofdavid65
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
9:07 pm

FWIW, I put some of my video on Veoh ages ago, and checked back recently when I started my comparison test page. Seeing all the ruckus in here, I checked this...
Deirdre Straughan
deirdrebs2002
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
9:14 pm

... Veoh is making money off of your advertisement? Thats kinda weird. ... YouTube does it. Google does it. Yahoo does it. ... The point is, if you did that,...
andrew michael baron
hamletphase
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
9:19 pm

... Money from investors. ... Just because 100 people jump off a bridge doesnt make it a good idea. Just because the majority of people that drive speed,...
David Howell
taoofdavid65
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
9:45 pm

if someone is receiving your work in it's entirety on Veoh, why, even if you have linkbacks placed in your videos, would they go back to your site? they are...
Anne Walk
pomoartchick
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
9:12 pm

I think that this thread is pointed toward YouTube and iFilm as well. I was just using the example of vSocial to point out how easy it is to discover and ban...
Joshua Kinberg
joshkinberg
Online Now Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
8:56 pm

... So how did SNL lose out when Veoh hosted their clips? Because people could not get back to the SNL website? Yea, its lame and this is why Veoh doesn't have...
andrew michael baron
hamletphase
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
9:03 pm

Well, veoh just removed my Tech Alley feed that I asked them to take out. So it looks like they're following our requests. -- Enric...
Enric
iragilac
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
9:07 pm

... Because SNL's content is owned by a corporate entity who is in the business of licensing that content to other people in exchange for money. Whenever you...
Joshua Kinberg
joshkinberg
Online Now Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
9:21 pm

Let's also not forget that it is a right of the content owner to *not* allow someone to use their content if desired. This is the same as the "opt in" argument...
Joshua Kinberg
joshkinberg
Online Now Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
9:27 pm

It's more complicated than you're making it sound Josh. I've heard reports that folks at certain networks were uploading video to these services at the same...
T.Whid
twhid
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
9:50 pm

FireAnt doesn't so much play by the rules as it plays outside the rules. While the FireANT directory may flag vlogs that predominantly re-purposed commercial...
Josh Wolf
lifeinlowerh...
Online Now Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
10:06 pm

... That doesn't seem to be the case with the examples we're talking about here. Independent content needs a blog and some hosting. Available for free or about...
Michael Verdi
filmguy1105
Offline Send Email
Apr 8, 2006
10:22 pm
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